SRV "the sky is crying" sound? HOWTO?

[vanhansen]

I thought about this some more this morning.  And yes, Ricky and Pete are right on.  There's no pedals, there's loud amps, good speakers, lots of headroom.  However, a way to get that crying sound without a pedal would be to lower your action on the plain strings a tad, almost on the verge of fret buzz, then attack the strings hard when playing.  The hard attack would make the strings lightly fret out making that high frequency cry occur.  That may just be what made that sound happen in the first place.  Just a thought considering so much goes in to achieving a certain tone or sound when the method is sometimes right under our nose. 

[Paul Marossy]

Hmm... what pedal would I use to turn into Joe Satriani?! 

Sorry, I don't mean to be condescending or anything. It's like RDV and Pete are saying - there's more to it than just plugging into this or that pedal. When he did use a pedal, it was usually an Ibanez Tube Screamer (TS-808 or TS-9, I can't remember for sure).

[RDV]

Vanhansen is very close. With the action pretty low, when you do a whole note(or further) bend on an old strat like SRV's the neck has a very rounded radius thus the vibrating string might make slight contact with the next couple of frets creating overtones that might be descibed as 'crying notes'.

RDV

[wampcat1]

Vanhansen is very close. With the action pretty low, when you do a whole note(or further) bend on an old strat like SRV's the neck has a very rounded radius thus the vibrating string might make slight contact with the next couple of frets creating overtones that might be descibed as 'crying notes'.

RDV

Also, as I was playing my strat a bit ago I remembered the low filter cap on the volume pot -- I'm sure SRV had his volume rolled down a touch. This would roll off the bass and leave a nice crispy tone in an already trebly rig. Also, if you do some www searches you can find some interviews with folks who have teched for him (I know one of them personally, I'm sure many of the other builders do too). Apparantly SRV liked the treble turned WAYYYY up, especially when the TS was being used.

Hope that helps!
Brian

[wampcat1]

I thought about this some more this morning.  And yes, Ricky and Pete are right on.  There's no pedals, there's loud amps, good speakers, lots of headroom.  However, a way to get that crying sound without a pedal would be to lower your action on the plain strings a tad, almost on the verge of fret buzz, then attack the strings hard when playing.  The hard attack would make the strings lightly fret out making that high frequency cry occur.  That may just be what made that sound happen in the first place.  Just a thought considering so much goes in to achieving a certain tone or sound when the method is sometimes right under our nose. 

Also Erik, IIRC I think SRV liked his action quite high - he liked to 'wrestle' with the guitar so to speak. I know that's not what you are implying (that he had low action) but I thought I'd just throw that in there in case anyone is trying to figure out how to sound like him.

[vanhansen]

I thought about this some more this morning.  And yes, Ricky and Pete are right on.  There's no pedals, there's loud amps, good speakers, lots of headroom.  However, a way to get that crying sound without a pedal would be to lower your action on the plain strings a tad, almost on the verge of fret buzz, then attack the strings hard when playing.  The hard attack would make the strings lightly fret out making that high frequency cry occur.  That may just be what made that sound happen in the first place.  Just a thought considering so much goes in to achieving a certain tone or sound when the method is sometimes right under our nose. 

Also Erik, IIRC I think SRV liked his action quite high - he liked to 'wrestle' with the guitar so to speak. I know that's not what you are implying (that he had low action) but I thought I'd just throw that in there in case anyone is trying to figure out how to sound like him.

Hey, Brian.  Yes, I knew he used high action.  It allowed the strings to ring better and I've actually noticed a bit better of a tone with the action a little higher than I like it but I've found a comprimise in between the two.  "Wrestle" is almost an understatement...LOL  More like attack it like a starving gorilla after a pile of bananas. 

I have a PDF of an interview with Cesar Diaz from the ToneQuest Report.  One of the best I've read.

