DIYstompboxes.com

Hi,
After a recent request I posted a veroboard layout of the original 80:s RAT in my gallery - no mods, no frills, just the classic dist box. The layout will fit in a b-sized box with a little work. I posted a sound clip as well.

http://www.aronnelson.com/gallery/main.php/v/cathexis/

LARS

The output buffer dosent seem right. The source is tied to 9V+ while the drain has no connection to 9v+ yet the signal comes out of it. Maybe your using some FET with a wonky pinout?

Also you should point out that there are some hidden cut tracks!!!

I magnified your layout, and I see trace cuts under
R3
R9
C11

Also, is it verified?! Please tell me!!!

In another thread he told me it was verified.

I thought the cuts were clear...there is the other boards underneath the main showing them.

Uh sorry Chris - midnight madness here...didn't see the whole image... :icon_redface:
now off to bed then...

Quote from: kurtlives on February 15, 2009, 03:35:16 PM
The output buffer dosent seem right. The source is tied to 9V+ while the drain has no connection to 9v+ yet the signal comes out of it. Maybe your using some FET with a wonky pinout?

Nope, no wonky pinouts, AFAIK. Use a socket and twist the pins around, see if it matters. Sometimes it doesn't, and someday I intend to find out why.

Quote from: Renegadrian on February 16, 2009, 05:37:17 PM
Also, is it verified?! Please tell me!!!

All my layouts are verified to sound at least as good as the sound clip right next to it.  :icon_biggrin:

LARS

Thanks for the layout. Can someone please tell me if the polarity of c8, c6, c4, c3, c10, c13 all have the negative side facing downwards?

Quote from: grathan on March 29, 2009, 08:53:10 PM
Thanks for the layout. Can someone please tell me if the polarity of c8, c6, c4, c3, c10, c13 all have the negative side facing downwards?

that seems correct, the negative sides are down.

Maybe this is the kick in the pants I need to make a rackmount Rat like the R2DU.  :icon_biggrin:

Quote from: kurtlives on February 15, 2009, 03:35:16 PM
The output buffer dosent seem right. The source is tied to 9V+ while the drain has no connection to 9v+ yet the signal comes out of it. Maybe your using some FET with a wonky pinout?

I'm having trouble with getting this to work. perhaps the pinout is wrong on the jfet? Has anyone sucessfully made this circuit?


http://www.aronnelson.com/gallery/main.php/v/cathexis/Veroboard+Layouts/ProCo+RAT/ProCo+RAT.JPG.html

Looks wrong to me.  The 2N5458 I have are gate, source, drain (from top to bottom with the flat side to the right as shown in the vero layout) whereas the layout seems to be source, drain, gate.  But even that doesn't correct it as the layout shows both R12 and C13 connected to the gate which doesn't tie in with the 80s Rat schematic I have.  I assume is a component numbering difference  ???

Quote from: grathan on April 23, 2009, 04:41:06 PM

Quote from: kurtlives on February 15, 2009, 03:35:16 PM
The output buffer dosent seem right. The source is tied to 9V+ while the drain has no connection to 9v+ yet the signal comes out of it. Maybe your using some FET with a wonky pinout?

I'm having trouble with getting this to work. perhaps the pinout is wrong on the jfet? Has anyone sucessfully made this circuit?


http://www.aronnelson.com/gallery/main.php/v/cathexis/Veroboard+Layouts/ProCo+RAT/ProCo+RAT.JPG.html

The pinout is wrong, I was looking my populated vero over last night. Some changes need to be made to use a standard 2N5458 with normal pinout.

This layout is now corrected. V+ now goes to drain. But as I noted in an earlier post, there is no audible difference here if you switch drain and source. I have tried both ways.

I did find another mistake, though, as noted by IvIark. The + end of C13 (1uf) needs to be connected to source, not to gate, the - end of the same cap to volume pot lug 3. This is also corrected. Component numbering obviously does not correspond to any schematic whatsoever.

LARS

Thanks for the update!  8)

Quote from: cathexis on April 25, 2009, 12:02:09 PM
Component numbering obviously does not correspond to any schematic whatsoever.

Right.  I wondered if your layout and the schematic I have were based on component numbering on the original board. 

cool layout, thanks! It is smaller than Torchy's vero layout, which is nice.

I did notice an interesting thing. Coming out of Pin 7 of the Opamp, you have a jumper going to the top strip (beneath the opamp). And then you have a cut next to that jumper. And then you have a jumper coming do the drain of the FET.  But the drain of the FET is on the same strip as Pin 7, which means that you just jumpered it right back to where it should be. It seems you can get rid of one of the jumpers and simply remove the cut. Hopefully i'm looking at this right?

Quote from: 80k on April 30, 2009, 03:35:47 PM
cool layout, thanks! It is smaller than Torchy's vero layout, which is nice.

I did notice an interesting thing. Coming out of Pin 7 of the Opamp, you have a jumper going to the top strip (beneath the opamp). And then you have a cut next to that jumper. And then you have a jumper coming do the drain of the FET.  But the drain of the FET is on the same strip as Pin 7, which means that you just jumpered it right back to where it should be. It seems you can get rid of one of the jumpers and simply remove the cut. Hopefully i'm looking at this right?

