Should builders share their circuits?

[varialbender]

Sorry if this might be the wrong place, but I figured since it involves a design I might like to share with this section, it might make sense here.
I'm hoping to cross over into builder territory pretty soon with a design I'm working on now, and I think it's pretty fantastic, and is partly due to this community, and feel like I want to share the design, but I'm not sure if that's a good idea or not.
I'm leaning towards doing it, since I don't think people would decide not to buy the product just because they could DIY it, seeing as how the overlap of DIY and consumer isn't very large. I know I have never decided not to buy something just because I could build it.
What do you think? Good idea?

PS the schem I'm working on is a trem/ringmod, as some of you may already know.

[burnt fingers]

That's a tough call and completely up to you.  A lot of people share a lot of stuff here and it certainly is benificial to us.  If you are thinking about selling the circuit however,you have to consider the prospect of someone more established in the business getting their hands on the schem and producing a similar ( read clone) product. 

My .02

[KerryF]

I think on this forum, sharing things is fine.  People on here are very generous and nice and they wont do anything with it if you dont want it.  Most other forums I wouldnt do it, but people on here are nice and stuff so I think its safe  .

[tiges_ tendres]

I think on this forum, sharing things is fine.  People on here are very generous and nice and they wont do anything with it if you dont want it.  Most other forums I wouldnt do it, but people on here are nice and stuff so I think its safe  .

one word:



Lurkers

[burnt fingers]

another word


Fatboost

[Gilles C]

Even when builders don't share their schematics, sometimes they end up on the web somewhere, posted by someone who bought it and traced the schematic from it.

But it's easier to asked them to take the schematic off if you never posted it yourself before I suppose.

I would suggest that you keep it for yourself if you really have a special circuit. You will be able to sell more before someone finds out how you made it. And it could be important if you want to make some money from it.

Gilles

[lumpymusic]

... don't think people would decide not to buy the product just because they
could DIY it, seeing as how the overlap of DIY and consumer isn't very large.
I know I have never decided not to buy something just because I could build it.
What do you think? Good idea?...

I think that is very accurate thinking. The schematics for my PC,
my car, my clock, my guitar(s) are all readily available. But the
miniscule amount of people who will attempt (and complete)
building any of them will never put a dent in the supply/demand
for the pre-assembled product.

Like most things, it's virtually always cheaper to buy the commercial
version of a pedal than it is to make your own.

Boss, Keeley, Dunlop etc schematics, even detailed plans, are all
available. But it's not slowing those guys down.

Lumpy

[davebungo]

I would only say that there is no rule which states that because you learn from this site it automatically places an obligation on you to post your circuits.  If you're a bit cagey about it then don't post it.  Put it this way: if you had never mentioned the fact that you have your own original circuit, then no-one would be any the wiser would they?

There are many ways to contribute to this site, one of the most common and helpful ways is to help out other people with their circuits or projects when they run into difficulty or require an opinion.

Some people like to publish all their stuff because it makes them feel good to do so (or perhaps they can earn a little cash from selling kits etc.) and others just hang around and help out with little snippets of useful knowledge whilst keeping their own work private.  No-one, as far as I'm aware (myself included) has a problem with that.

There may be lurkers but who knows or cares?

[amz-fx]

I just recently noticed that Rane, which previously had posted schematics to their products, did not have any posted for their newest designs. One has to wonder why the change in philosophy...

regards, Jack

[petemoore]

   Yes, you should post the schematic, in your case, because you've asked.

[g.e.o]

i agree with call1800ksmyazz and gilles c. we do need gestures like this and still, if u dont do it maybe someday u will see it on the web. the thing is to enjoy what u do and make other people happy. we share coz we r a team here. and i mean it. we may not know each other but we help each other. its totaly up to u though. all i can give u as an advice is what Pete Cornish told me "the design is the most important thing. when u have a perfect design, u have a perfect sound quality pedal. with a perfect design it can still work without any parts on it"  .

take care

George

[KerryF]

^-yea.  i mean if you look at topics on here, people arent happy with a pedal, and people on here give ideas for modding it.  if you dont like your pedal in even minimal ways, people on here can fix that.  also, you may have something there that could potentialy damage part in the pedal.  for example maybe you have something with MOSfets, and the MOSfets arent protected.  the pedal works at first, but after a while the MOSfet becomes damaged from not being protected.  you cant find the problem though.  this could happen with other things too.