[wampcat1]

I thought about this some more this morning.  And yes, Ricky and Pete are right on.  There's no pedals, there's loud amps, good speakers, lots of headroom.  However, a way to get that crying sound without a pedal would be to lower your action on the plain strings a tad, almost on the verge of fret buzz, then attack the strings hard when playing.  The hard attack would make the strings lightly fret out making that high frequency cry occur.  That may just be what made that sound happen in the first place.  Just a thought considering so much goes in to achieving a certain tone or sound when the method is sometimes right under our nose. 

Also Erik, IIRC I think SRV liked his action quite high - he liked to 'wrestle' with the guitar so to speak. I know that's not what you are implying (that he had low action) but I thought I'd just throw that in there in case anyone is trying to figure out how to sound like him.

Hey, Brian.  Yes, I knew he used high action.  It allowed the strings to ring better and I've actually noticed a bit better of a tone with the action a little higher than I like it but I've found a comprimise in between the two.  "Wrestle" is almost an understatement...LOL  More like attack it like a starving gorilla after a pile of bananas. 

I have a PDF of an interview with Cesar Diaz from the ToneQuest Report.  One of the best I've read.

Good analogy!
I missed the Cesar Diaz interview, can I download it from tonequest?

Thanks,
Brian

[vanhansen]

I thought about this some more this morning.  And yes, Ricky and Pete are right on.  There's no pedals, there's loud amps, good speakers, lots of headroom.  However, a way to get that crying sound without a pedal would be to lower your action on the plain strings a tad, almost on the verge of fret buzz, then attack the strings hard when playing.  The hard attack would make the strings lightly fret out making that high frequency cry occur.  That may just be what made that sound happen in the first place.  Just a thought considering so much goes in to achieving a certain tone or sound when the method is sometimes right under our nose. 

Also Erik, IIRC I think SRV liked his action quite high - he liked to 'wrestle' with the guitar so to speak. I know that's not what you are implying (that he had low action) but I thought I'd just throw that in there in case anyone is trying to figure out how to sound like him.

Hey, Brian.  Yes, I knew he used high action.  It allowed the strings to ring better and I've actually noticed a bit better of a tone with the action a little higher than I like it but I've found a comprimise in between the two.  "Wrestle" is almost an understatement...LOL  More like attack it like a starving gorilla after a pile of bananas. 

I have a PDF of an interview with Cesar Diaz from the ToneQuest Report.  One of the best I've read.

Good analogy!
I missed the Cesar Diaz interview, can I download it from tonequest?

Thanks,
Brian

I don't know if it's still up there or not.  I have it at home so I'll forward it on to you tonight.  Just got your latest newsletter so I'll use your email addy from that.

[JimRayden]

I thought about this some more this morning.  And yes, Ricky and Pete are right on.  There's no pedals, there's loud amps, good speakers, lots of headroom.  However, a way to get that crying sound without a pedal would be to lower your action on the plain strings a tad, almost on the verge of fret buzz, then attack the strings hard when playing.  The hard attack would make the strings lightly fret out making that high frequency cry occur.  That may just be what made that sound happen in the first place.  Just a thought considering so much goes in to achieving a certain tone or sound when the method is sometimes right under our nose. 

Also Erik, IIRC I think SRV liked his action quite high - he liked to 'wrestle' with the guitar so to speak. I know that's not what you are implying (that he had low action) but I thought I'd just throw that in there in case anyone is trying to figure out how to sound like him.

Hey, Brian.  Yes, I knew he used high action.  It allowed the strings to ring better and I've actually noticed a bit better of a tone with the action a little higher than I like it but I've found a comprimise in between the two.  "Wrestle" is almost an understatement...LOL  More like attack it like a starving gorilla after a pile of bananas. 

I have a PDF of an interview with Cesar Diaz from the ToneQuest Report.  One of the best I've read.

Good analogy!
I missed the Cesar Diaz interview, can I download it from tonequest?

Thanks,
Brian

I don't know if it's still up there or not.  I have it at home so I'll forward it on to you tonight.  Just got your latest newsletter so I'll use your email addy from that.

