i know some peeps are butthurt over this. oh well. if ya are, just go away now. i'm not gonna even listen to the bullshit. peeps on "the other forum" are hip to it and building it. good enough for me.
this is the final and full revision of the thing. if ya like it, cool. if ya don't, cool. i'm not looking for suggestions or props or any of that shit,
just presenting a complete project to the community. it includes the footswitching, etc etc...
i ditch the snubber caps in mine. they take too much "edge" away imho. some transistors DO sound better with them, but not the ones i'm using.
i just revised the project to version 1.4, including all the in/out switching, effects switching, the led's etc... will post it soon as i can up load it.
i'm telling you, them @#$%in videos don't do it justice. so far every one who has tried the actual schizoid face live has bought one. in some cases TWO. i can't seem to keep enough of them around. i HAVE used it live on a couple occaisons now, and can absolutely replace my germanium with it with no issues at all. less noise, less hiss, and dependable regardless of temperature.
you should really try it. i can guarantee you will be surprised. it sounds/works WAYYYYYY better than the videos can show it to be. also useful for hot muddy humbuckers, gives a real nice "edge".
the final (ha!) revision includes the led's. it's a happy/sad face. in sad mode (stupid face) the two eyes on the smiley light blue. in happy mode (photon face) they light green.
in bypass, all 4 light up red. cuz i'm an unabashed stoner ;)
just the blue leds for stupid, just green for photon.
use rgb's, common ANODE... then you only need one CLR per led pair. 27k seemed about the best for the CLR.
the rgb's at tayda go from left to right, with anode being longest, red, anode, green, blue
the basic graphic looks like this:
:(:
people advised to add anti pop resistors, but they really aren't necessary other than one. take it right from the footswitch where it goes to board in to ground. that's it. the other stuff is sufficiently isolated to not cause popping issues. i reccomend 4.7m. works perfect
a pair of 3pdt footswitches allows not only true bypass, but also the light show aspect for the graphic. the layout i'm about to post shows how to do it.
i use 9mm alphas. 1k audio for fuzz, 250k linear for volume.
the vero is verified and has been built many times now. a metric shit-tonne of wiring involved. just keep 'em short an point to point, and you'll be fine. keep audio and power wires separated where feasible, and try to make them cross at right angles if need be and you should be fine.
(http://i605.photobucket.com/albums/tt137/pinkjimiphoton/dBFX%20PjP%20Schizoid%20Face%201.4%202017_zpsrtdqaepw.png)
at some point, when i build the next batch of them, i will shoot a stupid pedal trick video of the full gospel pedal. its hard to do, they are selling faster than i can build them. believe it or don't. this is indeed a si fuzzface that don't suck.
rock on.
Quote from: pinkjimiphoton on March 25, 2017, 01:18:27 PM
i'm not looking for suggestions or props or any of that shit,
just presenting a complete project to the community.
You
are accepting a simple "thank you" though, right? :icon_wink:
lol... if someone wants to say thanks, it is gratefully accepted, but not necessary.
the best compliment is for peeps to build them and enjoy them. that's the only reason i put it here,
not to get in any "you should do this and this and this like i do" pissing matches.
it sounds great. it reacts right. the peeps who've built 'em agree. i've built or breadboarded thousands of fuzz face variants at this point.
out of all of them, as far as silicon goes, this is the only one i've seen yet that works right. i can a/b it with my dallas arbiter reissue pos germanium and can't tell the diff. well, other than less noise, less hum, no bacon frying and always working no matter how cold or hot and sounding the same... ;)
sorry to be a dick, but i take less @#$%s than i give ;)
and i apologize if i come off like a dick. but if i wanted to build someone else's stuff that i've already tried that isn't the damn basic fuzzface circuit in the first place, i would.
try it on your breadboard. by all means tell me i'm wrong. :icon_mrgreen:
takes maybe 5 minutes. i think you'll be surprised.
rock on ;)
ps. if ya find it too brite when the guitar is turned down on the stupid face side, make the input cap 390 or 470n instead of 47n. that will drop the range down about 2 octaves and give it a little more ass to work with, and help equalize the slight difference between the two "sides" of the circuit.
and again, only use the snubber cap on q2 if you need to. i find it tends to nuke the treble sustain too much and would rather have the little bit of extra noise than the muffled part. i gotta tone control on my guitar and know how to use it.
finally, if ya wanna go crazy, use a 4pdt and switch the 470r with a 1k. i'd do it so the 1k was on the stupid face side, it will bump the volume up a little bit. i don't find it to be necessary, but YMMV
pics.... will get video shortly. gonna a/b it with an actual germanium fuzzface.
