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DIYstompboxes.com  |  DIY Stompboxes  |  Building your own stompbox  |  Tube boost + overdrive running off a 9 volt battery 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. « previous next »
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Author Topic: Tube boost + overdrive running off a 9 volt battery  (Read 902073 times)
rugeb
Posts: 54



Re: Tube boost + overdrive running off a 9 volt battery
« Reply #2860 on: March 05, 2012, 12:42:33 PM »

Had a wicked hum in my valvy, didn't matter what PS I used or where in the house I was using it.  I simply added a 7812 rectifier with (2) 220uF caps (one from the dc jack to ground, the other from power out to ground) and my valvy is SILENT.  Dead silent.  I just thought I'd throw that out there in case anyone else was having an issue. 

Ok runmikeyrun: Tested!  Wink
Now, the schematic:
 

 

Right hand side cap is backwards.

 
Yes, physically... of course!, but the negative (ground) it's marked: WITH GREEN TRACE to avoid problems.
 
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Ark Angel HFB
Posts: 154


Bow to mine...


Re: Tube boost + overdrive
« Reply #2861 on: March 06, 2012, 03:34:21 AM »

O_O.... it took three days... I may very well have failed a Class... but damn it I've read the whole thread.

and ordered some tubes which should get here soon... having never done anything like this, my mind keeps changing in what I'm making but due to a recent changing of tubes in my blackstar amp and pedal I've got some extra tubes anyway...

Since I've never done this before and I'm always one to shot for the moon... why not try my hand at a triple master... and have each section true bypassed... also maybe a master true-by-pass for the second and third section. Run the whole thing as hot(volts on plates wise) as reasonable(12.6 to 25.2) volts... Cut the ton pots for (3)(switches bass-cut/flat/treble-cut) and hope that it will give me enough options to keep things from sounding flubby...

Of Course will have to get a good PS... probably something with more than 12.6vDC then regulate it down for the heaters and send the rest on to the circuit. running three of them will mean I should need at least 1500ma to run this thing right? (As I've said I have no clue what the hell I'm talking about so the second I say something wrong jump in...)

Also the PS needs to be regulated and filtered... I think... >_>

Tubes will probably be two 12au7 and one 12ax7... since from reading the forum the 12ax7 doesn't give as much volume boost but does seem to give a good gain boost... it placed at the end would allow for a really nice final push in gain that leads to full saturation and complete tube distortion... lastly avoid JJs as they don't seem to like the low volts...

I shall call it...

Ark's School of Rock
First Master     = School of Clean Boost...   icon_smile
Second Master = School of Over Drive...   Cool
Third Master    = School of Distortion...    icon_twisted

For one can not rock... If one does not rock loud! (School's motto get used to it your stuck with it for four years.)


Final thoughts?
« Last Edit: March 06, 2012, 03:57:54 AM by Ark Angel HFB » Logged

"..So I hooked up the power and it was the greatest Radio I'd ever heard. Too bad I was trying to make a Tremolo..."
thereminator
Posts: 10


Re: Tube boost + overdrive running off a 9 volt battery
« Reply #2862 on: March 06, 2012, 08:14:17 AM »

Had a wicked hum in my valvy, didn't matter what PS I used or where in the house I was using it.  I simply added a 7812 rectifier with (2) 220uF caps (one from the dc jack to ground, the other from power out to ground) and my valvy is SILENT.  Dead silent.  I just thought I'd throw that out there in case anyone else was having an issue.  

Ok runmikeyrun: Tested!  Wink
Now, the schematic:
 


For 7812 voltage regulator VIN+ must be atleast 14.5V.  

http://www.datasheetcatalog.org/datasheets/150/44435_DS.pdf
« Last Edit: March 07, 2012, 02:46:11 AM by thereminator » Logged
rugeb
Posts: 54



Re: Tube boost + overdrive running off a 9 volt battery
« Reply #2863 on: March 06, 2012, 11:31:05 AM »

Had a wicked hum in my valvy, didn't matter what PS I used or where in the house I was using it.  I simply added a 7812 rectifier with (2) 220uF caps (one from the dc jack to ground, the other from power out to ground) and my valvy is SILENT.  Dead silent.  I just thought I'd throw that out there in case anyone else was having an issue.  

