This is kind of a spinoff of anchovie's "Noise Ensemble" (http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=87493.0). I love the simplicity of it.
When I was playing around with that circuit, I really liked the reverb sound. I had troubles isolating it, so I started over with the base for the Little Angel, since I had a ton of 10k's sitting there taunting me to do something with them. I had to put a bit of filtering in, but if you don't mind hissing, you can pop out the 13/14 and 15/16 1n caps.
So, after a couple hours of tinkering between shows and cooking dinner, I came up with this. It's kind of like playing in a sewer tunnel... or at least that's what it reminds me of. The 10k pot controls how much of an effect you get.
The optional Resonance Control is my first mod. It came about while trying to tame a bit of the resonance, obviously... but I actually like the control. You can go from a ringy tone to a duller ring. Extraordinary, isn't it?!? ;D
Enjoy!
(http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/5452/sewerpipesringverb.png)
Awesome! Another PT son!
I have so much to BB now...
I hope somebody post some demos when trying it :)
Quick note: When I was playing with this, I found out that this batch of PT's like to latch up the oscillator on powerup if you use anything less that 1k on pin 6. You still get sound, everything seems to work, but there's no delay signal. I tried it in a standard setup, as well. Tried battery, also. Same thing. When I'd turn it on, I'd get 2 pops instead of the typical click.
BTW, I forgot a 1M on the input before the cap. I wasn't using one (which may be part of the latching problem I was seeing). I'll be playing around with it a little more tonight after work.
Oh yeah... one last note... this should work on guitar, but I have not tested it with one yet. Works awesome with bass, for sure!
I had an issue once where the PT appeared to latch up, but it turned out to be an overheating 5V regulator. Just thought I'd throw that out as a possibility if you hadn't already ruled it out.
Quote from: earthtonesaudio on November 15, 2010, 08:59:22 AM
I had an issue once where the PT appeared to latch up, but it turned out to be an overheating 5V regulator. Just thought I'd throw that out as a possibility if you hadn't already ruled it out.
Good call. I was constantly checking the heat when I was building. I had absolutely no issues until I tried the Little Angel 100R on pin 6. Then I swapped out chips, and still had the issue. I just popped in a 100R and fired it up cold, and it works.
The delay resistor makes the biggest difference in the amount and tone of the ringing. This is a definite "flavor to taste" part.
Any demos of this forthcoming?
Quote from: anchovie on November 16, 2010, 06:22:47 AM
Any demos of this forthcoming?
What's a decent free clip hosting site? I don't wanna put up a tube video...
I'll get a clip done up tonight, after work.
I didn't do much last night, except watched "Men Who Stare at Goats", but kept having to plug in and play through it, so I think I'm gonna be boxing this one up. I wasn't too sure about the usefulness of the sound for what I play until I threw my Fuss in front of it... Wow! At minimum settings, it takes it a little into the flanged metal sounding distortion. Basically it sweeps from sounding like you used a pie-tin for a speaker cover to playing in a giant corrugated steel pipe. ;)
Decided to try zSHARE. We'll see how it works.
Demolition clip 1:
Sewer Pipes Demolition Clip.mp3 - 1.22MB (http://www.zshare.net/audio/827875539d56491e/)
Riff from one of our songs, recorded on Acid (Pro 6), Ibanez Soundgear GSR205 straight into the Sewer, out to a DOD FX91 set up as a flat booster, to the comp through a ST Audio ADC&DAC2000. But does all of that matter? Probably not, lol...
1: Dry
2: SP, knob at '0'
3: SP, knob at about 11 o'clock
4: SP, full on, "cranked to 11!!"
Also, since I had it all hooked up, here's the Bazz Fuss in front of the Pipes:
(same effect order, but I did someone else's song in 4 sections so you can hear how this reacts to higher frequency content)
Sewer Pipes Bazz Demolition Clip.mp3 - 1.29MB (http://www.zshare.net/audio/8278803909faf2af/)
In hindsight, this could probably be a better sweep with a log pot. Also, in the schem, the output cap should be .1uF, not 1uF. Also, I found that in the mod (which is kind of a subtler mod), a 4.7k works a little better than a 10k. The 50k pot is still ok, unless you have one that is around 75k or so.
Oh yeah... I found something out tonight... this did NOT like me turning down my tone control (it would start oscillating and go into runaway feedback), so this could definitely benefit from a simple input buffer, or coming after a buffered effect. This entire circuit is basically relying on feedback to cause effect to the audio signal... kind of like a gyrator. The 33k resistor controls how much total resonance you get, and if you want a noise machine, drop it to 22k-10k. Then you go the sweep I demo'd, all the way to oscillations that you can control with the knob.
So whatcha think?