(http://i605.photobucket.com/albums/tt137/pinkjimiphoton/schizoid%20face%20number%202_zpsjgvxjyzr.jpg)
(http://i605.photobucket.com/albums/tt137/pinkjimiphoton/schiz4_zpshufznszb.jpg)
(http://i605.photobucket.com/albums/tt137/pinkjimiphoton/schiz3_zpsjeyyxi3j.jpg)
(http://i605.photobucket.com/albums/tt137/pinkjimiphoton/schiz%203%20d_zpsehjk5tvm.jpg)
(http://i605.photobucket.com/albums/tt137/pinkjimiphoton/schiz%203%20a_zpslkhox9ze.jpg)
(http://i605.photobucket.com/albums/tt137/pinkjimiphoton/schiz1_zpsy9jslc3i.jpg)
(http://i605.photobucket.com/albums/tt137/pinkjimiphoton/schiz%203%20c_zpsosxvsbvx.jpg)
(http://i605.photobucket.com/albums/tt137/pinkjimiphoton/schiz3%20b_zpsxyrsbraa.jpg)
That 1590A near the bottom is one tight mamma-jamma of a build! :o
yeah that particular one has dissappeared.... :poof:
looks like some dipshit lifted it on me. sad for them, i had dropped it and messed up the toggle switch and hadn't replace it yet. oooopsies.
i can't believe someone woulda just grabbed it. man. i guess i gotta start watching guests. @#$%ed up.
edit: luckily, i'm an idiot. it fell inside a box. too much crap in the dungeon. :icon_redface: :icon_redface:
i have the other 1590a here still, the one with the top mounted pots. the one in that pic sounded really good, shame it's gone.
oh well.
getting ready for video a/b ing in with one of my germ fuzz faces...
it was a REAL tite build, and had everything but the light show part
stupid pedal trick for the schizoid face, a/b-ing it with a germanium DA dunlop reissue fuzz face so ya can hear the differences and similarities. does it sound identical? nope. but this is the closest i've ever found. check it out.
Sounds really good to me! Like you say, its real close to Ge without the thermal issues. Thanks for sharing this project ;D
thanks russ, honored, man.
if you build it i hope you dig it as much as i do.
peace ;)
Well, its on the breadboard, and sounds great! I made a couple of minor mods to supporting circuits, as some suggested; 22uF is used as the bypass. I didn't have any MPSA06 transistors, so subbed a couple of BC547Bs with about the same Hfe. This is good enough to box!
(http://i1362.photobucket.com/albums/r688/russrutledge/DSCN3321_zpsecdugnsj.jpg)
cool. looks like the biggest change was in the power supply filter.
glad you like it bro, its a really good circuit.
i am convinced that to get these kinds of fuzzes to sound best, you gotta not only bias from the collector, but limit the gain from the emitter. it takes silicon fuzzes into a whole new ballpark.
my only suggestion would be try a 470n output cap instead of 47, it will be a bit more robust and not as thin when your guitar is rolled way down.
thanks for trying it out. so.... am i crazy? or does it not suck ? ;)
It does not suck!! I'll definitely up the output cap, although this is not that thin as is. Cleans up well with the guitar vol pot, a wide range of tones available. Yeah, I like it!
The jury's still out on the other :icon_lol:
:icon_mrgreen:
i like 390n for the output,, but 47 is nice. but when ya try the bigger one, i bet you'll like it. ;)
Jimi, do you still have your pics (schem and vero) for this? I think I'd like to throw it in one of my build queues.
broken link(((
i saved it somehow
(https://s26.postimg.org/4dd7renqt/Schizoid_Face_1.1_2017_zpsv7jsboap_d_BFX_Pj_P.png) (https://postimg.org/image/4dd7renqt/)
Sounds great pinkjimi!!
Thanks, goo! :icon_biggrin: I assume the only difference between this and 1.4 is the LEDs and switches.
thanks goo!!
yeah erik, the only dif is the one goo posted has the switching for the leds and stuff.
you can leave all that crap out of course, i just did it to make the thing look cool, but i think
personally that adding led's to some fuzz circuits seems to increase their noise.
but the basic circuit is there to extrapolate, if you need a legit schem layout or vero, let me know, i do have all the files for this.
i think i may even still have some pcb's if ya need one.
Thanks, Jimi! I'll keep that in mind when I get ready to build.
So, yesterday, this board assembled itself. It borrowed my hands and my solder to do so. Weird.
(https://i.imgur.com/Nj3XDRSl.jpg)
Apparently, these are the transistors it chose.
(https://i.imgur.com/JuDRD2Jl.jpg)
I have no clue if this will sound good or not. I'm not a fuzz expert.
Self-assembly stopped at this point, so it looks like it is up to me to finish building it. Interestingly, there is a 1K trimpot in the pile with this, so I guess that will be the fuzz control. I won't question it at this point.