Correct! This is the result of the correction above, I think. I posted this layout as on a request, but it's an old one, and there were some issues. I should stick to hand-made, I suppose. It should work alright now, and it is a righteous distortion, one of my favourites.
LARS

Cool, the layout looks good now. I have verified it with the schematic. That unnecessary cut/double-jumper was the only thing I noticed (which isn't really a mistake, since it still works). Other than that, i think it's a good layout. I may build to it sometime this month, and will report back. :)

Yes, I finished that damned rat, that layout is verified.
I think the FILTER is wired backwards, actually it darkens the tone if turned CW.
---
edit: Yes it is au contraire, under volume 3 there should be filter 1 and under it filter 2+3
---

I made one with the LUBE mod. It acts like a second gain knob, more or less...Is it a filter?
Also, I have a dpdt for Si and LEDs - maybe the dpdt doesn't work correctly but I get the same sound on both positions...
Any clues?!  ???

Quote from: Renegadrian on May 07, 2009, 06:55:24 PM
Yes, I finished that damned rat, that layout is verified.
I think the FILTER is wired backwards, actually it darkens the tone if turned CW.

The filter is a hi-cut, as on the original. Backwards, but in a correct way  :)

(http://www.aronnelson.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=39739&g2_serialNumber=1)

Double check the wiring on that switch, It's real easy to go wrong there.

Thanks a lot for verifying this curse-ridden layout!

LARS

could anyone post the final layout link? There are several in this topic, and I don't want to make the wrong one

THX for the hint on the FILTER pot, didn't know that one...I thought it would act as a classic tone pot, that increases the highs going CW.

Quote from: kristoffereide on May 08, 2009, 04:54:06 AM
could anyone post the final layout link? There are several in this topic, and I don't want to make the wrong one

http://www.aronnelson.com/gallery/main.php/v/cathexis/Veroboard+Layouts/ProCo+RAT/

I am becoming mad about the diodes part... :icon_evil: I just soldered two wires instead of the diodes on the board, one at the first track from the bottom and one on the second track. I connected those two to a DPDT, middle lugs. I soldered two 1N4148 and two red LEDs at the other lugs, they are soldered correctly as for the orientation.
I already made a diode switch for another effect, so I know how to do it.

I had the same sound at both positions. Actually the switch doesn't work at all, cause I just desoldered it and the sound was the same...Tried another swith, but no luck, still the sound is exactly the same...with Si, with LEDs or with nothing...
Also I soldered the two wires after and not before the C10 electro cap, as to follow the schematic, but that didn't change anything...
GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR

Quote from: Renegadrian on May 08, 2009, 12:40:56 PM
I am becoming mad about the diodes part... :icon_evil: I just soldered two wires instead of the diodes on the board, one at the first track from the bottom and one on the second track. I connected those two to a DPDT, middle lugs. I soldered two 1N4148 and two red LEDs at the other lugs, they are soldered correctly as for the orientation.
I already made a diode switch for another effect, so I know how to do it.

I had the same sound at both positions. Actually the switch doesn't work at all, cause I just desoldered it and the sound was the same...Tried another swith, but no luck, still the sound is exactly the same...with Si, with LEDs or with nothing...
Also I soldered the two wires after and not before the C11 cap, as to follow the schematic, but that didn't change anything...
GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR

Weird, I wonder if the switch is faulty?

Also, you did more wiring then you need. You only need to send one wire from the diode location to a SPDT middle lug. And then solder two diodes on one end and two LED's on the other end of the SPDT switch. Tie the ends of all 4 LED/diode's together and run a single wire to the other side of the diode location on the board.

The switch isn't faulty, but I tried anyway another one with no luck, as I have already written (you didn't read that)

I use this kind of layout - I know it can be made in different ways, as you suggested, but this switch wiring is correct, as you will agree...Middle lugs are connected to the two board tracks. It MUST work!!!

(http://img147.imageshack.us/img147/2761/clipswitchuy0.gif)

finally verified this layout tonight. Sounds great! I used values for the voltage divider from the GGG Rodent which is a little different (but probably doesn't affect the sound). I also used a germanium diode in series with a silicon for one of the clipping diodes (left the other one as a single silicon). This seemed to give me a bit more volume and a smoother sound.

Using the OP07 and the diode mod, I have a smoother and darker Rat. It is very nice, not as harsh as my Keeley Rat. But I think I'd like to try the LM308 someday and see if I get anything different.

I only have linear pots right now, and all of the controls are heavily weighted towards the first quarter turn of the knobs, so I am looking forward to getting some logarithmic pots.

Thanks again for the layout!

I left it a couple of weeks alone and then reapproached it...
Finally solved my diode switching problem...Now I think I'm in love with that RAT!!!
I find the Si diodes quite good, but man, how I love to switch to LEDs clipping!!!
The sound is so full, and I love both high an low gain settings!!!
The FILTER acts great, more than every tone control I used in other circuits...
The LUBE control acts on one of the filters, and yes you can say it really shapes the sound, expecially on low gain!!!
I think it's a great pedal and also quite versatile, it can go from screaming leads on full gain to almost Tubescreamerish tones turning down the gain and playing both with FILTER and LUBE...I have to build one for myself, the one I made is for a guy I know that asked for it...