Sounds awesome. I've used my FV-1-based digital delay to get these kinds of sounds, but it's very cool to be able to do it with a 60 cent part instead of a 10 dollar chip. :icon_wink:
I'm really pleased to see all of the fun recent projects with the PT2399.
Another great looking PT2399 build!
Once I finish my Noise Ensemble I'll give this a try :)
Sounds interesting, and still room for more mods ;D
Good work
I'm starting to think the 10 PT2399s I ordered from Tyada won't be enough, cause this one is going on the "to build" list.
Yeah sounds good ,another cool PT2399 circuit.
Another great sounding PT project. I particularly liked the second 'Bazz' clip. Anyways, layout! Please someone check it for dumb errors. I added a 1M pulldown at the input. Some of the cap values I found hard (Is that a decimal point? No wait, it's moving, must be an electron) to read - tiny schematic! The optional resonance can easily be added off-board. Enjoy!
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/967492/Sewerpiperingverb%20PCB.gif)
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/967492/Sewerpiperingverb%20PnP.gif)
Looking at it, everything is hooked up correctly. That's awesome!
If you wanna box this up with a higher gain boost or distortion on the front end, R9 is in a perfect location to install an output pot (the reason I selected 100k).
Another fun for the noize freaks is to replace R7 (33k) with a 50k pot and a 10k-22k resistor in series. You can take the resonance from hardly there to solid feedback that is fun to play with. Basically ringing feedback that can be set where you want it and flavored with another note or two, then decayed slowly with the twist of a knob. This one may be worth modding to use with an expression pedal of some sorts, or some kind of remote control.
Thanks a bunch, Rick!
nice! to me im hearing echo like in mic?
Sorry for bumping :icon_razz:
David , thanks for the reverb , it's so simple :icon_mrgreen:
Thanks! It's definitely got it's own sound to it. I got bored one night and ran a soundclip of a passing train blowing it's horn through it for about half an hour, playing with the knobs... sounded just like it was coming down a tunnel at you, lol! It was pretty fun. ;D
Oh yes , does the 50k resonance pot really need to be logarithimic pot ?
Nice thing this :)
so tiny!! ...
hmm ..
What would happen if one where to put a Little Angel, Sewer Pipes, and rebote 2.5 ALL in a 1590A.. with micro DPDT toggles..
that...
could fit..
Off-topic:
(http://www.doctortweek.co.uk/.media/806056281731.png)
One PCB ontop the other..
like this OC-2 layout (fits 1590A)
http://www.aronnelson.com/gallery/main.php/v/Renegadrian/chopped+oc2.pdf.html
insanity.. but a funny all in one FXloop 1590A pedal....
I like that thought, but
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-S1R0c88sams/TuitDCUj5RI/AAAAAAAAA0A/BQ9CxrbXwLw/s800/mini.jpg)
If it wasnt for those pesky too big 9mm alpha pots ;) one "could" fit much more stuff in a 1590A .
a Delay+Reverb+Chorus PT2399, 1590A pedal ... would be.. kind of cool..
1590B , definitely . 1590A , not enough room for pots .
Quote from: DavenPaget on December 14, 2011, 09:30:35 AM
1590B , definitely . 1590A , not enough room for pots .
Quote from: PereatMundus on December 14, 2011, 09:14:29 AM
If it wasnt for those pesky too big 9mm alpha pots ;) one "could" fit much more stuff in a 1590A .
a Delay+Reverb+Chorus PT2399, 1590A pedal ... would be.. kind of cool..
yep like I said :)
one thing thou... Alpha 9mm pots, and tiny knobs. does fit in a 3x4 grid together with jacks and 3PDT and two PCBs in a 1590A.
(thats the thing, 2 effects and knobs for 3 or 3 effects and knobs for 2.)
it "could" be possible. but one hell of a headache.. having to use the PC mount alphas
(http://cdn.banzaimusic.com/images/T/t_24474-01.gif)
one "can" make a 12 Pot 1590A But will be just silly.. 3 pots in a row on a 1590A is annoying to control.
was gonna make 3 knobs in a row on my ocd clone. but was just to little space to control the thing:
So its 2pots and one Toggleswitch in a row and the third pot in a triangle shape with the other two.
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-mSVwsZt5ySU/TiRhdc-su7I/AAAAAAAAAxk/kUxuH5REVd0/s640/17.jpg)
after that one I use mostly:
(http://cdn.banzaimusic.com/images/P/32236_th.gif)
So it can actually be controlled, the -knobs- are still a tad to big so they get used in that triangle shape I used on the OCD aswell.
the:
(http://cdn.banzaimusic.com/images/P/32238_th.gif)
would fit in a 3x4 grid But again to damned close to be good to use.
I've ended up using the 3x4 grid, BUT center space is for toggle switches.
