Author Topic: Russian Diodes for dummies  (Read 1039 times)

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diy-tubes

Russian Diodes for dummies
« on: June 26, 2017, 05:18:23 PM »
Another topic about Russians.  ;D This time about diodes.
I have a collection of russian diodes, and tested them compared with 1N34A, 1N914 from China and NXP 1N4148, Fairchild 1N914. Curve tracing: DCA75.
Here is the plot:

What we can say:
1N34A seems to be real germanium (there are several topics about "fake 1n34a"). Measured them with DCA55 (in addition to DCA75): Vf from 0.3 to 0.4v.
D9B (Rus: Д9Б) is very close. Vf measured with DCA55 is about 0.4
D9E (Rus: Д9Е) often called a sub for 1N34A. Graph is close too. Vf measured with DCA55 is about 0.4-0.45
D9V (Rus: Д9В). Vf measured with DCA55 is about 0.5 (0.412-0.628)
D9J (Rus: Д9Ж). Vf measured with DCA55 from 0.4 to 0.5
D9K (Rus: Д9К) close to 1N34A. Vf measured with DCA55 is about 0.4 (0.320-0.450) mainly under 0.4v. Good substitute for 1N34a from this point of view.
Other Russian germanium types:
D310 (Rus Д310). Have more steep characteristic. DCA55 measures Vf about 0.220 (quite close measurements)
D312A (Rus Д312А) closer to 1n34a. DCA55 measured Vf about 0.3 (0.280-0.316)

There are other types of russian germanium diodes still available. I think I will make more tests, if it's interesting.

We can compare them with silicon types: NXP 1N4148 and fairchild 1N914. Very similar graphs. To the question if we can substitute one with another.  ;)
Russian si diodes KD251A (Rus: КД251А) have more steep graph. KD522B - "Russian 1n4148" (not shown in the plot) gave the same graphics as KD251A. Both were used in Big Muffs.

In conclusion: Russian germanium diodes are 100% original.  :icon_cool: Close to 1N34A, and according to many reports - usable, have their own tone.
« Last Edit: June 26, 2017, 05:30:18 PM by diy-tubes »
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digi2t

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Re: Russian Diodes for dummies
« Reply #1 on: June 27, 2017, 09:48:00 AM »
I used the D9E's in my Aion Refractor (Klon clone), and they are simply outstanding. I tried 1N60, 1N270, and 1N34A's, and even some different germanium transistors (too leaky for anything else), but my ears kept coming back to the D9E. For lack of a better word, the clipping was just "sweeter" with the D9E's. They seemed to differentiate less between the humbucker vs. single coil question, sounding equally good with both. The real difference was at lower overdrive levels, where that "edge of break up" was very smooth. "Touch sensitivity", is that the term? Could it be that smoother curve having something to do with it? I dunno, but I like them.

Just be careful though, the line on the Russian diodes is generally the anode side, not the cathode, like we're used to. Best test before using them, unless in an opposing pair scenario where it won't matter.

Maybe do a "Japanese transistors for dummies" and "Japanese diodes for dummies" series as well. There's a plethora of details to be gleaned from those as well. For instance, nailing down all the gain letter codes (once and for all!) for the transistors. I did a write up on them, the thread is kicking around somewhere here. As for diodes, the 1S1588 is really nice for clipping. My ears appreciate them much more than the 1N4148/1N914. Maybe they have a more gentle curve too? Dunno. You're starting to give me reason to buy a DCA75... damn you! :icon_razz:
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Digital Larry

Re: Russian Diodes for dummies
« Reply #2 on: June 27, 2017, 11:29:54 AM »
I'd expect that D9V to sound quite a bit different than anything else there.  Got any sound clips?
Digital Larry
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diy-tubes

Re: Russian Diodes for dummies
« Reply #3 on: June 27, 2017, 02:38:21 PM »
I've seen verbal description only. This guy say they sound similar to D9E.
http://music.codydeschenes.com/?p=1615
Quote from the link:
Quote
D9V
1. Very similar to the D9E tonally, but the breakup happens a lot sooner.
2. Unlike the D9E, these will break up when you play hard, and they are much edgier.
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diy-tubes

Re: Russian Diodes for dummies
« Reply #4 on: July 16, 2017, 03:48:02 PM »
Another picture. Added D2D, D18, D311. I will offer diodes kit if it's interesting, so everyone can test them.
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diy-tubes

Re: Russian Diodes for dummies
« Reply #5 on: September 19, 2017, 03:19:26 PM »
More diodes tests.
1N60 reissue (China), 1N270 reissue (China), 1N270 NOS (two black lines, housing similar to Russian GE diodes) compared with 1N34A, Russian D9E, D9J and si 1N914.
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jojokeo

Re: Russian Diodes for dummies
« Reply #6 on: November 14, 2017, 03:59:26 PM »
This is perfectly timely for me. Much appreciated diy-tubes!!!