Edit: I have the drawing of the schematic and vero layout, which I can repost if Jimi says it is ok.
Quote from: EBK on March 04, 2020, 06:45:43 AM
So, yesterday, this board assembled itself.
Given the 2
1/
2 years since the last update, I'd say it got bored waiting for you, Eric! ;D
Quote from: bluebunny on March 04, 2020, 08:59:03 AM
Quote from: EBK on March 04, 2020, 06:45:43 AM
So, yesterday, this board assembled itself.
Given the 21/2 years since the last update, I'd say it got bored waiting for you, Eric! ;D
That's quite possible. I can't even remember what I had for breakfast two days ago. There's no way I'm remembering something I planned to build over two years ago with no evidence of having even started the project. There was no printout in my collection of papers, no parts set aside specifically for this, no bookmark in my browser, and certainly no unidentified board sitting in my collection ala Mark Hammer (there
was, however, a scrap of vero in my pile that was the exact size I needed, but it didn't have any existing trace cuts or anything else suggesting a predetermined purpose). That's why I can't take credit for picking it up and building it. Like I said, it is weird. :icon_eek: Fuzz gods at work? I hope mine ends up sounding good.
haha the fuzz gods smile, somewhere......
(https://i.postimg.cc/crqXpyCd/d-B-FX-Pj-P-Schizoid-Face-1-3-2017.png) (https://postimg.cc/crqXpyCd)
erik, i think you did a pcb layout for this for me, in fact
(https://i.postimg.cc/SJ77HnHG/Schizoid-Face-1.png) (https://postimg.cc/SJ77HnHG)
but i dunno if this was yours or not
(https://i.postimg.cc/fJKmB602/Schizoid-Face-Layout.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/fJKmB602)
(https://i.postimg.cc/w70RhLSn/Schizoid-Face-PCB-components-Side.png) (https://postimg.cc/w70RhLSn)
(https://i.postimg.cc/pyM8qvqv/Schizoid-Face-PCB-Solder-Side.png) (https://postimg.cc/pyM8qvqv)
(https://i.postimg.cc/YGMrLdf5/d-B-FX-Pj-P-Schizoid-Face-1-4-2017.png) (https://postimg.cc/YGMrLdf5)
(https://i.postimg.cc/hhCDhbJY/stupid-3-color-led-trick-4-leds.png) (https://postimg.cc/hhCDhbJY)
if ya poke around over on FSB, helmutt/aquataur just revisited this i think, and may have some interesting deets.
i think this should cover most of the project. the idea was for the led's to be eyes on a smiley/sad face... blue for sad, green for happy, red for bypass
(https://i.postimg.cc/wyvrrJ6t/schizoid-face-number-2.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/wyvrrJ6t)
the q's i spec'd are mpsa06, hfe is usually 140-250. just use whatever ya got for low gain sili's, and put the lower gain one in q1. you may have to play with the emitter resistors slightly if outside the 200hfe range... ya gotta 20% tolerance, easy.
hard to believe every one of these ended up sold. crazy. nice sounding fuzzface variant. the blue side is a sweeter ff that ended up as a commercial product, in fact. nope, not gonna say who ended up with the design, but there's some cool people using it... most of whom i've never even heard of, but appear to be selling some music. so i'm stoked
i can't seem to find the full gospel build doc with everything on one page, sorry. its been a few years since i even thought about this circuit.
so many fuzzes. my book of circuits has grown to two huge binders about a foot thick. now that i'm building for that company and doing their designs , i hardly ever have a chance for much experimentation, and they get uptite if i release anything to my diy brethren.
soon tho, i'll have the go-ahead to do that... anything i come up with they don't wanna sell will end up released. there's a BUNCH of stuff... the latest is a two transistor dealio using 2sk30a fets and a rotary 4 way switch... lets ya go treble booster, rangemaster, overdrive or fuzz with the one circuit. as always, its a stupid simple as i can make it.
one hint is just changing values of input cap can and will completely change the character of distortion circuits.
also, if ya go with a big enough box to accomodate 3 footswitches, i would make the output cap so it switches between the sides of the 8.2k bias resistor. why? well, at the "top" of the resistor, you got standard fuzz face pretty much... at the bottom, the node with q2 c, you get a substantial output boost that's bitchin' for leads. just a thought ;) the output cap will block dc either spot. if ya go with a 10-25k trimmer there, you can find a balance point between a decent bias, and output boost. like everything, its a bit of a compromise ;)
and my last tip of the day... 4558? @#$% them things. 1458's sound better. more dynamic, like an op275, and far more amp-like response. the guv'nor himself used them in some of the finest sounding marshall products ever released, good enough for me.