Quote from: DavenPaget on December 13, 2011, 10:02:25 PM
Oh yes , does the 50k resonance pot really need to be logarithimic pot ?
Ugh... I've been cleaning and somehow lost mine... if I remember, it had the best balance right around 40k, and between about 40k and 30k was a bit touchy. I think it goes from fairly flat sounding to a short concrete tunnel sound within that 10k range, and then just more and more like you're playing in the middle of a freeway tunnel.
looks like a weird feedback setup.
you have a 33k fixed feedback resistor into the PT input stage. However the 220n and 10k back to pin 6 looks like a low pass filter but too broad to be noticeable? therefore feedback is a fixed ratio
I dont think that tying it to pin 6 makes any difference, is it supposed to cause some modulation on the clock? i couldnt hear it on the clips. Probably if it were DC coupled it could make enough wrcek on the oscillator...
Resonance control, looks like a paraller resitor to 1k delay resistor, does it sound different from conecting it directly on pin 6?
the filter on the output, pins 13 & 14, looks like its 1 cap away from the standard 2nd order filter. You could spare the rightmost 10k in the right, making it a wire and changing the cap to 3n.
Looks like a cool little project for the 2399, but probably it can be even more small! :)
Yeah, I kinda figured that out later. When I first started breadboarding this, I was using much lower resistances and larger caps. I had totally forgot about impedance when I was playing with it, so you're right... it has minimal effect on pin 6 at this point. After I get done with this wah project I'm on at the moment, I may plug this back into the board and retry some things. Originally, the incoming signal would float the current at pin 6, adding a chorusing effect, but I couldn't control the amount, or basically how big. I was looking at the design, and I have another idea that I'm going to try. I think I need to revisit this thing, lol.
Quote from: frequencycentral on November 19, 2010, 02:57:26 PM
Another great sounding PT project. I particularly liked the second 'Bazz' clip. Anyways, layout! Please someone check it for dumb errors. I added a 1M pulldown at the input. Some of the cap values I found hard (Is that a decimal point? No wait, it's moving, must be an electron) to read - tiny schematic! The optional resonance can easily be added off-board. Enjoy!
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/967492/Sewerpiperingverb%20PCB.gif)
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/967492/Sewerpiperingverb%20PnP.gif)
This layout is verified?
Quote from: Joseeduardosn on July 22, 2012, 10:49:53 PM
This layout is verified?
Yes. ;D
This is used, at the moment, on the breadboard. I think I'm gonna put it in a box with a Madbeans SlapChop.
At the moment, C1 and C2 are 2.2nF and 10nF in the picture. Seems to help get rid of some of the hissy decay, but kinda drops the resonance of the effect a bit.
(http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/8935/sam0546p.jpg)
I remember being absolutely astounded at the soundclips a while ago, but now they seem to be down. If you've got a spare moment, do you think you could record a quick youtube clip or something while that's on the breadboard?
In return, here's a little something I think you might like concerning your Chipdrive. Try dropping the voltage. At a certain point, (not much resistance. I didn't measure, sorry, but it's just a bit down on a 10k pot. You'll hear it when you hit the sweet spot, the drive changes character.), you hit this 'sweet spot' and- magic. The drive changes a bit, as mentioned, and something crazy happens. I'm not quite sure how to describe it, but the notes start cascading down from what you played. Think the Wren and Cuff Grey Box. It takes the note you play and - cascades is the only word I can think of - down. Sounds really cool, especially up high on the neck. Works best for me with the guitar volume down on about three. Enjoy!
Kickass on the CD. Gonna have to try it... I'll mess around a bit with current regulating, too. That would be key to getting a consistent sound and let the battery drain down a bit more without exiting that sweet spot.
I really need to make a vid for this... The SlapChop (ChopShop now? Harmonic Energizer clone) uses buffered bypass, which I wasn't going to use but got adventurous populating the board. I've been working on some guitar synth circuits, and tried one out through the SC. The sound was pretty good, handles the upper harmonics really well. I decided to take and mix the dry and wet signals... meh. Then I got the idea to run the SewerPipe off of the clean side, and played with the output mix. F'ing fantastic sounding!
This circuit definitely responds to the harmonics (I used a Bazz Fuss in the clips). From what I've experienced so far, I'd consider it a viable module for a synth guitar project.
looks great, that would be a nice addition to a delay too....hmmm...i was going to build a dual delay box, but i'll hang on till i get to hear this too....cool stuff david. :icon_cool:
vid ?..pretty please!.. :)
I´m doing my home work for these pedal for those who like all in one here is the ONE!!!:
(http://imageshack.us/a/img255/4466/sewerpipesringverb3pdtl.jpg)
Thanks Earthscum & RICK for this great pedal; In 2 or 3 month I recieve some PT´s directly from CHINA!!! and made some of the PTs aventures!! great man great!!!!!
