I really really hoped the Flanger Hoax Would be Awesome... But

[stopstopsmile]

I got it in and it was unuseable.  I don't believe EH built it properly, thanks EH.

In bypass there was a ton of noise hiss and hum, when turning the unit on this noise only got louder and overshadowed the effect.
I returned it for another and the same thing happend on the new version.  The pedal is a mess.

I was hoping it would work as I need a pedal that can do chorus, leslie tones, flanger and phaser this pedal seemed to have it all but its a giant dissappointment. 

I am wondering has anyone figured out the problems with these units?  And can anyone reccomend an alternative to the flanger hoax?

[Doug_H]

I think I'm going to put a Liqua-Flange on my Christmas list. Seems like it has a lot of flange/chorus options, and I love the tzf sound.

Doug

[Bernardduur]

Hmmmm, that's bad. I was hoping it would be the ultimate.......

Maybe all duds?? Or it really is a hoax

[Mark Hammer]

It would be useful to have a manufacturer response here.  It is VERY early in the lifespan of this pedal.  It would not be the first time in pedal history that a manufacturer might have aimed for the sort of pricepoint that would make it attractive to a wider audience, at the same time as cutting corners on the very things that irked that market.  Most people here are well aware of how often many of the products produced by E-H changed over issues.  *IF* there are problems with the noise on this pedal (and I urge people to try one, rather than go by what they heard via the grapevine), then it may well be something that can be easily remedied in a second release.

It is a damned sight easier to fix noise problems than it is to persuade senior management to release a product with a set of performance controls as adventurous and innovative as this beast has.  Before people bury it, I'd like to know: a) what the *true* noise levels/problems are from as authoritative a source as can be found, and b) if there ARE noise issues, how to salvage what's a great idea, even if it involves changing a few things in the design/components and jacking the retail price up a couple of bucks.

[stopstopsmile]

When I returned the second unit, the store owner asked what the problem was.  I explained to him the problems he then tested out both pedals and said that both were defective and that he wasn't going to order anymore flanger hoax pedals, he also contacted EH and they accepted the 2 hoax's back as defective.  The noise and hiss and hum was outrageous.  I would easily pay more money than the $199 I paid, but the pedal needs to work.  I truely hope they fix the issues as its a great concept, and I will gladly pay more for a new improved unit.  I might even buy one again if you guys figure out the issues and find a way to mod the hoax into a useable pedal. 

[Eb7+9]

sounds like bad foot-switches

... no need to get all upset

~jc

[stopstopsmile]

Even when the pedal is on the pedal was hissing humming and just full of white noise that was louder than the effect. Would the footswitch caus this?

[Eb7+9]

yes, that simul-noise thing happened last year in one of my SRV boosters // in fact it came back twice with the same problem - weird / not fun ... if the switch wasn't adequately manufactured all it takes is someone pressing hard once or twice to throw off the contacts ...

[A.S.P.]

information lost...

[Paul Perry (Frostwave)]

I think the FH *is* a DIY issue, if there is a common fault that we here can identify & fix. Because, if MODS are Ok in DIY, then...! Plus, if (and I very much doubt it, but I am prepared to learn!) there is an actual switch problem, then all of us as switch users need to be aware of it.

[bwanasonic]

However do I think, that the F.H. is not a DIY-issue.

The relation of one of the forum members to the creation of this pedal gives it honorary DIY status IMO. 

http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=38253.msg270729#msg270729

Kerry M

[A.S.P.]

information lost...

[PharaohAmps]

I had two Flanger Hoaxes in the shop as soon as they started shipping.  One I sold, the other I kept.  Noisy?  Yes.  But not noisier than many other analog delay based pedals.  The one I kept is on my "fun" pedalboard here at the shop, and it's not too noisy at all.  It may be a problem with the trimmers inside the unit, or it might be a component issue, but I'd like to say that they aren't ALL like that.  It's a great pedal and I'd buy another one tomorrow if I needed another flanger.

Matt Farrow

[Peter Snowberg]

Notice the PCB is labeled "Foxy Mistress". 

Ton. nice to see you embrace SMD. 

In developemnt, was this the "St~ Mrs."?

[PenPen]

Err, from that modezero page:

"Unfortunately, there is also one serious problem: the FH is very, very noisy.  Electro-Harmonix' early delay-based devices were infamously noisy, and the FH preserves and possibly even advances that tradition, although it doesn't sound anything like vintage E-H pedals like the Mistresses or the Poly Flange.  When the Blend control is set to full-wet, where most of the interesting TZF and sound-warpage effects are found, the FH emits a wall of hiss that even an external noise gate is hard pressed to disguise.  Of course, full-wet is the worst case for a BBD-based device, but the FH is bad even by "BBD standards."  Sweeping the delays, either manually or with the Modulator, shows that the amount of hiss is dependent on the delay time, and worst at short delays.  Oddly enough, other typical "BBD problems," such as distortion and clock whine, are less obvious than in many analog delay effects, and the FH generally avoids the pitfalls inherent in a TZF design, such as sonic garbage due to intermodulation products from two different clock frequencies.   But depending on the source material, the hiss can be anything from just-tolerable to excruciating, and is a major flaw in an otherwise fascinating box.  It's hard to tell if this was a tradeoff to avoid a dull-sounding, heavily filtered effect, an attempt to keep the cost down, or something else."