Ok runmikeyrun: Tested!  Wink
Now, the schematic:
 


For 7812 viltage regulator VIN+ must be atleast 14.5V.  


Ok!
I haven't problem: my power supply is with regulated voltage.

EDIT:
Schematic Power Supply with regulated voltage (1000mA):


« Last Edit: March 06, 2012, 11:59:40 AM by rugeb » Logged
candletears7
Posts: 26


Re: Tube boost + overdrive running off a 9 volt battery
« Reply #2864 on: March 06, 2012, 04:15:33 PM »

Still reading through the posts here regarding hum reduction, and a couple other points...

Q1) If my Cioks is well regulated, I shouldn't need the hum reduction circuit? I guess the proof will be in the pudding - whether I hear hum or not. The next 2 questions are more important...

Q2) How important is the buffer on the end of the circuit as shown in some examples, EG: the Boobtube. Why would this be used?

Q3) Specifically regarding the sound, how important are the different voltages being supplied to heaters and the plates? Will it for example smooth the sound out, or simply provide more headroom overall?
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Jdansti
Posts: 4373


John


Re: Tube boost + overdrive running off a 9 volt battery
« Reply #2865 on: March 07, 2012, 02:29:52 AM »

Still reading through the posts here regarding hum reduction, and a couple other points...

Q1) If my Cioks is well regulated, I shouldn't need the hum reduction circuit? I guess the proof will be in the pudding - whether I hear hum or not. The next 2 questions are more important...

Q2) How important is the buffer on the end of the circuit as shown in some examples, EG: the Boobtube. Why would this be used?

Q3) Specifically regarding the sound, how important are the different voltages being supplied to heaters and the plates? Will it for example smooth the sound out, or simply provide more headroom overall?

Hi-
I just built one that was close to "stock" so I'll try to answer your questions based on my experience:

Q1) I agree- See how it sounds first and go from there. I used a cheap wall wart with 12vdc out and it works great. I started off with a rectifier and LM317 variable voltage regulator running off of a 20vac wall wart, but after burning my hand on the heat sink, I decided I didn't want to put an oven inside of my enclosure.

Q2)  Mine is fine without a buffer. Kinda' the same as Q1-See how it sounds first and modify based on your tastes.

Q3) The heater voltages are very important. Try to keep the voltage across pins 4-5 less than 12vdc. I'm using 12vdc on the anode, but others have said that they prefer a higher voltage. Again, you might want to start with 12 and see how you like it. You'll have 12 anyway for the heaters, so why not try 12 on the anode to start with?

A few mods I made:

1) I used a rotary switch to provide 4 different cap values on the input.
2) I used a trim pot for R2 and dialed in the amount of "cleaness" I wanted when the gain is all of the way down.
3) I added a switch to turn the tone control on and off.
4) I am currently experimenting with clipping diodes and capacitors on the output to modify the distortion.

Sounds like you've thought this through well. I wish you good luck!
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R.G. Keene: EXPECT there to be errors, and defeat them...
thereminator
Posts: 10


Re: Tube boost + overdrive running off a 9 volt battery
« Reply #2866 on: March 07, 2012, 02:55:58 AM »


Q3) The heater voltages are very important. Try to keep the voltage across pins 4-5 less than 12vdc. I'm using 12vdc on the anode, but others have said that they prefer a higher voltage. Again, you might want to start with 12 and see how you like it. You'll have 12 anyway for the heaters, so why not try 12 on the anode to start with?

