Fuzz/dirt box for trumpet; yes, I said trumpet.

[svstee]

My jazz band teacher play a lot of experimental jazz and wants to put together a pedalboard for his trumpet. He apperently had a fairly elaborate setup a couple years back with a couple mics, some boutique distortion units and a glitch computer, but he got tired of lugging it around and sold it all on the 'Bay. He used computer modeling stuff for a while, but now wants to return to the lovely world of anolog. He wants some stuff that he can get "weird, crazy sounds out of" but also wants it useable for normal playing. He'd used a Zvex Fuzz Factory in the past, I was thinking maybe something along the lines of that or a Parrallel Universe, along with a Tube Screamer (or Reamer) for more subtle stuff.

Anyone ever done anything with dirt for a trumpet? I'm not really sure what would work. He'll play through my board tomorrow to see if there's anything he likes on there, but I don't know what mods would work well (or be needed) for trumpet.

[MikeH]

Whatever it is, it really will need some kind of gate function.  That's why I immediately thought of the fuzz factory, and which is why he found it of good use before. Or maybe just running a noise suppressor in his chain will work too.

A local trumpeter around here used to use a small stone, which also sounded really cool.

[tommy.genes]

He will likely need interfaces both going into the pedal board and going out to the PA, especially if he is using a dynamic microphone (one that doesn't need phantom power) instead of a condenser microphone (one that needs phantom power). This is because microphone outputs are typically balanced (search for it in this forum) and - in the case of dynamic mics - are not quite as powerful and are more susceptible to impedance loading than are guitar pickup outputs. Commercial DI boxes would probably do the trick, especially if they are active (i.e. have a battery or power supply), but you could DIY them as well.

He may also want a clean blend to mix his un-effected trumpet with the fx, and a final tone stack - perhaps even a compressor / limiter - might be useful at the very end of the chain.

With those in place, your teacher should be able to use any guitar fuzz out there. Just remember that the dry tone of a trumpet is already pretty fuzzy, so subtle distortions like the Tube Screamer may hardly be noticeable. Again, that may be one reason why he had success with the Fuzz Factory in the past. Beyond distortion/fuzz, because the trumpet tone is already rich in harmonics, filter/wha/modulation and similar effects work really well. Delays and harmonizers can be cool too.

-- T. G. --

[svstee]

He was mostly looking for distortion, but what you are saying about a DI box is true. I think he has acsess to that already. A good compressor might work well also, thoughts? I'm as fan of that clean blend idea as well.

[svstee]

Well I talked to him some more and narrowed down what he wants. He wants a Si Fuzz Face type circuit with a couple extra controls, and most importantly, the ability to use a footswitch to switch between different settings on a potentiometer. He also wants a non latching footswitch to step on for out of control high gain/feedback, footswitchable gain levels, and maybe footswitchable volume.

I have a plan for everything but the feedback non latching button. What would I need to get a FF to go crazy like that? I know how to set up the switching.

[MikeH]

What would I need to get a FF to go crazy like that? I know how to set up the switching.

Oh, you'd need some extra input from, oh say another transistor stage, and some more 5K and 10K pots for gate and compression controls.  Hey wait a minute!  That's a Fuzz Factory!

[svstee]

Not quite.

I'm forgoing Gate, Stab and Compression, adding a switch for Q2, having two footswitchable pots each for gain and volume and probably adding a voltage sag.
Will I need another gainstage for a chaos/higain feedback button? That's unfortunate, I was hoping for a resistor on a switch.

[MikeH]

I don't know if you can get a fuzz face to oscillate that easily; if you feed it a hot input, the yeah, for sure.  You could have the footswitch adjust the gain of that first transistor stage that's slamming the Ge section, or.... feedback loop?  Worth a try.

[aron]

I would think you would want something that distorts the signal, but not by slamming gain stages together (which would probably add too much feedback through the mic). I would look around for waveform shaping circuits, rather than a traditional fuzz face like pedal. As long as feedback is not an issue, then I guess you could use a standard distortion pedal.

[Gus]

I did some effect experiments with a sax player some years ago.   Tried all kinds of distortions and other effects.  A whammy and a boss pitch shifter seemed to be the most useful for what they wanted(taste).

  When you use a microphone then go to effects with something like the close placement of a microphone with a trumpet what I would do first is listen to the microphone and the preamp mixer if you are using one and note the distortion from that combo before you add more distortion to it.   What microphone will be used?

Something that can be cool is using the distortion from the mixer(if used) with turned up gain and adjusting the EQ and turning down the fader on the channel.

Also the trumpet might sound cool with a nice EQ set as an effect

The microphone to effect interface will be an important section to get correct.  Balanced, unbalanced, input resistance, output level...

[svstee]

Thanks for all the ideas and suggestions, guys! He has a setup on his computer doing all the modulation, compression and EQ stuff, he just wants an analog distortion. He'll be using this for a lot of crazy experimental stuff so a crazy, nasty sounding feedback button is something he wanted.

I don't know if you can get a fuzz face to oscillate that easily; if you feed it a hot input, the yeah, for sure.  You could have the footswitch adjust the gain of that first transistor stage that's slamming the Ge section, or.... feedback loop?  Worth a try.

The Ge section? I was planning on doing this all Si. But I could probably do this with Q1 so that Q2 gets hit hard, right? I was planning on a 2n5889 for Q1 and a switch between a 2n5889 and a BC 109 for Q2 (he said it needed to be able to get REAL nasty). Something that is just over the top high gain would probably be preferable to a feedback loop as well.

[earthtonesaudio]

I'd go with a Blue Box.

[Taylor]

I think a trumpet through a ring modulator would sound wonderful.

[svstee]

I think a trumpet through a ring modulator would sound wonderful.

It does. He has a full out digital pedal board on his mac that a trumpet play friend actually designed. He likes all the delay/modulation/ect. stuff on there, but isn't amazed by the distortion, which is where I come in.

What would be the easiest way to feed it a hot output and make the stuff hit the fan (his words) sonically?