Hi everyone.

This is my first post here. Fantastic forum for DIYers.

I'm thinking about making the veroboard rat. This layout by Cathexis is very nice, small enough to enter in my prefered box.
I have notice, though, that R9 and C10 positions in the circuit are inverted if you take tonepad's schem (and most of schems at www) as a reference. I wonder if this may have any influence in sound or functionality.  ??? Any electronics theory knowledge there?

Thanks in advance.

Hi there and(http://www.gta-modding.it/forum/html/emoticons/welcome.gif)
From the little I know, the components placement you say shouldn't change the overall sound, so you can build it that way.
I did and a fantastic pedal came out...

Hey all,

I've just built from this layout and i'm suffering a bit of a problem of oscillation... (Cheers for the help with the clipping Renegadrian  :icon_wink:)

I did however make some changes I used 1M log pots for all three as that's all I could get hold of... which may be the culprit...

And I used an NE5534AP Chip... but Vodka Mod's use this too so I assume it's not that.

Just wondered if anyone else had an issue with this due to the layouts density.

Cheers for any Suggestions Guys,
Scruffie.

The 1M drive pot will greatly increase gain. Use 100K if you can, if not use resistors in parallel to lower the pots value.

Ah I was right about it being the culprit, okay i'l chuck some resistors in there, Cheers!

Quote from: Scruffie on July 24, 2009, 03:18:18 PM
And I used an NE5534AP Chip...

I recommend using a CA3130EZ. It's a very nice op-amp for the Rat. I like it more than the LM308N.

Quote from: Renegadrian on May 28, 2009, 06:10:21 PM
I left it a couple of weeks alone and then reapproached it...
Finally solved my diode switching problem...Now I think I'm in love with that RAT!!!
I find the Si diodes quite good, but man, how I love to switch to LEDs clipping!!!

What was wrong? I had the exact same problem on a Hao Rust Driver, never did sort it out.

I was looking for the problem in the board - actually it was the switch, I had a faulty one - changed the switch and it worked right. Rust Driver you say, curious I am having problems with mine ATM...(add angry icon here)

Gotta say... another awesome layout by Cathexis plus...

Adding the switch between Diodes and 3mm Red LEDS.. reallyyy works, in LED mode it loses the function of the filter control atleast on mine (could be due to using parallel resistors making it more Rev Log I guess) but it sounds so much bassier and really opens up the pedal from going to smooth overdrive on 1N4148 diodes to a Nice Bassier distortion on LEDs... I built this for a friend but I am certainly building myself one now, oh and the NE5534A Chip works great Grolschie  although I haven't had a chance to try out the CA3130EZ as my usual supplier doesn't stock it... but i'd like to hear it's affect.

In summary, this pedal needs a clipping switch and Cathexis, when is your next layout arriving!

Quote from: Scruffie on August 11, 2009, 11:31:47 PM
In summary, this pedal needs a clipping switch and Cathexis, when is your next layout arriving!

I had a busy summer... I have a vero layout for the Morley Sapphire Flanger coming up though! Just needs verifying. And the DOD Death Metal Dist :) Actually lots more, I just need time to verify properly, as this particular thread proves :)

Please start taking my suggetsions lol, i've started building them as you release them lol...

Fair you've had a busy summer though as have I, and flangers are good, aslong as they don't cost me an arm and a leg and I can get the chips (I really wanna build your ADA Flanger but i can only get 50 board accross not 54!) DOD sounds tasty, if you wanna hand with layouts or testing gimme a PM, i'd be glad to help.

i don't even think this layout works, i had to change some of the stuff near the output section to get it to work and i followed it to a T

only 2 posts and you're bitchin'...wow
This layout obviously works, it was successfully built at least 3 times (cathexis, myself and scruffie), so what you think is obviously wrong.

Make it four


Want some cheese with your wine?

sorry man, don't mean to be bitchin or anythin, i appreciate everyones effort here.

was just tryin to find out why my rat layout wasn't workin and i realised the output stage seemed a bit wrong, according to the tonepad schematic, maybe that's the problem?.
just cos there was a layout posted at the beginnin of the thread that people said they had the same probs as me then someone posted the "verified" layout but it seems to be the same as the first one posted that ppl had probs with.

no offence intended.

yes please, lot's of wine and a little cheese please :)

Right, sorry I didn't want to be mean, maybe you could have explained better the problem/doubt you experienced...
The verified layout is actually the first one, only the link was reposted, that's all.
Dunno what is wrong with yours, maybe we can help, but yeah as there are at least 4 working rats from that layout, we can take for granted it's a verified one...

i'm gonna unsolder everything from column 15, except the ic and redo it, because according to my audio probe that's where the problem is, because the jfet seems to be the problem(i've replaced it just to check), the source doesn't have any voltage on it for me.

I remember when the layout first came out I brought up some issues with it. They have all been corrected now though. It should work fine as is.

I can check my build if you like, just to verify I did follow the layout exactly.