Voltage across 4-5 pins must be 12,6V (+/- 5%). Too high or too low heater voltage can damage cathode.
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rugeb
Posts: 54



Re: Tube boost + overdrive running off a 9 volt battery
« Reply #2867 on: March 07, 2012, 07:16:10 AM »

Schematic with last mods:
 

 
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Jdansti
Posts: 4373


John


Re: Tube boost + overdrive running off a 9 volt battery
« Reply #2868 on: March 07, 2012, 01:57:22 PM »

Schematic with last mods:
 

 


Looks nice Rugeb. I notice that you are using symmetrical clipping. Have you tried asymmetric?  Also, I found that at least one pedal manufacturer uses a 51pf cap in parallel with the clipping diodes to soften the clipping. Just curious if you've tried either of those mods.
« Last Edit: March 07, 2012, 02:04:07 PM by Jdansti » Logged

R.G. Keene: EXPECT there to be errors, and defeat them...
rugeb
Posts: 54



Re: Tube boost + overdrive running off a 9 volt battery
« Reply #2869 on: March 07, 2012, 03:30:20 PM »


Looks nice Rugeb. I notice that you are using symmetrical clipping. Have you tried asymmetric?  Also, I found that at least one pedal manufacturer uses a 51pf cap in parallel with the clipping diodes to soften the clipping. Just curious if you've tried either of those mods.
 
==============================================

Yes, I've seen it, but I have not tried this, but it may be interesting ...

EDIT:
You can substitute the diodes 1N4148 with RED LEDS or germanium diodes 1N34A, this will change the sound...
Thanks for comment!
« Last Edit: March 07, 2012, 04:53:30 PM by rugeb » Logged
rugeb
Posts: 54



Re: Tube boost + overdrive running off a 9 volt battery
« Reply #2870 on: March 07, 2012, 04:10:21 PM »

MOD INPUT CAP (2 VERSIONS):
 

 
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Ark Angel HFB
Posts: 154


Bow to mine...


Re: Tube boost + overdrive running off a 9 volt battery
« Reply #2871 on: March 09, 2012, 01:35:37 AM »

So guys... I'd like to run the one I'm going to make at high voltage...

from reading this thread I understand that the heaters need 12.6 volts...

So...

would it be better to get a 12 volt PS and then just voltage pump a few times the rest of the circuit.

or... get like a 15v of 16v PS regulate down for the heaters and then voltage double to something like 28 or 30?

Also what kinda watts do I need to worry about when looking for a good PS.

Sorry I know a lot of stuff in this thread covers what to do to get good power but watts were never covered and I'd like to cover my bases.
Logged

"..So I hooked up the power and it was the greatest Radio I'd ever heard. Too bad I was trying to make a Tremolo..."
iccaros
Posts: 1145


Steve H. - Lesser Seattle Area


Re: Tube boost + overdrive running off a 9 volt battery
« Reply #2872 on: March 09, 2012, 05:46:55 AM »

So guys... I'd like to run the one I'm going to make at high voltage...

from reading this thread I understand that the heaters need 12.6 volts...

So...

would it be better to get a 12 volt PS and then just voltage pump a few times the rest of the circuit.

or... get like a 15v of 16v PS regulate down for the heaters and then voltage double to something like 28 or 30?

Also what kinda watts do I need to worry about when looking for a good PS.

Sorry I know a lot of stuff in this thread covers what to do to get good power but watts were never covered and I'd like to cover my bases.

my measurements of this design show it pulls with a 12au7 3ma, and a 12ax7 1 -2 ma. So I use a voltage multiplier to take 12v to 60v.  The multiplier is simple 2 transistors as a oscillator with two more for current feed. a ladder of caps and diodes. all of this on perf fits between the stomp switch and the bottom the box.  http://www.sm0vpo.com/power/vconv_01.htm
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rugeb
Posts: 54



Re: Tube boost + overdrive running off a 9 volt battery
« Reply #2873 on: March 09, 2012, 11:20:17 AM »

I finished my Valve Overdrive 9V with some mods (tone & clipping switchable) with a very nice sounding fuzz.
It sounds great !
 