Hmm, I wonder what's the quote-in-quote record of this forum...

------------
Jimbo

[wampcat1]

I don't know if it's still up there or not.  I have it at home so I'll forward it on to you tonight.  Just got your latest newsletter so I'll use your email addy from that.

Alternative: http://www.michaelhoover.org/sysadmin/images/java.jpg



Thanks!

[puretube]

Hmm, I wonder what's the quote-in-quote record of this forum...

it was a now locked thread...

this one is getting "loungy", too 

[ildar]

You wanna play like that?
Then LEARN to play like that.

RDV

Amen brother.

[cbriere]

You wanna play like that?
Then LEARN to play like that.

RDV

Amen brother.

Seems that some questions cannot be asked here? humm.
The best answer i got here is regarding the pinched harmonix
coming from the hard banging of the note.
I'm still puzzle, listenning to this song, i can hear
some sweet spots of the notes he played that produced
a change in sound.
My conclusions for now are this tone change ( or crying sound)
would be generated by a pick and thumb pinched harmonix.
This is done in a subtle way , not as intense as Roy Buchanon.
BUT ( that is where i am searching)
also there is some accentuation coming from the setup
(amp-speaker-room) of these notes.

I know i am in the details but...
most probably i should abandon this search and keep the
"learn to play like this" comments. But i know the setup can
help accentuate this 'reaction' fro the setup.

[wampcat1]

You wanna play like that?
Then LEARN to play like that.

RDV

Amen brother.

Seems that some questions cannot be asked here? humm.
The best answer i got here is regarding the pinched harmonix
coming from the hard banging of the note.
I'm still puzzle, listenning to this song, i can hear
some sweet spots of the notes he played that produced
a change in sound.

No, any question can be asked here, but you are never going to find a pedal that takes the place of talent, practice and persistence! 

[ncc]

Hello,
Is this the interview that was mentioned earlier in this thread?

http://www.tonequest.com/pdf_pubs/samples/TQRDiaz.pdf

NCC

[vanhansen]

Hello,
Is this the interview that was mentioned earlier in this thread?

http://www.tonequest.com/pdf_pubs/samples/TQRDiaz.pdf

NCC

Yeppers.  Sure is.  Thanks for finding that link.

Brian, did you get my email last night with it attached?

[petemoore]

  Seems that some questions cannot be asked here?
  >It sure does. Harumphh. Disappointed ?
  "The best answer i got here is regarding the pinched harmonix
coming from the hard banging of the note."
  Yupp, that's typed down, all of the other infopinions were notably inferior by comparison.
  We are narrow and nearly useless to you ?
 

[cbriere]

  Seems that some questions cannot be asked here?
  >It sure does. Harumphh. Disappointed ?

  "The best answer i got here is regarding the pinched harmonix
coming from the hard banging of the note."
  Yupp, that's typed down, all of the other infopinions were notably inferior by comparison.
  We are narrow and nearly useless to you ?
 

No, not diseapointed,
but i expect more imagination, on a designer point of view,
i think it is my mistake was to ask for a pedal to reproduce this sound.
This sentence seems to stop the discussion by throwing the easy answer :"learn to play!"

[cbriere]

just finished reading the Mr.Diaz interview, sent by .pdf,  thanks,,,
The article kind of  reinsure me, when Mr. Diaz say that
they tuned the amps setup, even chage the tubes and re-biais
depending of what song they recorded.
This means even SRV needed some help from his tools
to acheive the right sound. So can i conclude, the sound is not all the hand?

[vanhansen]

So can i conclude, the sound is not all the hand?

Most definitely.  But it does have something to do with it.

There's plenty of stories out there of guys like SRV, EVH and EJ plugging in to whatever is around yet still sounding like them.  Their tools (guitars, amps, pickups, effects) just happen to help shape their sound, or chisel away the rough edges so to speak.  But their tone starts from them.  Call it magic, call it mojo.  I call it being gifted.