Oh no, not another Klone thread...... There will be Punch and Pie.

[Tinners1983]

Sorry there is no punch or pie.

So, I have built this.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32832196578.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.1bd7a0448JidDA&algo_pvid=b320c467-4478-49f2-9b63-30fc031cb702&algo_expid=b320c467-4478-49f2-9b63-30fc031cb702-5&btsid=c9193596-1b9e-4b72-81dc-ff9dc281801c&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_8,searchweb201603_53

The price is laughable I know. The Kit arrived yesterday with all the requisite parts and I began to assemble. They had kindly provided a BOM, but no schematic or instructions. Not to worry, the schem is available and I can construct a circuit. They had very helpfully however decided to renumber every component compared to the standard schematic out there, and there was no indication of polarity for the electrolytics... much tracing of the circuit later (and one confirmed error, the 1uf marked C19 on Martin Chittum's schematic which needs positive to go ground) I had a completed build. Only mod is I had a tantalum cap which I substituted for C16. At one point I was concerned as I soldered two pads together (I can't remember which resistors they were now...) but I checked and I'm pretty sure they are connected at that point anyway and I got the stanly knife out and broke the solder joint)



a quick plug in last night revealed a couple of issues...

1) The indicator LED is continuously on with the input cable plugged in. Not the end of the world but as I've constructed the internals from gut-shots of Klons online, coupled with the fact that I don't regularly build pedals (the odd fuzz face here and there) means that I'm not sure where to go to fix that.

2) It sounded crap. I live in a flat and it was gone 11pm and I can't really play at any sort of volume at the best of times so I thought I'd leave it. I started probing around and all the voltages seemed fine, except the -ve V from pins 4 and 5 from the 7660s. I get about -2.5 and -3.5v respectively. way off it seems. I tried 2 other chips, and that only made it works so put the original back in.

This morning I pulled it from the chassis to have a quick look aaaaaand discovered that one of the pins of the gain pot had no solder on it. Either I forgot it or it all flowed somewhere else. I know which is more likely. So the sound is generally fixed. I know its very amp dependant so thats ok for now. Voltages still the same.

3) This bit has got a bit confusing, I'll try and be as brief as I can. My main amp is currently a JTM45 clone which I built. I run it with this https://www.fryette.com/fryette-power-load to stop me getting evicted before I go deaf. There is a small fan in it which I have only ever see run gently under fairly heavy playing. With the Klone connected the fan jumped up to full speed immediately without playing the guitar. I plugged in a boost pedal I own https://store.metropoulos.net/products/copy-of-supa-boost-handwired-high-voltage-boost-pedal?variant=19776952860745 and no such behaviour occurred (light fan operation under playing as normal).

I decided to set up a little test rig with the multimeter and got some odd readings.



basic but it works.

so play the guitar with control knobs on the pedal at noon, reveals the frequencies you'd expect. With the output raised to about 90% (unlikely I know...) you get this. Is this oscillation? With the guitar volume down the pedal is outputting just over 200mV AC -0.1mv DC



With all the controls maxed, I read a max of 2.76 V AC at the output. seems quite a lot, but also a max of 176.5 mV DC and a min of -45.9 mV DC.
With the controls at noon I get a max of 470mV AC, and a max of 14.6mV DC and a min of -20mV,

Setting the meter to Ohms i get 52.4Kohm at the output, without the input cable plugged in and the effect off. engaging the effect without the cable plugged in drops this to 5.5K.

effect still off, plug in the input cable and the reading spikes up to over 1M, the back to 52K. Engaging the effect again drops this to 5.5K.

I repeated these tests with the boost pedal.

I got a max of 2.75V AC with every control maxed on the boost, and a max of 258mV DC and a min of -0.5mV DC.

input unplugged gives 0.3Ohm at the output 6.4K with input plugged in, just under 10k effect engaged.

Sorry for the long post and am grateful for any help you can offer. I can provide other readings if required.

Cheers.

[EBK]

Sorry for the long post...

You had better be!
Just kidding!  If your post were less detailed, we would have asked you for more info.  Welcome to the forum!  Someone more helpful than I will be along shortly to give you meaningful input.   

[Tinners1983]

Cheers, I just checked how long I had been lurking... 6 long years!

[duck_arse]

I have no meaningful anything, except where's the cake? or a sausage for Eric? some yoghurt even? so no welcome from me.

we still want the DC voltage measures on all the IC pins [don't apply signal]. also measure the voltage on each pin of your tantalum cap, and ensure the (+) marked leg is to the more positive voltage. then short your input to ground, and measure the DC voltage at the output. twiddle knobs, work bypass, see how the reading jumps about.

[EBK]

also measure the voltage on each pin of your tantalum cap, and ensure the (+) marked leg is to the more positive voltage.

My reflexes are slow today!  I usually blurt out the check yer tantalum suggestion the moment I see "Klon".

[italianguy63]

Welcome!!

Watch that tantalum cap.. makes weird stuff happen!

This may give you a place to work from:

MC

[vigilante397]

Hi, I was told there would be punch?

Seriously though, welcome I would love to see some voltages. I've built my fair share of Klones, and, as in many builds, IC voltages will tell you just about anything you need to know about this thing.

[Tinners1983]

Welcome!!

Watch that tantalum cap.. makes weird stuff happen!

This may give you a place to work from:

MC

battery at beginning of test 8.5
ic1
4.24
4.24
3.3
0
4.21
4.23
4.23
8.48

ic2
4.25
4.24
4.22
-3.6
4.22
4.23
4.22
15.0

ic3
8.44
4.23
0
-3.94
-3.62
3.88
6.44
8.43

battery at end 8.42 and falling.... curious

battery with nothing plugged in 8.74, which i also have at all the input/output jack pins. (except the input which goes to W10 on the pub)

tantalum has +8.7v on the positive side (the other side connects to what looks like a ground plane which has a jumper to connect to another plane with the negative side of D4

[Tinners1983]

I have no meaningful anything, except where's the cake? or a sausage for Eric? some yoghurt even? so no welcome from me.

we still want the DC voltage measures on all the IC pins [don't apply signal]. also measure the voltage on each pin of your tantalum cap, and ensure the (+) marked leg is to the more positive voltage. then short your input to ground, and measure the DC voltage at the output. twiddle knobs, work bypass, see how the reading jumps about.

ok input shorted to ground. The Led comes on...

sorry im running out of time this morning, bloody employment getting in the way. Time for a stupid question however... The batter ground should connect to its own connection of the input jack, and the connection to W9 on the board, or just on its own....

[Tinners1983]

I have no meaningful anything, except where's the cake? or a sausage for Eric? some yoghurt even? so no welcome from me.

we still want the DC voltage measures on all the IC pins [don't apply signal]. also measure the voltage on each pin of your tantalum cap, and ensure the (+) marked leg is to the more positive voltage. then short your input to ground, and measure the DC voltage at the output. twiddle knobs, work bypass, see how the reading jumps about.

ok input shorted to ground. The Led comes on...

sorry im running out of time this morning, bloody employment getting in the way. Time for a stupid question however... The batter ground should connect to its own connection of the input jack, and the connection to W9 on the board, or just on its own....

to answer my own stupid question, yes. Now I get ground connection to the case and the back of the pots etc. Still got poor Voltages though. I suspect the 1uf at pin 5 of the 7660s ill swap it later on

[dennism]

Wait, when I click on the link for the kit in the original post, it says it costs $249.00?    What am I missing?

[tubegeek]

Wait, when I click on the link for the kit in the original post, it says it costs $249.00?    What am I missing?

From the description:

"You know the deal with the Klon Centaur... Sounds great, but overpriced!"

So: a fully replicated Klon!

[thetragichero]

yikes! for that much why not get a genuine ktr off reverb?
(i often forget that not everybody in the diy community is as much of a cheapskate as i am. heck i prefer using components salvaged from old organs/electronics because cheap is a great price!)

[Tinners1983]

you're not wrong, thats why I said the price is laughable. I had originally got a kit from pedal parts (fuzz dog) but I hate the metal film resistors and the nasty boxy caps those kits come with, its fine, i normally replace them anyway. But the pub is crowded and it would become a struggle. So I thought I'd try and find a pcb that was more like the original, the idea being that i could build both kits and see how different they sounded (if at all) Aliexpress was the only place I could find a pcb that matched, and then i saw the kits. And I couldn't be bothered to start sourcing everything independently. Pure laziness, combined with the fact that I've got an AC30 to recap, and two other vintage amps to do (when one comes back from being recovered).

[vigilante397]

I've built a couple Klones on the original layout PCB, but I got both from Mark (italianguy63) on here. I put both in copies of the original enclosure though, which are close to $100 each. The price we pay for things that aren't important

[Tinners1983]

So i made the ground connection, and now with the battery connected the LED is on regardless of a cable plugged in. Also I can watch the battery voltage drop before my eyes at a rate of about 0.01V every 2 seconds. Clearly I have a nasty short somewhere or I have screwed something else up. Does this bit of the wiring look ok?

[DIY Bass]

It looks as if the ground from your battery is connected to 2 lugs on the input jack.  It should only be soldered to one.  They way it is now won't break anything, but it won't switch off when you remove the jack either, as you have discovered.

[Tinners1983]

It looks as if the ground from your battery is connected to 2 lugs on the input jack.  It should only be soldered to one.  They way it is now won't break anything, but it won't switch off when you remove the jack either, as you have discovered.

Thanks, I had connected those 2 lugs as without it I didn't seem to have the right ground connections. Turns out I had my wires crossed, literally. The very epitome of a little knowledge being a dangerous thing. As I've never build one of these before, and had no instructions I was wiring it up from gut-shots of other Klons. I had missed a jumper (the small one near to IC2) and I had the foot switch wired incorrectly.

I tried a fourth 7660s for IC3 and got the same result about a 1V drop to -2.5 so I still have only -3.5V on pin 5...

Apart from that, now have correct LED function, buffer sounds nice, controls work as described. There is a huge amount of level available and it crunches up nicely. Not a massive amount of low end which is actually quite nice for me.

I'm prepared to call this case closed, unless anyone has any further thoughts where my missing -5V are?


Happy New Year all