 
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texstrat
Posts: 134

Patrick


Re: Tube boost + overdrive running off a 9 volt battery
« Reply #2874 on: March 09, 2012, 03:05:45 PM »

I finished my Valve Overdrive 9V with some mods (tone & clipping switchable) with a very nice sounding fuzz.
It sounds great !
 

 


Any sound clips with the mods?
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Mustachio
Posts: 719


Jim


Re: Tube boost + overdrive running off a 9 volt battery
« Reply #2875 on: March 09, 2012, 06:05:42 PM »

I just bread boarded the valvecaster! just tested thru a lil battery amp to test if its working and it is!

I used this layout from Ren! read thru lots of this thread if not all of it and went thru Rens layout gallery thanks for all the work from everyone I love this project!

this is what I used

http://www.aronnelson.com/gallery/main.php/v/Renegadrian/Valvecaster-no-tone+6x8+diff_+plate+voltage.gif.html

I'm powering this with a dan electro 18v 150ma psu into a 7812 regulator and just running pin 5 to the 12v and 18v to the B+ in

I have a few questions

The dano wallwart Im using tests on my fluke and my cheap ddm at 28.4 volts. Is 150ma enough ?

I was going to use this

http://www.aronnelson.com/gallery/main.php/v/Renegadrian/40106+voltage+multiplier.gif.html

And I have all the parts on hand now for this multiplier my calcs say ill get 189.144 out of it

Is this safe for the circuit/tube ? data sheets for the 12ax7 I was looking at say 180v max for heater-cathode voltage and I think its pin 8 and 4 which is cathode(Cool and heater(4) are connected to the board with the 189v Im planning on putting into it . I just want to be sure before I do something bad... 

Also for the voltage multiplier I have a mix of 100v and 63v 47n caps is this ok ? or should they be rated over the voltage Im getting out of it ie over 189v same goes for the caps I have in the valvecaster, they are rated at 100v as well.

I feel like this is a stupid question because I always go by the rule of higher V rating caps then what Im feeding into it.  icon_redface

I haven't made anything at high voltage yet so I just wanted to ask some question first.

Big thanks to everyone in this thread!


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"Feed me or feed me to something, I just want to be part of the food chain"
Renegadrian
Posts: 2301


Adriano - Rome Italy


Re: Tube boost + overdrive running off a 9 volt battery
« Reply #2876 on: March 09, 2012, 06:23:41 PM »

Glad you like my layouts!!!
ok we start with some info here http://www.nj7p.org/Tube4.php?tube=12AU7
the tube eats 150 mA for the heaters and some more for the anodes...I guess you're a little under specs,but who knows...
I use a 1A WW so I'm outta trouble, but 150 mA...mmm...just try it man...
Sometimes if a circuit needs more amp. the voltage goes down a little, so it could work good just with some voltage sacrifice...

Also from the datasheet, the plates can hold up to 330 V so just go ahead! Just look at the schem and don't pay attention to cathodes (at least for what refers to voltage...) - voltage goes to the plates (anodes) of the ckt...
Don't worry and use the components you have...the 40106 voltage multiplier I built uses regular ceramic caps...but for what I read it wants nomore than18 V
« Last Edit: March 09, 2012, 06:28:07 PM by Renegadrian » Logged

Done an' workin'=Too many to mention - Tube addict!
Mustachio
Posts: 719


Jim


Re: Tube boost + overdrive running off a 9 volt battery
« Reply #2877 on: March 09, 2012, 07:26:06 PM »

Ok so I do have it built on breadboard and it works and sounds pretty good running off this dano WW. I measured it on the fluke and its putting out 28.7vdc and 770ma so that should be good! Even though the label says 18v and 150ma I geuss it lied heh.  Roll Eyes

I have some other psu's laying around from old printers and stuff but their output is 30VAC and I wasn't sure about using them.

