I was just wondering what you guys who've used them think of the Dunlop reissue Fasel inductors...either the red or the yellow...both of which have different core types. From what I understand, the yellow is the one that's supposed to give the "classic Fasel sound," while the red one is for a very clean sounding wah.
Are they worth the money and live up to the original Fasels, or are they just another "genuine vintage sound" marketing tactic?
TIA!
Phillip
I don't have an original to compare, but I bought the red fasel for my DIY vox circuit, and it sounds really good. A huge improvment over the black filmcan looking crybaby one I had.
HTH
RDV
There probably isn't anyhting that can replace a true vintage Fasel inductor, but I'm sure they are reasonably close. The vintage "stack of dimes" inductors are generally regarded as being the other lusted after inductor. Stuart Castledine makes some replicas of those that kick butt, too.
Have you ever read "The Technology of the Wah" at geofex.com? I wonder if there is a way to simulate a vintage Fasel inductor by using some kind of circuit that would create an asymmetrical wave form like the coveted Fasel? Sounds like an interesting idea. "Faselize your wah"!
I've always wondered how wrapping an inductor with another coil would do. You would need a constant current source to drive it which adds some complexity, but you could easily create a bias field and pre-saturate the core to whatever level you wanted.
Take care,
-Peter
"I've always wondered how wrapping an inductor with another coil would do. You would need a constant current source to drive it which adds some complexity, but you could easily create a bias field and pre-saturate the core to whatever level you wanted."
Very interesting idea... ever actually try it?
For experimentally minded Australians, Altronics has a ferroxcube transforme core and bobbin, that allows you to make your own ferrite cored inductors.
http://www.altronics.com.au/cat.asp?cat=16&grp=210&sort=code
L5300 & L5305
Very interesting idea... ever actually try it?
Sadly my crybaby walked off about 14 years ago and these days I have a Morley Power Fuzz Wah, which is a non-inductor unit.
I drew up an experimental schematic a while back around an LM2576 switching regulator and a TL072 to make a constant current supply. The LM2576 puts out power which then runs through a sensing resistor (0.1 to 0.2 ohms). The voltage developed across that resistor is processed and buffered by the TL072 and then becomes the feedback control for the switcher. That gives a stable drive current regardless of battery voltage. The switching frequency is 52KHz. There's also the LM2599 and the LM2676 to look at. The LM2676 has a switch frequency of 260KHz. :D
I'll post a schematic if you want to fool around with the design. 2 chips, 1 Schottky diode, 1 inductor (~100uH), 3 caps, and 9 resistors, one of which is a pot for setting the current.
My original idea was to use the circuit to saturate 1/2 of a 1K:8ohm output transformer as a distortion device. I think it would be the only pedal with magnetic saturation based distortion. :D I don't see any reason why it couldn't be used to pre-saturate another inductor. A 12V relay core would be perfect for influencing the other inductor.
Take care,
-Peter
Peter-
A magnetic saturation distortion circuit sounds very intriguing! Have you ever actually tried building it?
Nope, I haven't built it yet. Maybe it's about time to breadboard one up.
Using an undersized output transformer is pretty common in tubeland to get magnetic saturation, but I always worry about power handling ability.
In all my messing with inductors and transformers (non-audio) the object was always to avoid any kind of saturation. :lol: I used to make light dimmers with big torroids wrapped in #12 for hash filters. To reduce saturation, I used to use a tile cutting saw blade to make a gap in the ring. It seems odd to be going in the opposite direction. :D
Take care,
-Peter
Quote from: Peter SnowbergI've always wondered how wrapping an inductor with another coil would do.
We've tried it in www.pisotones.com:
(http://www.pisotones.com/Articulos/CrybabyMOD/Totufo/image003.jpg)
The whole article is here (http://www.pisotones.com/Articulos/CrybabyMOD/Totufo/ModInduct.htm).
We've also tried the "stick_a_small_magnet_atop_the_inductor" way :) with very good results. Look here (http://www.pisotones.com/Tri-Wah/Wah.htm) for more details.
P.S. Again, in spanish, sorry :oops:
Very cool Manolo!!! 8) 8) 8)
Thanks for the information. The idea of using a magnet in there too is great! :D
English translations from Google can be found here (http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pisotones.com%2FArticulos%2FCrybabyMOD%2FTotufo%2FModInduct.htm&langpair=es%7Cen&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&prev=%2Flanguage_tools) and here (http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pisotones.com%2FTri-Wah%2FWah.htm&langpair=es%7Cen&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&prev=%2Flanguage_tools). Unfortunatly Google gives up translating about 1/2 of the way down the second page. :?
Take care,
-Peter
If I remember correctly, someone measured an old stack-of-dimes *very* meticulously to see what all the mojo was about (GEO comes to mind but i can't find anything). It turned out ot have a slightly magnetic core, which in itself is rather unique since core material is designed to be particularly non-retantive in the magnetic department.
This yields an offset response, even harmonics, etc.
a tiny magnet will apparently work fine - as Manolo said.
Is there a translation from spanish to english of that site? Mine's not too good ;(
Last year, following the instructions from pisotones, i added small pieces of magnet to the inductor in my stock crybaby, and the results were excellent. Subtle, but very noticeable.
When i added an input buffer to mitigate tone sucking, it just got better.
Now i have a great wha, like 100% better than stock, and i haven't messed with all the other possible mods yet :D
So all I would have to do is add a magnetic with certain specifications to my inductor and presto?!
