Help with SI Fuzz Face kit from bigtonemusic.com

[superhombre2k]

I got the kit, put it together, and got it working in a matter of a couple days (it's my first time as a DIYer)

However, I have a couple "problems"... unity is almost all the way up the volume knob.  When I play my Strat, I'd say it's at 8 out of 10, and when I play my Les Paul, I have to crank it all the way up.  It hates my Les Paul actually... it's so quiet on the bridge pickup and then it's waaaay loud on the neck.  I'll probably just stick to running it with my Strat.

The other problem is, I want it to be brighter than it is.  It's got hardly any high end when it's on... it's sucking my tone!  Other than that, it's a cool pedal and it works how I'd expect it to.

I don't want to send it to Keith at bigtonemusic to fix because that's $ shipping and I won't see it for a while, let alone will I learn from this project!  What should I do???

[RDV]

Hard to say with seeing the schem or diagram he sent with it. Odds are if he gave you all the right components that you made a layout or wiring mistake.

RDV

[Doug_H]

;lkjoik

[AL]

Fist thing - check ALL of your wiring and solder joints. Then check to make sure your transistors are in the right way. Now ... go here http://www.geofex.com/ at the top left is a link Technolgy of the ... click on that and read and read and read again the Technology of the Fuzz Face It's loaded with information.

Without more info on you pedal it's kinda hard to pinpoint exactly what's wrong.  I would recommend making the FX debugger from GEO as well. And one last question - What type of amp are you using? The FF works well with tube amps but I'm not sure about solid state and if your amp is cranked and saturated already you're just going to add mud.

Take another look and repost what you find. And Welcome !!!

Also, if anyone hasn't seen that page yet it's really nice. The guy has some very good instructions for beginners. I think he may be an amp guy. His boards are eyelet and he uses Sprague Atoms and Orange Drops. Good stuff but definately more popular in amps.  http://www.bigtonemusic.com/home.html


AL

[superhombre2k]

Here's a link to the instructions.  There aren't printed instructions, just the ones online.  http://www.bigtonemusic.com/fuzzcloneinstructions.html

[superhombre2k]

It seems to sound fine other than the bassiness which I know how to fix after reading up some.  I'm just concerned about having to crank the volume to achieve unity.  I think there should be more gain on tap so I can have more control over the overall volume (to perhaps push my tube amp harder yet if I want)

[Fret Wire]

I'm with RDV, double check your work. He does provide a troubleshooting section in his online instructions.

Out of curiousity, I emailed him awhile back about his tranny gain selection to see what he'd say. He wrote back and said his Ge's (OC75's) are 80-120hfe with no more than 250ua leakage. No problem there. His si's are 109's and he said they run 300-500hfe. Obviously high. All resistor values are stock Dallas. For caps, 2.2uf, 22uf, and .1uf (should be .01uf). But, all in all, it's not a bad kit for someone who wants everything in one package. What he does, is give you exactly what the original Dallas Si Fuzz had.

It does have carbon comps, which I would dump. As well as the .1uf.

If everything checks out with your wiring, check your voltages on the trannys. They are high gain and you will probably have to adjust the bias as best you can. Since you'll probably be replacing the 33k and 8.2k resistors, replace the 100k also with carbon film or metal film. The resistors that came with it only add noise, not tone. For brightness, change the .1uf cap to .01uf, which is the original value. Also, you can lower the 2.2uf.

Read the Geo link on Fuzz's, very informative.

Since this kit does have a good box and quality components, you'll have it around a while. When you're more comfortable with the work, let us know, and we'll show you where to get better (and cheaper) transistors to make it sound really good. First, make it work the way it came. You'll understand it better. Then you can tune it up.

Like Doug said, give the seller a try first. He was nice enough to write me back, even though it was obvious to him I build my own.

Upstate NY? No wonder we're both inside. Temp goes up 10 degrees, the humidity triples. Gotta love NY!

[cd]

Doesn't the guy provide support for his product through email?  Provided the instructions are correct, triple check all your wiring against another known good schematic.

[AL]

Fretwire,

Just out of curiosity. Those carbon comp resistors are Xicon's so my assumption is they are the newer ones from Mouser and are 5% instead of the old style 20%. Have you used these? I've never actually used any carbon comps I was just wondering if the lower % helped in the noise department - although I'm not really sure how it would.