Hiss appears to be inherent in the design, and unavoidable.

[Mark Hammer]

Two things are gnawing at me in this thread.  One is that I know Ton reflexively pays attention to the inherent weaknesses and Achilles heels of BBD-based circuits and knows how to remedy them.  I could sooner see George Bush following Phish around the country in a "hippie van" than imagine Ton submitting a design that had interesting performance features...if you were willing to look the other way as far as noise goes (and quite frankly, E-H has a lot to lose by marketing something so ambitious and doing it poorly). 

The other thing is that I'm pretty confident that development work on this was NOT done with SMT components, and more than likely the boards were produced on foreign shores (though when the design emerges in Germany, and the company is based in NYC, it's hard to say what "foreign shores" means anymore ).  So, if multiple independent reports suggest strongly that noise is too common an issue to simply be a one-off, are we really looking at the outcome of having a board made by a contractor who has paid insufficient attention to noise issues during layout or component selection?  I'm certainly NOT going to cast aspersions on Taiwanese or Hong Kong PCB manufacturers because, quite frankly, my computers have worked very nicely, thank you, as have most of my electronic appliances.  But it would not be the first time that anyone had contracting woes, and only discovered problems AFTER the stuff came in for final assembly just under the wire for a trade show.

As I've suggested earlier, I really wish we could hear from Ton on this, but: a) he is NOT an E-H spokesperson, and understandably does not wish to present himself as such, b) if there IS any failure by a contractor to live up to the quality-control terms of the agreement with E-H, it is not something that any of the possible litigants (or their *perceived* representatives) can discuss publically****.  Certainly well-founded complaints and case reports here can form the evidenciary basis for lodging a complaint against the contractor (again, assuming there was one), but only 3rd parties (i.e., consumers) may really comment on them).

More importantly, as something he obviously worked very, very hard on, and put some of his best and most adventurous thinking into, I can't possibly imagine Ton or anyone being completely dispassionate in discussing any possible difficulties with the pedal, especially so soon after product launch.  Mr. B has *always* been a gentleman and generous to us here, and I find it painful to see threads like this one, even when there may be some justification, simply because I consider him a friend at this point.

****Please note:  I am NOT suggesting this is going on, and please don't anyone take it that way.  But, in the event that ANY manufacturer had a gripe against a supplier or contractor, they would not talk about it here.

[puretube]

[EDIT] after working on this reply for over 1.5  12 hours: ( )
http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1059964
DIY:
reply#44
as one can see in that thread (and not only in that one...)
any talk about that pedal seems not to be appreciated too much...

and since I have to fight more and more "404`s" here...

[StephenGiles]

But why on earth did you by it in the first place? Did you not try it out in the shop? I never ever by an amp or effect without trying it first. The reverb was defective in my Carvin amp so I got 25% off the price.
Stephen

[vanhansen]

I got to try a Flanger Hoax at the Arlington Guitar Show last month.  The one that was out to tinker with was pretty darn quiet, minimal hiss, which I think came more from the Bulldog than the Flanger.  I was very impressed by it.  Too bad I'm on a spending freeze at the moment. 

[petemoore]

I got it in and it was unuseable.  I don't believe EH built it properly, thanks EH.
  Are you affiliated? This sounds like an endorsement.
  Have you tried contacting the company, I believe a forum member actually worked on the design of this circuit...are you looking for help? or just venting? or...what is the intent of posting that, here? Catch more flies with honey.
  I'm sorry you are so dissatisfied.
  In bypass there was a ton of noise hiss and hum, when turning the unit on this noise only got louder and overshadowed the effect. Usually when this happens 'they' call it a 'problem'...sounds like one to me.
I returned it for another and the same thing happend on the new version.  The pedal is a mess.
  "In bypass there was a ton of noise hiss and hum"...for this to be the case with two models is about uncanny luck to my reckoning, sounds like a defect or other *external problem, I really doubt a 'feature' such as this would be the intention of the builders, thanking them for it at this point is a bit premature, channeling damaging energy into getting yourself a box you're happy with is what I suggest, if you have an issue with EH, take it up with them, perhaps you've got terrible luck, perhaps there is nothing actually wrong with those pedals. As far as the bypass noise, as described, there must be something else going on, to post like every pedal is unusable is harsh and quite likely undeserved, I particarly don't like the tone of it, I understand you're having a total drag time of it, but I doubt that's the bottom line of this story, I'm fairly certain the design of the bypass can be made usable, I've read already that pedals of this type have 'normal' noise...there's alot going on in the big circuit, when not bypassed I'd imagine some noise is common among these types...etc.
  I was hoping it would work as I need a pedal that can do chorus, leslie tones, flanger and phaser this pedal seemed to have it all but its a giant dissappointment. 
  I am wondering has anyone figured out the *problems with these units? 
  You seem to have *plenty for all of us in your first short post. It sounds to me like you've given up on it already, now you want solutions?
  And can anyone reccomend an alternative to the flanger hoax?
  Can, but won't. You can if you want, if you don't know what they are [I imagine you do, since you tried, twice, to get a good, working, 'grandaddy of them all'], check reviews at HC, look at MF, and GC, also Sam Ash...there is plenty of competition.
  My guess is that this is a competitive product, has it's very strong points and probably some noise when it's *working right, and being used as intended.