Neovibe - midrange loss

[lpmuzzzik]

I've built a Neovibe and it's working correctly. My problem is that there is a huge loss of midrange in chorus mode - compared to the sound in bypass mode. It is the most obvious when turning the depth pot all way down. Then the lack of mid can be heared in every depth setting.
This is strange because it doesn't happen in vibrato mode. (w/ depth at zero the sound is the same as when bypassed, and preserves the tonal characteristics of the guitar in every setting)

Is this normal?

Please help, I want my tone back! And sorry for my English...

[R.G.]

The Neovibe, and the Univibe it's a functional copy of, is a two-notch phaser. Phasers work by making notches in the frequency response.

When you turn the depth down, all it does is reduce the amount of LFO swing - it does not reduce the depth of the notches. With depth all the way down, the notches just sit still. The original univibe just killed the LFO in "cancel", and had no bypass, true or otherwise at all.

It is possible that your unit has a notch or two that sit in the midrange when depth is down, and that makes it sound like a big midrange loss.

It's also possible that there's a circuit flaw causing it, because I've never heard this complaint about either the neo or the uni.

[Kleber AG]

:shock: My "EasyVibe" does just right the same thing, and it's even worse "if" the easyvibe is after the fuzz instead of before (Yeah I know it acts like an EQ before or after the fuzz).

I love my mids and have always wondered about that :?

RG, is there something that could be tried to improve these mids??? Maybe modding some cap values that determines the nothches, the problem is that I can't figure out how to change those cap values :oops:

Thanks
Kleber AG

[lpmuzzzik]

Yes, I've got the same problem. I can use my Vibe before the OD only therwise it cuts all the mids, well, leaves a little only. At first it was interesting but I know it shouldn't act like this.
Listening to some Cap Coconut II samples (in which the order is Fuzz->Vibe) which presents an outstanding combination, I'm sure that it stinks.

[mat]

My easyvibe does that too.. :cry:

mat

[R.G.]

RG, is there something that could be tried to improve these mids??? Maybe modding some cap values that determines the nothches, the problem is that I can't figure out how to change those cap values

I'll have to poke around in the circuit a bit.

I have to admit, I never thought of the circuit as inducing mid loss. I always just thought "that's the way a univibe sounds".

[Kleber AG]

Thanks I'll wait to hear from you when you get the time for that.  
Some people also say it kinda makes the sound more darker it could be due to the mid range being messed around?

My main problem is in a gig when my guitar is to loud on stage and my ears got used to that sound, then if I try to turn on the easyvibe after a fuzz, my guitar sound kinda goes down, because it lacks mids...

Regards
Kleber AG

[iron25]

"My problem is that there is a huge loss of midrange in chorus mode - compared to the sound in bypass mode"
"This is strange because it doesn't happen in vibrato mode"

Having the same issue, has anyone found a solution? Is this just a true bypass issue? Would changing to the cancel be the right move?
It seems to be a mid scoop, doesn't sound bad just changes the tone pretty drastically when engaged.

[nordine]

might it be a byproduct of phasing itself?
the midrange loss, thats it

i've always found my phasers somewhat "hollow" the sound of my bass

maybe i'm stating the most obvious thing, but whatever

[Ripdivot]

At one time I had a real Univibe, Neovibe and Easyvibe at the same time. I think the mid loss is just a by-product of the circuit. When I compared all three vibes they all had the "mid loss" characteristic. I have since sold the Univibe and kept the other two.

[iron25]

I have found it a problem using a fuzz in front of the neo.
Straight in it's not an issue just an ever so slight mid loss but nothing terrible.
Yesterday evening put a boss pedal in front and all was well.
I think if you buffer the input it will be fine. 

[SteveB]

I don't really sense any mid loss with mine. But, what exactly is the range of mids you are loosing? Lower mids - 200Hz-500Hz? Mids - 500Hz-2kHz? Or higher?

Or, maybe, I am tempoarily loosing the mids within the sweep, but I accept that it is the way it is "supposed" to sound?

If you are running any dirt pedals, put them after the vibe. I have long been a proponent of fuzz before vibe, but only in conjunction with a dirt pedal after the vibe, or going into an overdriven or distorted amp. This is the sound of Jimi @ Woodstock & Band of Gypsys. But, lately, I've really been enjoying the sound of the vibe in front of all dirt pedals. Definitely no lack of thickness in the tone to my ears.

http://www.sbkustoms.com/music/fx/Neovibe.htm

Steve

[iron25]

Wow!!! Some nice tones you got going on there Steve!!!
I'd say it was a cut around the 200 to 500 area, only with the fuzz in front. The vibe wasn't quite as strong with the fuzz after - not as groovy if you will.
Not a real major problem, just that I hadn't been using the vibe for a long while and was wondering if it was me or...
Did a search and found this old thread and thought I'd see if anyone came up with anything.
Just a matter of plugging in different configurations and pedals, that's where the fun is anyhow!!!!
I really love the NeoVibe, great sound, thanks again R.G.

[mat]

I don't really sense any mid loss with mine. But, what exactly is the range of mids you are loosing? Lower mids - 200Hz-500Hz? Mids - 500Hz-2kHz? Or higher?

Or, maybe, I am tempoarily loosing the mids within the sweep, but I accept that it is the way it is "supposed" to sound?

If you are running any dirt pedals, put them after the vibe. I have long been a proponent of fuzz before vibe, but only in conjunction with a dirt pedal after the vibe, or going into an overdriven or distorted amp. This is the sound of Jimi @ Woodstock & Band of Gypsys. But, lately, I've really been enjoying the sound of the vibe in front of all dirt pedals. Definitely no lack of thickness in the tone to my ears.

http://www.sbkustoms.com/music/fx/Neovibe.htm

Steve

Really great fuzz-vibe-od sounds ! What kind of fuzz did You use ? Schem maybe 

Matti T.

[SteveB]

I don't really sense any mid loss with mine. But, what exactly is the range of mids you are loosing? Lower mids - 200Hz-500Hz? Mids - 500Hz-2kHz? Or higher?

Or, maybe, I am tempoarily loosing the mids within the sweep, but I accept that it is the way it is "supposed" to sound?

If you are running any dirt pedals, put them after the vibe. I have long been a proponent of fuzz before vibe, but only in conjunction with a dirt pedal after the vibe, or going into an overdriven or distorted amp. This is the sound of Jimi @ Woodstock & Band of Gypsys. But, lately, I've really been enjoying the sound of the vibe in front of all dirt pedals. Definitely no lack of thickness in the tone to my ears.

http://www.sbkustoms.com/music/fx/Neovibe.htm

Steve

Really great fuzz-vibe-od sounds ! What kind of fuzz did You use ? Schem maybe 

Matti T.

Thanks! It's a Kama Sutra 69, which is basically a GGG boutique late 60's fuzz. Mike Burgundy did the schematic & pcb layout many years ago, & that's what I used.

Steve

[mat]

Thanks Steve, have to try that one 

Matti T.]

[yeeshkul]

I had a feeling that my Neo lacks trebles when the depth control was all the way down. I installed a simple JFET buffer yesterday (the one from the Technology .... article) and the sound become remarkably brighter and louder. Nice one.