Most of my ceramic caps are pretty high in voltage rating like 500v on average. I don't have any 47nf ceramics on hand just metal film box caps that are rated at 100v and one at 63v i have exactly 7 extra for the voltage multiplier. I just find it weird since normally you don't want to put more voltage into somethings rating. don't want any caps exploding in my face!I look so pretty this mustachio is my money maker! I could try it I'm just weary.

do you know off hand what your caps where rated ? If not don't worry to look, ill place a new order soon and get caps rated high.

I just got an old admiral 12au7 I have a 12bh7 coming in the mail now and I have a handfull of old mixed Ge and RCA 12ax7s from long long ago ! cant wait to test them all out ill post pics when its all done!

Thanks again for all the help and layouts !  icon_biggrin
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"Feed me or feed me to something, I just want to be part of the food chain"
Renegadrian
Posts: 2301


Adriano - Rome Italy


Re: Tube boost + overdrive running off a 9 volt battery
« Reply #2878 on: March 09, 2012, 09:11:00 PM »

Ok so I do have it built on breadboard and it works and sounds pretty good running off this dano WW. I measured it on the fluke and its putting out 28.7vdc and 770ma so that should be good! Even though the label says 18v and 150ma I geuss it lied heh.  Roll Eyes

I have some other psu's laying around from old printers and stuff but their output is 30VAC and I wasn't sure about using them.
If you have AC, you can put 12V AC on heaters and have a c0ckroft walton multiplier (diodes and caps)

Quote
Most of my ceramic caps are pretty high in voltage rating like 500v on average. I don't have any 47nf ceramics on hand just metal film box caps that are rated at 100v and one at 63v i have exactly 7 extra for the voltage multiplier.
do you know off hand what your caps where rated ? If not don't worry to look, ill place a new order soon and get caps rated high.
My ceramics haven't got the voltage written, only 473...Guess they're 63 or 100.
I suggest you to keep an eye at the voltage at the multiplier - google for the datasheet to see its maximum V in!

Quote
I just find it weird since normally you don't want to put more voltage into somethings rating. don't want any caps exploding in my face!I look so pretty this mustachio is my money maker! I could try it I'm just weary.
Now that made me laugh hard!  icon_biggrin

Quote
I just got an old admiral 12au7 I have a 12bh7 coming in the mail now and I have a handfull of old mixed Ge and RCA 12ax7s from long long ago ! cant wait to test them all out ill post pics when its all done!
bh7 are good!

Quote
Thanks again for all the help and layouts !  icon_biggrin
Glad if I can help somehow!
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Done an' workin'=Too many to mention - Tube addict!
Mustachio
Posts: 719


Jim


Re: Tube boost + overdrive running off a 9 volt battery
« Reply #2879 on: March 09, 2012, 09:30:09 PM »

Ah CD40106BE max voltage in 15v ... I do have a few other if-y wall warts, one old radio shack psu that has multiple voltage selector switch. But when I was testing it on the ddm it was giving me 17-18volts no mater what position the switch was in. Ill test a few more I have laying around the house and I think ill give this multiplier a try with the 100v 47nf caps I got. Ill just wear a stache gaurd! :{D I need a mustache smiley icon!

Running it with the 28 volt danelectro wallwart into the 7812 for pin 5 and the rest going to the B+ it sounded pretty good ! thanks again for all the fast response Ren you are great! Gonna move the main circuit off the bread board and onto some vero tomorrow!

Now looking at the CD40106BE with 15 max in 15x6.66 is about 100volts so most of my caps should hold up! If I can find a strong 12v psu around the house ill get almost 80v out of it . Ill check out that c0ckroft walton multiplier tonight as well ! maybe ill be able to power tubes at higher voltage. I eventually want to build a few projects with EM84 magic eye tubes!
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"Feed me or feed me to something, I just want to be part of the food chain"
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