Quote from: frequencycentral on November 19, 2010, 02:57:26 PM
Another great sounding PT project. I particularly liked the second 'Bazz' clip. Anyways, layout! Please someone check it for dumb errors. I added a 1M pulldown at the input. Some of the cap values I found hard (Is that a decimal point? No wait, it's moving, must be an electron) to read - tiny schematic! The optional resonance can easily be added off-board. Enjoy!
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/967492/Sewerpiperingverb%20PCB.gif)
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/967492/Sewerpiperingverb%20PnP.gif)
no ground on the input and output?
any reason why?
Syntaxera:
My guess as with most schematics. The sleeve of the input and output jack sockets are connected to ground. Im not sure how new you are to audio electronics, but this is always how it is done if not otherwise stated. ;)
I found a youtube demo of this pedal, though the audio isn't exactly great:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lA3YlElmI_Y
can I change one of the 1nf caps to 2nf? 'cause I ran out of 1nf caps. If yes, which one?
You can put 2 2n in series for 1n response...
EDIT: Oh well, that question was 2012 ::)
I also like to share another thing I found out with this nice little circuit:
Above there is a ´cascading effect´ mentioned somehow related to dropping supply voltage.
I don´t know about that, but you get the same effect if you take 2200u cap and place the neg. end to pin 6 with
the pos. end to GND. With longer delay times it sounds REALLY nice.
Try this if you build this pedal (it might also work with different 2399 circuits) and add a whole new dimension to it.
I made it switched and called the function ´nausea´... ;D
Quoteplace the neg. end to pin 6 with
the pos. end to GND. With longer delay times it sounds REALLY nice.
whaaaaaa??? dont you mean place the pos. end to pin 6? Whouldn't the cap. scream and die or something? (I've never actually killed a electrolytic cap. :P
Yes, that´s right, but with 2200u nothing actually happens but cool envelope style modulation on the delay time...
I´ve killed some caps and i´d say the effect is fitting for new years eve :D
QuoteYes, that´s right, but with 2200u nothing actually happens but cool envelope style modulation on the delay time...
I´ve killed some caps and i´d say the effect is fitting for new years eve Cheesy
Sweet. Doesn't sound like a very durable design though :P Happy new year
Ah, it´s easy to misunderstand the way I wrote it, but I killed no cap with this mod, I was just meaning `in the past´...
This one I had on the breadboard for hours and days and nothing happened. I guess because the currents involved with pin 6 are just very small...
I wished someone would try it, since the effect was really astounding, making me just listen and play around with it for quite some time,
like stumbling over a treasure chest :D Maybe I´ll build it again and post a soundsnippet!
would love to hear it!
Just built this but I noticed it doesn't work well with other pedals. Sometimes it works and sometimes I just get loud oscillation. Also if I plug in my guitar, halfway I guess this is just to ground I also get a very oscillation. I'm wondering if I have it wired wrong although I don't think so. I'm getting a bread board today and going to try to start over and see where I get. I like noise and I like loud so I'd like to try to be able to use this oscillation predictably
Welcome Cilantro!
Can you post the circuit you used? The original schematics from this thread have all disappeared for me (it was a while ago, let's face it..;) )
Getting a delay circuit to oscillate isn't generally too hard, but like you say, it helps if it's predictable, and it shouldn't happen all the time. That would be a fault.
Here's the original schematic that David posted:
(https://i.imgur.com/PJTk9oT.png)
This is one with the optional resonance control in-circuit. Not sure who drew it.
(https://i.imgur.com/QMYlVWB.png)
This is a really funky circuit, I think it came about more by tinkering than proper circuit design (which isn´t a bad thing necessarily, Fuzzface comes to mind!), but iirc you have to experiment a bit until it fits for you.
The basic idea is to modulate the delay time with the ac audio signal, there´s a lot of possible interesting configurations if you play around I think you will not be disappointed! :)
(https://i.imgur.com/QMYlVWB.png)
C6 is shown backwards.
This is the layout I used. I replaced the 33k the first one to 10k
(https://i.postimg.cc/bGHqhhph/308-CF3-A7-7-DE4-4291-943-E-3-C11-BD90429-A.png) (https://postimg.cc/bGHqhhph)
the 10uF at the input on that layout is backwards, even tho it has no pulldown resistor on it. as shown, the (-) of that cap will have the +2V5 or so from the PT2399 internal opamps bias, and the (+) of the cap will be [either grounded via a pulldown resistor or] connected to your pickups [or preceeding fx, with pulldown on output] which will have 0 DC Volts. hence, backwards.
^^ Quite right. My own layout (ancient history) also had the same mistake. :icon_rolleyes: