OT: 25" jumbo frets

[zener]

I often see in sites like Music123 the decription of a guitar having 25" scale, jumbo frets blah, blah, blah. Does 25" meaning inches, the length of the the neck. From where, from the headstock up to the last fret or from 1st to the last fret?

How about the jumbo frets, how "jumbo" really are the frets (is it measured?) What if a guitar don't have jumbo frets, how much is the difference to guitar with jumbo frets?

I just measured the neck of my guitar from the 1st fret up to the 24th and it's 19 1/4". I also measured the width of its 1st fret (the distance between the inside of the fret dividers) and it's 1 5/16". The height of the first fret is 1 5/8". What do you think?

I know it might be dumb, but I would ask anyway.

Thanks for any help.

[BILLYL]

The scale is measured from the inside of the nut to the 12 fret - Take that measurement and the double it.  So a measurement of 12 inches yields a scale length of 24 inches.  You then use that measurment to adjust your neck.  So a 25 inch would be a measurement of 12.5inches (nut to 12th fret)

Fret wire comes in different sizes and the larger the fret is one of the factors to increase the substain you will have (tonal wood is another)

Hope that helps

BILL

[claydavis]

scale is the distance from the nut to the saddles. so a 25-inch scale guitar is 25 inches from the place where the strings rest on the nut and where they rest on the saddles/bridge/whatever. in reality, it's not exactly 25", because you adjust for intonation, but the fret placement is calculated by that approximate scale length.

jumbo just means the frets are physically large. it has nothing to do with where they're placed, it just means they stick up higher.

hope that's mildly helpful.

[Rodgre]

I often see in sites like Music123 the decription of a guitar having 25" scale, jumbo frets blah, blah, blah.

The SCALE length determines the distance from the nut to the bridge. Gibsons are typically 24 1/2" (or 24.65"), Fenders are typically 25 1/2" (but Mustangs and Jaguars are short scale, like Gibsons). Paul Reed Smiths are 25".

The 25" could be also referring to the radius. That means how curved or flat the fingerboard is. A vintage Fender is really round and has either a 7 1/4" or 9" radius. After that, a lot of standard guitars are a slightly flatter 12" radius. The 25" radius you refer to is pretty flat and is common on modern "metal" guitars, some acoustics, and nylon string guitars (which are virtually flat)

How about the jumbo frets, how "jumbo" really are the frets (is it measured?) What if a guitar don't have jumbo frets, how much is the difference to guitar with jumbo frets? .

Jumbo frets are just a standard size for them, and they're usually a bit fatter or wider (compared to a vintage Fender style thin fret). Height of frets seems to be similar regardless of size. I could be wrong, and I'm sure someone else can help here, but I assume that the height of different fret sizes starts out the same, and over time, they get worn through playing or through redressing when then get worn.

Roger
7 1/4" radius
25/5" scale
medium jumbos.

[Torchy]

Explained ...

http://www.12fret.com/fret/fv4n7.htm

[PB Wilson]

To get an idea on the relative sizes of different fretwire check out http://www.stewmac.com/shop/Fretting_supplies/Fretwire.html. Fretwire differences are hard to quantify without actually playing the guitar, but do some research and play as many guitars as you can to get feel for what you like.

[muizac]

most people have answered your question pretty well, but i thought i'd clear up one or two things.

*the scale is measured from the nut to the bridge.
*Gibsons LP's scale is up for debate, but if often thought as being 25 9/16" - and therfore longer than more other guitars.
*Longer scale guitars provide better sustain, but the trade off is with playability, especially if you have small hands or do complex jazz chords that span 8 frets . . Personally i've found  that a higher grade fixed bridge such as tonepro's provides substantial more sustain than increasing the scale length. (the worst investion ever on a guitar was the  tremlo or floating bridge - i hate the tone suckers)
*Strictly speaking there is no connection between radius and scale lenghts.
Mu guitar has a 12" radius, but you can get guitars with a graded, compound radius neck - typically going from 7-12" - the jackson randy rhodes has a 17" radius, and ive heard of a 20" radius neck - but not any higher.
*There are actually heaps of different fret sizes, even within the main catogories of jumbo etc. The frets sizes take into account the width, height and crown of the fret (but not tang size).  Jumbo typically refers to a very thick fret, to elaborate jumbo -  low means its also not very high (less than 090"). If you have to re-fret your guitar, experience has taught me to do the whole neck at once, not on a ad hoc basis.

muizac.

ps - build your own guitar and you learn all this stuff. the only imporant factors are the fret positions, nut and bridge - everything else doesnt really matter too much. Its actually lots easier than building pedals !

[bwanasonic]

*Gibsons LP's scale is up for debate, but if often thought as being 25 9/16" - and therfore longer than more other guitars.

Les Pauls (and most other Gibsons) have a scale length of 24 3/4 " , which is SHORTER than the *Fender* scale of 25 1/2". PRS uses an *in-between* scale of 25" .  Some guitars use a shorter scale length (about 24") , a few being the Fender Jaguar, Fender Mustang and Gibson Birdland.



Kerry M

[zener]

Thanks for all the info, guys.

So with the measurement of the first fret of my ax, can you say that it is jumbo :roll: ? The back of the neck is not really curved, maybe designed for fast playing.

Sorry, I haven't got a hold of other elctric guitars other than mine, so I have no idea of comparison.

I measured the scale of my axe and it's 26 or more. It has floyd rose-style bridge and a locking nut. I just measured from the first fret up to the end of the string and it's almost 26 already.

I came up with this because I use to "salivate" upon browsing at the Jackson, ESP, Ibanez etc at Music123 and Ed Roman Guitars. When I look at them, they seem to be bigger than what I have. I "worry" about that because I have very small hands that I always feel that I can only do some of those fast, nasty and finger-stretching solos of Kirk Hammett. I'm undersized for my age.

[Torchy]

*Gibsons LP's scale is up for debate, but if often thought as being 25 9/16" - and therfore longer than more other guitars.
*Longer scale guitars provide better sustain, but the trade off is with playability, especially if you have small hands or do complex jazz chords that span 8 frets

:?:

Gibson LP = 24 3/4"
Strat/Tele = 25 1/2"

Both from the manufacturers web sites. Sustain is down to the construction method and woods used NOT the scale length.

[Nasse]

If I remember well in metric dimensions the "scale lenght" of strat/tele is 648 mm and les paul 335 and sg is 629 mm

But if I am wrong I want to tell everybody I am totally pissed off with my day job, I really need a holiday but show must go on, anyway it is summer and the holiday is coming. In deed tomorrow is the last day at work before weekend.

Scale length really affects the physical "feel" of the quitar. You can stick a humbucker on a strat, or play it trough some modelling gizmo that sounds convincingly like another style guitar but the feel is little different. You can put little thicker strings on a short scale guitar and they bend little more easily

Of course these are subtle differences but they are real and easily noticed

But if you put jumbo frets and humbuckers on a tele, it really has something similar with les paul...

[ejbasses]

scale lengths are measured from the nut to your saddles
longer scale lengths sound better. no farting. and responds to down tuning better.

if your gonna go new guitar shopping maybe you can come over to my neck of the woods and let me show you around.

[zener]

if your gonna go new guitar shopping maybe you can come over to my neck of the woods and let me show you around.

Shopping for a new guitar? Maybe two or more years from now. For the mean time, just day-dreaming would do. :lol:   or maybe  :cry:

Hey ejbasses, when that time comes, I'll go straight to RJ and buy a PRS-style or any dual humbucker guitar.

[muizac]

Torchy -  i had remembered the scale lenghts of LP incorrectly  apologies. (its 2am here .However, i have 24 9/16" in my notes - which is different from the gibson site - i need to look into this.

scale length is a contributing factor to sustain - ive made guitars from the same materials but with different scale lenghts, and you can hear a difference.

Melvin His%^&*s book on guitar making explains this in detail.

[Torchy]

Muizac, - I wasnt having a pop, Its just some of my friends and I were having this discussion very recently. What I meant was ... If you take a guitar made of mahogany, glue in the neck and put two humbuckers on it, then take one made out of maple, bolt the neck on and put three single coils on it I think the effect of the scale length on the overall sustain difference will be marginal .

I actually built the telecaster out of that book erm ... erm a number of years ago at school. My woodwork teacher was a guitar freak and I had lots of help.  :oops:

[Gilles C]

Just a small note about the radius.

A rounded neck is better for chords, a flatter one for solos.

Therefore, a compound radius is good for chords and good for solos, but cost more.

I don't think I saw that little detail.

[muizac]

torchy - i know you werent having a pop mate. It must have been all that peas pudding that made me get my gibson scale lengths mixed up .

btw - i know its theoretical, but I dont expect an all maple guitar to sound too good. i checked out a guitar that was made for a guy, which was solid rosewood - i imagine a maple being very similar - all harsh, high fq's.

[ejbasses]

yeah RJ guitars got some good tones in them. and their relatively cheap.
but its kinda hit n miss on the quality. my first bass was a RJ and it served me good.

The cheapest Brand new ibanez ive seen costs around 6000 pesos. you cant beat that price.

[Torchy]

Muizac - I once had a Hondo II Les Paul - all maple and I mean ALL maple. Really awful thin trebly sound so I know what you mean. The rosewood tele's sounded nice but were too heavy.