PCBs without a printer

[Brisance]

So I've been struggling with toner transfer and all that, but recently came up with an idea. Today I tested it and also made an instructable, here:

http://www.instructables.com/id/PCBs-without-a-printer/

[armdnrdy]

I used to make boards like this in the 70s.

I don't mean to be mean but....if you ask me...this is a big step backward.

Years ago, I never would have dreamed that I would be able to make large, "professional" style boards with fine traces going between IC pins....not until the printer/toner process.

The method you are "resurrecting" is limited to smaller circuits with thicker traces.

Buy a printer. 

[Brisance]

Thanks.. I have a large laser printer in my office. Problem is I've been trying the toner transfer one too many times without luck, thus I needed this method.

[davent]

If you can get presensitized photoresist boards, the process is a snap, pretty much foolproof with no special equipment needed. Toner transfer, never ever got results i was even remotely satistied with.

Have also done the dry transfer pad/tape pcb etch resist method, from graph paper layouts, in a previous life.

[armdnrdy]

It takes a bit of trial and error to get good, consistent results.

The right printer, amount of pressure while ironing the transfer, heat while transferring, and photo paper that works for toner transfers.

Once the stars align... you can produce great boards every time!

[Mark Hammer]

Before toner transfer, I wold do the following:

1) print out the pattern
2) tape it to the copper side of a PC board
3) take my spring-loaded center-punch, adjust the tension appropriately, and pop a dimple in the board for every pad
4) remove paper with pattern, buff up the board nice and keep my damn fingers off it
5) using either a sheet of rub-on transfers for donut-pads, or a Sharpie-type pen like you use, apply all the pads
6) connect the dots with a pen

I prefer Staedtler Lumocolor pens, because they have nice fine tips; finer than a Sharpie.  It's my own little quirk, but I would use two colors of pen.  This way I would lay down the pattern once in one colour, and use the second colour for the second coat.  The two colours let me keep track of where I had and hadn't gone over again.  Using a medium-dark colour like red or blue for the first draw, and black for the second coat, works well.

VERY important to keep any and all finger-juice off the board.  Wearing gloves helps, but one can always use a piece of cellophane to protect the board from your fingers while holding it down during drawing.

That said, many ways to accomplish the same ends and everybody has their own method that they feel comfortable with.  In that regard, kudos on your preparation of an instructable.

[Brisance]

Thanks for tips. Main thing about my method is that it worked! I would still be waiting for the stars to align, but instead I have this:

And now I am soldering transformer wires for my quad PSU, otherwise I would have jack.  Sure, one day I will perfect my toner transfer, I can't find any transparent printables to use photoresist and photoresist costs 3 times as much as a regular pcb. But for now, it's something that works, and by drilling the holes first, I can do 2 sided PCBs just as easy.

[pappasmurfsharem]

You should use the paper I recommended here.
http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=104307.0

It works great and peels off easy.

The only problem you might have is, in general, that business class laser printers (assuming that's what your work has) are designed to be cost effective and therefor will use less toner even at maximum settings.

[Brisance]

thanks for suggestion, I will experiment more, for sure, but still, my method is for getting something right away, when you haven't yet perfected other methods.

[PRR]

> limited to smaller circuits with thicker traces.

I found it useful for DIP systems with four DIP-8, four T0220, two small BJTs, eight 2W resistors. Need a sharp Sharpie and some small re-work.

Drilling?? NO! Design from the top, surface-mount your through-leg parts. (Maybe not for large filter-caps or screw-strips.)

You still need a slop-sink for the etching, but all the rest is quiet and clean.

[Brisance]

Sounds cool, but won't THT parts be brittle, while surface mounted?

[J0K3RX]

Found this the other day while wasting some time in Radio Shizak.. Thought I would give it a try since it was marked down from $10 to something around $2.50   Just peel off the little pads or traces and stick'em in whatever pattern you like... Works pretty good although, a Sharpie is still much faster. I like the Sharpie idea.. maybe make some universal stencils of different parts so you can just lay'em out on the board then you can just freehand the traces with Sharpie. I have some really fine tip Sharpies also. I can use a printer but I still hate the time it takes me to do it and I also dread the etching process! Anything to make it faster and less of a pain in the anus is what I am all about!




Recently made an electro-etcher, really works well but, you can forget about using it with a Sharpie... a soon as the saltwater mixture starts to boil the Sharpie washes right off. Toner on the other hand works great!

Couple things I have noticed with toner...

Some toner brands don't transfer or stick to metals well especially true with cartridges that have been refilled! Genuine HP toner cartridges work good for me. All makes and models of HP laser jets seem to work equally well, for me.

Some people don't take this seriously enough or just overlook it all together - Make sure the surface on which you are applying the design to be etched is CLEAN! When I say clean I mean 1st sand it and then wipe it down real good with alcohol, make sure ALL finger prints are gone! Some PCB's have a thin coating on them... get it off! Enclosures have sh!t all over them... get it off!! Wet sand will do it.  

[greaser_au]

Brings back memories, I used to use these about 35 years ago...  they came in a kit with etchant, and a piece of board. the plasic kit box was used as the etching tank. Good results.
I didn't know they were still available...   http://www.amazon.com/MG-Chemicals-416-ER-Rub-On-Resist/dp/B005T8PA1W     (and available from mektronics down under).

david

[bool]

Oh, memories!

It's much faster if you only use pads and draw the rest with something like a Rotring filled with water-resistant ink. That was a pro-lookalike prototyping technique in 80s.

With these you had to use an etchant mixture that doesn't bubble up much - because bubbles coud lift the pads and traces and so the copper got etched away where it wasn't supposed to.

It was a "good practice" to go over it with a hot iron to get a better "fix".

Also very useful for making hand-made photo-resist masks.

[CodeMonk]

I got one of these recently : http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004BDMP8M/
(Someone here recommended that printer awhile back)
And I use the same paper that pappasmurfsharem linked to.

Works great.
It just takes practice.
Double sided boards as well, although it did take me a little while to come up with a method to get good and consistent results.

[bloxstompboxes]

If you are using a Brother brand printer, I have heard of people having issues with these and their toner. I have been using a Samsung printer and had great results. You may try cleaning you boards with a scotch brite pad and Barkeeper's friend cleaner. Does a great job and you don't have to sand the copper or use alcohol to clean it. Works great.

I am also still using that modded Scotch brand laminator I bought for like $20 at wallly world. Pads and traces come out even and straight. With an iron, I was getting distorted uneven lines and some bad transfers sometimes.

[tca]

I used to make boards like this in the 70s.

I used to make boards like this in the 80s.

[Brisance]

I used to make boards like this in the 70s.

I used to make boards like this in the 80s.

I used to make boards like this last night.

But really, I could have been either dreaming about getting toner transfer to work or where I am now, with a PSU board soldered.

[Beo]

Use a laminator. I send the pcb through the laminator 10 times and get a perfect transfer every time. Just don't use Brother toner.

[Brisance]

Where the hell am I gonna get a laminator in 2015?