AL

[Fret Wire]

I have to give him credit for offering such a kit. Everything is quality, and the buyer just has to solder, assemble, and finish. No drilling or planning the layout. Enough is already done to basically insure success with the build. Then the person would probably be bit with the DIY bug, come over here, and learn to do it all themselves.

Plus, with the nature of Ge's, and high gain of period correct 109 Si's, it's not easy to offer a fuzz kit that will give good results without alot of tweaking. Being decent quality, the builder will no doubt go back to it later and tweak it once they learn more. And it won't sit around like some of the beginner's project's do. You can always use fuzz.

[Fret Wire]

Al, I didn't notice that till you pointed it out, thanks . I doubt better tolorance would help the noise, just the value drift. As far as I know, it's the resistor's makeup (material) that dictates the noise. I've always used metal film in amps, sometimes carbon film. Alot of people use carbon comps, especially with amps, but I've never subscribed to it.

[b_rogers]

i think i listened to the sound clip on harmony central. it sounded really low in the fuzz dept right?

maybe link the thread on there to here if that was you...so's all these smart folks can help ya!

 my Monsterpiece fuzz has a 500k pot and bc108 trannies and unity is just under 3/4 of full volume and with the fuzz just barely cracked back from full. make sure you crank the clean side of your amp up cause most fuzzes sound like ass at bedroom levels. a 100k vol pot instead of the 500k will help some with both of your problems.

[Mark F]

It says on his page that you can instant message him. Maybe you could try that for a more immediate response. If he's available that is.

[ErikMiller]

Here's a link to the instructions.  There aren't printed instructions, just the ones online.  http://www.bigtonemusic.com/fuzzcloneinstructions.html

Nice looking little kit there. $60 is not bad.

Assuming you've assembled it correctly, you might try dropping the value of the 8.2K resistor down to 6.8K and see what happens. Chances are it will get louder.

Get hold of a voltmeter and measure between the junction of the 8.2K resistor and the collector of the transistor. 4.5V is the sweet spot. If it's low, lower the value of the resistor. My guess is that you'll find it to be at least half a volt lower than that.

[superhombre2k]

I know how to read a multimeter... and the DC voltage from the the collecter of the second transistor to the junction of the 8.2k resistor is either 12.5v if that makes sense.  It jumps off the scale when I set the precision to 2.5v so I set it to 50v precision and it reads 12.5v.  That seems ridiculous to me if it's supposed to be around 4.5v and I'm getting too LITTLE volume.

[b_rogers]

dont you mean from the 2nd trannies collector to ground?

[petemoore]

Today's FF...
 Should get loud.
 Are there markings or shape to ID transistor orientation? The electrolytic should have a - marking.
 Last count there were at least 1,000 Fuzz Faces, that was before Miss Piggy, I must have tried a hundred of them by Now, As a matter of fact I was down in the lab jammin and tweekin' on Miss Pig earlier, I think she sounds PDgood today with the low gainer in Q1 and BC W/Pigged Si & 8.2k on Q2, gonna hafta do a Mosface, I can't get a 2N7000 to even turn on in Q2.
 Build your FF jig, try nearly all the transistor, bias, cap etc configurations on one FF board...you can probly leave the 33k, 100k and 470R resistors, trimpot Q2's collector, and socket everything else...\
 Make the 470 a 1k, then add 1K paralel to bring it to 500, by leaving lead space on the top of the board, you can tack resistors on there.
 Use a 2k gain pot instead of 1k.
 Get it real bright, then cut highs with a cap between Q2's collector/base.

[superhombre2k]

Where should I be reading from?  Someone please edit in Paint the diagram from bigtonemusic where I should place my MM's leads.

[Fret Wire]

One lead of your DMM on a ground, the other to each leg of each transistor, and post your voltages, and your battery voltage.

[superhombre2k]

I think I found what I needed.  From the collector of the first transistor to the junction of the 8.2k resistor and the collector of the second transistor reads about 3.5v (I am stuck using the 50v precision because it's too much for the 2.5v precision)

Does this sound normal to you guys?  I could lower the value of the 8.2k down to 6.8k and it would increase the volume?