i'm not even supposed to mention that chip lol the management would kill me for mentioning the "secret weapon" lol but try one, my fav jellybean arachnid roach of all time.
anyways... nice to see someone messing with this again. hope ya have fun bro. if ya need me, or info, or any of the shit we all know ya don't already, invoke me and i will appear lol
peace out and happy solder fume sniffin'
(https://i.postimg.cc/dLMW2gTZ/schiz-3-d.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/dLMW2gTZ)
Quote from: pinkjimiphoton on March 04, 2020, 11:32:12 AM
erik, i think you did a pcb layout for this for me, in fact
Not me. The last layout I designed was in November of 2000 (which is proudly emblazoned in the copper layer of the board, a Crybaby Wah, still sitting in my unfinished pile).
Quote
the q's i spec'd are mpsa06, hfe is usually 140-250. just use whatever ya got for low gain sili's, and put the lower gain one in q1. you may have to play with the emitter resistors slightly if outside the 200hfe range... ya gotta 20% tolerance, easy.
The transistors that chose themselves measure 209 and 237. I guess they'll work ok. We'll see. They are socketed.
Somehow it seems poetic and fitting that all the pictures posted from 2017 are...well....fuzzy. :icon_lol:
Quote from: Mark Hammer on March 04, 2020, 04:07:11 PM
Somehow it seems poetic and fitting that all the pictures posted from 2017 are...well....fuzzy. :icon_lol:
everything about me is fuzzy, mark! lol
here's the most recent photographic evidence of how fuzzy the old hippy has gotten
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WVpbXG83sJI
me n my latest protege, eli who sat in the last show with my power trio... 18 years old, kid kills it
weirdly, no fuzz involved... well, with me. he's using one of my fuzzface + pedals, me? les paul into marshall. my fx is a straight cord ;)
taken last friday at the local MC's clubhouse
guitar wankage ;)
This still technically needs a diode or two in the power supply subcircuit, but I might skip them to give it a listen. I have a bunch of other transistors I might audition with this as well.
(https://i.imgur.com/iwkiAmbl.jpg)
Update: My kids are asleep, so I gave this a quick low volume test to see if it fires up and fuzzes. It does! Will have to give it a real listen tomorrow.
went with a trimmer for the gain? i should do that more, but for some reason i still like knobs. let me know your thoughts once ya destroy them cillia in your ears a while.
this, or very nearly this, is actually now a commercial circuit believe it or not.
Quote from: pinkjimiphoton on March 07, 2020, 12:13:44 PM
went with a trimmer for the gain? i should do that more, but for some reason i still like knobs.
Yeah, I don't have any lowish value pots on hand that aren't trimmers, and I had vaguely recalled you endorsing a fuzz-at-max-always philosophy in one of your videos, perhaps even for this very circuit, so I went with it. Thought the idea of a one-knob or no-knob fuzz sounded pretty daring too (I'm sure they exist), so this will give me a chance to more or less test that out.
yeah, really, i mean... how often does anyone leave the fuzz knob below 11?? lol
An initial report:
I have only been able to test this circuit through headphones so far, so it is not a true evaluation of its potential, but here are my observations so far. Tested with single coil vintage pickups (Fender CS69) in parallel and in series.
With the transistors that landed in the sockets, it definitely fuzzes, but sounds VERY dull and somewhat muted (the fuzz doesn't ever cut out or splatter, but noticeably downshifts quickly) until that fuzz control is cranked WAY up, then it blooms quite nicely.
In the more trebly mode (I forget which one that is) it is extremely noisy but nicely searing and crisp. Makes me feel like ripping through some raw lead solos.
In the other mode, it makes me feel more like chugging some power chords. Less adventurous, but reliable feeling.
I feel like I definitely need to try some other transistors. Should I look at anything other than the gain measurements when picking them?
description sounds right. throw it into a tube amp or an overdrive and it should warm up nicely.
hfe on the original run was about 215, lately i've been using around 150hfe for q1 and 180 for q2.
its been so long i really don't remember... i do remember there was a bluesy-er mode and a more biting one, but... been a while, ya know? lol
Swapped out the previous transistors for some ECG123A ones with gains of 143 and 165. MUCH improved. Sounds useful over a wide range of the fuzz control. More testing needed. Gotta go. :icon_wink:
Edit:
For no special reason, here is an updated pic. I love the way these transistors look (small and very shiny).
(https://i.imgur.com/yiM8nWIl.jpg)
i suspect the ratio of gain is important. but that said, lower gain will def work better i'd imagine. for higher gain, try doubling the e resistors etc. there's math involved. i went to windham public schools. 'nuff said. hence the 10,000 monkeys approach i take so religiously ;)