[idlechatterbox]

Seems like two separate questions:
1. is there a moral obligation to share?

2. is there a direct connection between sharing and profits?

The first one's complicated enough, since someone's willingness to be generous with ideas and plans could change once you start making millions off of your pedal. Do you have an obligation if you're only planning on selling a few is a different question from whether you have an obligation once you get to be the Bill Gates of effects pedals.

The second one is complicated just because there's so much more assumption than evidence to go on. The fact that Dell can't do much to stop me from cloning one of its laptops isn't the same as saying that Dell will or won't lose money if I am successful. It's also worth something that DIYers might be willing to lose money on making a pedal they could have bought. They lose money, sure, but so does Boss. The case of guitars is even more complex. Gibson is still in business, despite the 100s of chinese made "Gibsons," but not even gibson or the chinese know what economic effect those knockoffs really have, and I suspect that even if Gibson puts on a brave face in public, it has reps in DC pushing for tougher piracy laws.

I've seen disclaimers about copyright and fair-use on other forums (not guitar related). I say that realizing that, as others have said, one of the things that sets this forum apart is the way that people are generous with their advice and ideas. It would be shame to change that, in my view. But it's also true that I will happily be able to avoid such issues, since I've neither the interest nor the talent to create my own design for $.

Just my two cents 

[darron]

consider the hotcake though. it has an amazing reputation, for good reason. i've never heard of somebody being able to pull off a clone of it? he does a good job of keeping his secrets...

[StephenGiles]

Yes, definitely otherwise that idiot Pope might be cross with you too!!!

[Marcos - Munky]

Actually, there's a Hotcake schematic floating around...

About to share or not to share the schematic, it's all up to you. If you feel you want to share your ideas, then share it. If you feel you want to keep your secret with you, then don't share. If you want to share it in a more secure way, I suggest you to do the same thing Doug Hammond did with his Highway 89, ask for the people who wants the schematic to e-mail him and don't post anything anywhere that will allow to do a complete build without the schematic.

[petemoore]

  Security is something that no-one else knows about.
  If you have security about things everyone knows about, then that's one of the few exceptions, I suppose you don't.
  Just posting the schematic with your name and date on it here, will be noticed by those paying attention...it may not be relevant in a contest, but it certainly does attach/cement the three items [schematic/name/date]...not to say they can't then later be $eparated for 'private use'...the 'attention payers' will at least know whappenned, and the design will be noted as 'yours'...probably 'permanently', a while for certain.
  Very few of us here are actually good at 'contests', I just post 'the design' with name and date, then let the chips fall where they will. I'm not interested in falling giants, or legal protection battles...if figure if a giant wants to rip me off, the only thing I can do is throw stones around it's ankles hoping it falls, and say 'it ripped me off'...ie I haven't passed a bar exam, don't have years to battle over rights...or huge piles of 'protection money' to pay for such legal services.

[markm]

You're probably better off playing your cards close to your chest on this one.
With that said, if the "assistance" from this group helped with the design or there is a similarity in your circuit to someone else's,
that becomes an etirely different issue.
Think about the "Creamy Dreamer" thing or whatever it was called, the story goes that it was a Big-Muff with mods and suggestions
from the veteran members of this board. I think it created some ill-feelings here but I can't speak for those fellas as I only know from the posts I have read concerning the matter.
Something to think about. 

[aron]

If you want to become one of the people that share their designs and take delight in other people building and enjoying your circuit, then do it.

If you think you are going to become totally rich making these things and think you have invented something that no one else has, then patent it and mass produce it; and good luck.

If you don't patent it, (and even if you do), there's a strong possibility that others (makers) will copy and use your design anyway after they have reverse engineered it. The only way to really keep it secret is to not share. Just keep it to yourself and yourself only.

Most people have chosen to share here, but it doesn't mean you have to.

[varialbender]

I'm thinking I'll probably ask for a few willing to help check over my schematic, and email it to them, and have it kept private for a little while, then once I'm well on my way, I'll post it for the public here.
Concerning how much of this design is due to this forum: I learned how building blocks work here, but I mashed them together in a way I doubt anyone else would. I dreamt the circuit up, then learned how to build it here, basically. The biggest influence from forumites was stuff like recommended ring mod chips.
I hope I finish it soon, so I'm not just talking for nothing