Modified my CS-3...why didn't Boss do it this way ?

[Incubus]

I made the mods which were posted a while back and now the cs-3 sounds transparent and quieter...I haven't finished playing around with it yet, but I noticed the difference right away.

Anyhow, since the changes are only resistors and capacitors, did Boss not make the pedal better because of cost, or they just figured it was good enough, even though it could be better ?

So after a long time of feeling like this pedal was something I had to "put up with" until I got a better one, I'm now really happy with it.

[StephenGiles]

Wh knows how the minds of gentlemen over the other side of the world work. I should imagine bottom line profit had something to do with it!
Stephen

[Kleber AG]

hi
wich mods did you tried?

Thanks
Kleber AG

[RjM]

They don't make their pedals and then test them by ear. They use mathematical equations for their curcuit designs.

[Incubus]

The pdf file can be downloaded here:

http://www.indyguitarist.com/CS3-mods.pdf


There is a thread I was pointed to which has this info and also has a link to an mp3 comparison:

http://www.diystompboxes.com/sboxforum/viewtopic.php?t=28092&highlight=cs3+mod


If you have a CS-3, do the mod...it will change your life.

[Kleber AG]

thank you very much!  :wink:

[Incubus]

Also there are some comparison MP3's at these links:

http://www.indyguitarist.com/soundclips/clean_no_effect.mp3

http://www.indyguitarist.com/soundclips/mod_quarter.mp3

http://www.indyguitarist.com/soundclips/mod_half.mp3

http://www.indyguitarist.com/soundclips/mod_full_and_clean_end.mp3

Also, I changed the LED to a red, waterclear 3mm LED. The pedal looks much classier now...and sounds it.

[wampcat1]

Glad you guys liked the mods!!

I always wonder why boss always uses cheap little silicon diodes instead of other types....and why they don't do a little bit of 'market research' and change their pedals to include some of the ideas from others' mods...

The only thing I can figure is that building a great sounding pedal comes second -- kind of a shame, really.

[dave h.]

Wh knows how the minds of gentlemen over the other side of the world work. I should imagine bottom line profit had something to do with it!
Stephen

whatever the case, pretty much every guitarist ive ever met has at least 2 or 3 boss pedals. they may be commonplace and nothing too extravagant, but they do what it says on the label, and they can do it whilst being run over by a cement truck with snow tires.

thanks for the tip though. weirdly enough, i was just playing earlier today, with my cs-3, wanting to get more of a creamy, slightly jangly tone, as heard on numerous songs off blood sugar sex magik. it didn't exactly work out too well.

[puretube]

B*ss waited, till B*hr*ng*r cloned the worse version,
before bringing out the goodies...

[Satch12879]

They don't make their pedals and then test them by ear.

I doubt the validity of this statement highly...

They use mathematical equations for their circuit designs.

Yeah, imagine that, people actually knowing what they are doing instead of fumbling around blindly (or deafly)... :roll:

It's like a structural engineer saying "Yeah, that steel beam looks big enough..."

I love english majors...

[dave h.]

B*ss waited, till B*hr*ng*r cloned the worse version,
before bringing out the goodies...

hahaha

oh behringer.

i remember looking at reviews for one of their mic pre's and reading that they had little light bulbs behind the tubes to make them look like they were working harder.

[jimbob]

I have to say wampcat1 made an awsome pdf of mods! Just awsome! One of the bst out there and very instructive w great pics!!! And the fact he gave them away- very generous!!!!

[Mark Hammer]

My wife is averse to strong seasonings, and "hot" food in general.  If a label on a package says "spicy", she stears clear of it.  I often have to persuade her that if it is a packaged meal or food product, prepared for a huge grocery store chain, with millions upon millions of potential customers, you can bet our bottom dollar that the last they want is for it to appeal to ONLY a few percent of that potential market.  As a result, "spicy" simply means a minimally discriinable difference in "heat" and pungency so as to appeal to the broadest market possible and present the least risk in terms of sales.  At the same time, it has to be a LITTLE bit different or else there would be no reason for anyone to try it.

Same goes with Boss pedals.  This is a BIG company, with huge sales.  What they aim for are new products that will pose the least risk to the company.  What that consists of are things which are different enough to distinguish themselves from other products/companies and previous issues, but not so "out there" as to narrow that potential market down to a tiny few.  As such, I would describe their products as often being "conservative" or cautious in their design....at least in the under $300 (list) range.  Once you get out past a certain pricepoint, the potential market obviously shrinks considerably, and transforms itself into a market that *seeks* something new and outlandish/innovative, rather than tried and true.

So, does *everybody* want a compressor that conveys every single nuance of the broadest-bandwidth single-coil (or even piezo) pickup?  Nope.  Thousands upon thousands of customers just want something to let their cheap überstrat with dual humbuckers seem "bigger" with their $70 bedroom amp.  The savings that Boss creates for themselves by using certain components makes things affordable for many.  Given the volume of components they purchase, though, in this case, my sense is that the contents of the pedal is more a question of what will make the most consumers happiest for the most reasonable price, rather than simply what will provide the the lowest manufacturing costs.

[Johnny G]

Same goes with Boss pedals.  This is a BIG company, with huge sales.  What they aim for are new products that will pose the least risk to the company.  What that consists of are things which are different enough to distinguish themselves from other products/companies and previous issues, but not so "out there" as to narrow that potential market down to a tiny few.  As such, I would describe their products as often being "conservative" or cautious in their design....at least in the under $300 (list) range.  Once you get out past a certain pricepoint, the potential market obviously shrinks considerably, and transforms itself into a market that *seeks* something new and outlandish/innovative, rather than tried and true.

that sounds like exactlly the reason why newer Boss pedals can be more mundane compared to earlier versions. the best example to my mind is the difference between the PS-2/PS-3 and the rather bland PS-5

the earlier pedals are great for making wierd noises and the like while the PS-5 is a fairlly standard pitch shifter with a couple neat features

[Incubus]

I understand what you're saying, but in the case of this particular mod, for this particular pedal, we aren't talking about a big design change to the actual circuit. We're talking about a handful of component value changes......no "connections" have been changed, and that's why I'm having trouble seeing why someone at Boss couldn't hear the shortcomings in the sound that the stock CS-3 has. Many people have complained that it sounds lifeless....me included.

When I bought mine it was $159.00 Australian. Now, if it would have cost $179.00, I still would have bought it, and I imagine alot of others would have also.

I can't see that the component value changes in this case, would have sent the price of the pedal past a point which would have caused the market for it to drop.

Mind you, I'm not saying that it wouldn't have, I'm just saying that I can't see it......it's only a few resistors and capacitors......which leads me to think that basically, someone at Boss...or a few....could have done better.

Anyway, whatever the reason, I'm really happy with how it sounds now. The problem I have is that after so many years of owning it and not gigging it, it still looks brand new, and it is currently sounding amazing, which makes me not want to gig it....so I'm thinking of buying a second hand one, modding it, and stepping on that one instead.

[wampcat1]

Glad you guys like the cs-3 mod!

Thanks,
Brian

[Mark Hammer]

I understand what you're saying, but in the case of this particular mod, for this particular pedal, we aren't talking about a big design change to the actual circuit. ......which leads me to think that basically, someone at Boss...or a few....could have done better.

They likely know that.  Again, it is difficult to imagine that a company that large, which sinks so much into customer relations (including glossy free mags for distribution at music stores, etc.), would be unaware of what would or would not appeal to the broadest possible range of clients.  I suppose it is always possible that they receive bad advice, but I am confident that they are thoroughly capable of weighing the advantages of saving a few pennies on components vs the disadvantages of alienating a large potential market.  The designers themselves may well be muttering "Not what *I* would have wanted, but never argue with the lowest common denominator when millions are at risk." right this moment.