If not too much trouble? It'd be nice to see a couple more silicon types 1n400x, various colored 3mm LEDs, 2n7000 & BS170 in various positions (w/ gate-drain and gate-source connected), perhaps a few schottky's, etc.??? 

diy-tubes

Re: Russian Diodes for dummies
« Reply #7 on: November 15, 2017, 01:02:44 PM »
Thank you for your feedback and kind words. I will add more diodes soon, leds, 1n5819, uf4007, more russian diodes etc..
« Last Edit: November 15, 2017, 01:04:36 PM by diy-tubes »
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thermionix

Re: Russian Diodes for dummies
« Reply #8 on: November 15, 2017, 07:51:18 PM »
As for diodes, the 1S1588 is really nice for clipping.

I love those in my 808 clone.  Used in some of the originals.  Other neat ones to try (if you can find them) are the Panasonic MA150, and the 1S2473 as seen in some older SD-1s.
klaatu barada nikto

Rob Strand

Re: Russian Diodes for dummies
« Reply #9 on: November 15, 2017, 08:43:49 PM »
Quote
As for diodes, the 1S1588 is really nice for clipping. My ears appreciate them much more than the 1N4148/1N914.

Interestingly comparing the 1S1588 datasheet with my 1N4148 measurements, the 1S1588 has a slightly harder knee.  I remember in the past putting a small Schottky diode in series with a 1N4148 sounded better than the 1N4148 alone and it doesn't change the clip point too much.   The combination chicken diode has a knee which is sharper than the 1N4148 thus pushing it towards the 1S1588 characteristic *shape* (but with a slightly higher drop).

« Last Edit: November 15, 2017, 09:25:44 PM by Rob Strand »
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Strother

Re: Russian Diodes for dummies
« Reply #10 on: Yesterday at 06:06:48 AM »
As for diodes, the 1S1588 is really nice for clipping.

I love those in my 808 clone.  Used in some of the originals.  Other neat ones to try (if you can find them) are the Panasonic MA150, and the 1S2473 as seen in some older SD-1s.

Thanks for the suggestion. The MA150 is next on my list to try.

thermionix

Re: Russian Diodes for dummies
« Reply #11 on: Yesterday at 06:33:22 PM »
The MA150 is next on my list to try.

I guess it was over a year ago, I searched everywhere on the internet I knew to look, and I only found one place in the US that had any MA150s.  And they had all of two left in stock.  And those two now reside in my TS9 clone.  I think they're still pretty easy to find in Japan, maybe Australia.  But there are a lot of fakes out there, on Ebay and such.  Not fake diodes per se, but common 1N4148s etc sold as other rarer types.  Look for a white band, and the slightly larger body of 70's/80's silicon signal diodes.  Best if you can find them from a reputable retailer, and Panasonic brand.

For reference, from an original TS board:

klaatu barada nikto

Rob Strand

Re: Russian Diodes for dummies
« Reply #12 on: Yesterday at 08:05:34 PM »
Quote
And they had all of two left in stock.  And those two now reside in my TS9 clone.
Scotty have you got the co-ordinates?
Beam them up.
The mind often distorts without gain.

thermionix

Re: Russian Diodes for dummies
« Reply #13 on: Yesterday at 09:04:41 PM »
 ???

ya lost me.
klaatu barada nikto

Rob Strand

Re: Russian Diodes for dummies
« Reply #14 on: Today at 12:10:31 AM »
Quote
ya lost me.
I'm going to take those last two diodes using my transporter (teleporter).
The mind often distorts without gain.

thermionix

Re: Russian Diodes for dummies
« Reply #15 on: Today at 12:41:16 AM »
Yeah, okay.  You're in Oz, right?  I think you can still find them down there, not sure though.  Closer to the source at least.

Starting to feel bad about hijacking this thread, talking about Japanese diodes instead of Russian.  I do want to try some Russians though, and especially some Ge transistors.  I have diy-tubes.com bookmarked, salivating over those PIO caps.  Soon, I will be placing an order.
klaatu barada nikto

Rob Strand

Re: Russian Diodes for dummies
« Reply #16 on: Today at 12:50:33 AM »
Quote
Yeah, okay.  You're in Oz, right?  I think you can still find them down there, not sure though.  Closer to the source at least.

Yes.   I was only joking anyway.  I've got too much junk around here  I try not to buy anything and just use what I have.
The mind often distorts without gain.

rankot

Re: Russian Diodes for dummies
« Reply #17 on: Today at 03:11:01 AM »
I can't find D9J (Д9Ј), only D9I (Д9И) diode in datasheets. Are you sure you didn't misspell it?
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diy-tubes

Re: Russian Diodes for dummies
« Reply #18 on: Today at 06:50:57 AM »
D9 series have both D9J (Russian Д9Ж) can be also spelled as D9ZH) and D9i (Russian Д9И).
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amz-fx

Re: Russian Diodes for dummies
« Reply #19 on: Today at 07:50:50 AM »
Did you measure the leakage of any of the germanium diodes?

The 1N270-NOS looks more like a resistor than a diode, for example, and others have similar appearances that stray away from the typical diode junction conduction. Could this be due to leakage currents?

Best regards, Jack