That seems too simple. :wink:
But, it does make some sense. I guess I'm going to have to check out that page...
For reasons beyond my knowledge, the "tiny magnet" trick does not work for every wah. A friend of mine got amazing good results in his already good sounding VOX wah. I've got great results with my old Thomas Organ CryBaby (http://www.pisotones.com/varios/CryBaby/CryBaby.html) (this time in english!!! :wink: ) but not comparable to my friend's VOX, perhaps because the original "Stack of Dimes" in mine is already somewhat magnetic (besides being very good sounding itself 8) ) and got great results with my Tri-Wah (http://www.pisotones.com/varios/CryBaby/CryBaby.htm) too but some people have told me that they couldn't hear any difference atall in theirs'.
It's important that you use a very weak magnet. I've found the typical foldable foil magnets like those used for stick-on-fridge-door publicity are ideal for this task. Stick it atop the inductor. If the inductor have a nut above as the typical crybaby/VOX, just do a hole with a paper punch.
What is even funnier is that the polarity *does* matter with the magnet. If you do not get any improvement, flip it upside down and try again.
If you decide it to be a keeper, stick it with that gluebars used to stick paper... Pritt, for instance. It is completely removable and is strong enough to keep things in place.
Remember: weak magnet and watch that polarity :wink:
Anyone ever try this on a TDK inductor? The wah I have has one of these in it, and it sounds pretty good, but it could be better...
BTW, that Tri-Wah thing is pretty cool.
Just try it yourself. If you don't like, take it out and you've only lost ten minutes :wink: This is a completely reversible modification.
Yes, I like that fact that it's easily reversible and simple. Lots of room for experimentation.
Fridge magnets..... I'm gonna have to try that! I do like the yellow Dunlop Fasel, I haven't tried the red one yet. Antique Electronics has them and Fulltone pots pretty cheap. Just type "wah" in the search field.
http://www.tubesandmore.com/
This started me thinking of the thread I started on capacitance meters. Circuit Specialists ($42.00) had one that also measured inductance (henries). Figured it would be nice for wah building. I'm wondering if the effect of the magnets on the inductor could be measureable?
http://www.web-tronics.com/digcapandint.html
"I'm wondering if the effect of the magnets on the inductor could be measureable?"
You could probably see it on a scope, to some degree. I imagine that you probably would need a spectrum analyzer to really see what it's doing in the guitar frequency range (approx. 82Hz to 3kHz)
But, I'm thinking that you could run a sine wave from a signal generator thru the circuit and see what the waveform looks like. From what I have read thus far, you would be looking for an asymmetrical waveform, like the fabled original Fasel produces. If sticking the magnet on the inductor has an effect, you should be able to see something different than without it on there...
I think I'm going to try this on Tues. or Wed. - I'm really curious about this now. 8)
I doubt a fridge magnet would work, at least not the flat card type, the magnetic field in these is in the form of narrow stripes. You would need a rectangular chunk, or a disc magnet. Those rare earth ones would be good, but be careful, you can get a bad pinch from them!
If a fridge magnet doesn't work, I have a variety of other types of magnets to try...
I'll try to do some testing on this tonight, more likely on Wed. evening.
Quote from: Paul Perry (Frostwave)I doubt a fridge magnet would work, at least not the flat card type, the magnetic field in these is in the form of narrow stripes. You would need a rectangular chunk, or a disc magnet. Those rare earth ones would be good, but be careful, you can get a bad pinch from them!
I've tried with ceramics, alnicos and neodymiums and nothing seems to work better than the flat card fridge variety. I've assumed that less magnetic power is the key but I must admit that it's not very scientific :D
The more powerful the magnet, the harsher the sound.
And yes... be very careful with those neodymiums! :wink:
P.S. Again: remember to flip it upside down if you don't like it on the first try... I've experimented that magnetic polarity does matter.
I have a piece of magnetic viewing film and upholding it up to a fridge magnet, you quickly see that the field is arranged in stripes about 1/8 inch wide (as Paul writes). Each stripe has a North and South pole. Flipping these magnets upside down will not reverse the polarity.
Take care,
-Peter
You may be right but I've experienced the polarity effect... honest! :roll:
My 847's inductor is kind of like a bolt top [rugged convex shape] looking affair, not flat on top at all. I couldn't seem to discern any difference with a fridge magnet.
Are there other considerations about having magnets around metal board parts? I know when exposed to a magnetic field that it's transferred to other metals within proximity. not copper of course...what about magnets and tubes...anybody wave magnets around tubes and find a result...ever fishing for the newly discovered parameter..
With those fridge magnets, you can use two or three layers if necessary. I'm wondering what affect those 1/8" wide strips would have on the inductor... it seems like it would create some sort of hash pattern. Who knows how that would affect things?!
Yes... you can try some layers of fridge magnets.
I suppose that by those 1/8" strips you mean those flexible magnets used to keep the fridge doors closed.. right? I've also tried them but the wah become harsh.
Those fridges seem to be quite useful for DIY wahs :lol:
I'm think that you may be perfectly right and the "polarity" issue could be really a matter of "horizontal orientation". Just what I believed to be a matter of change in polarity by flipping the maget upside down, could be perfectly a mere change in horizontal orientation too. I'll investigate it.
" suppose that by those 1/8" strips you mean those flexible magnets used to keep the fridge doors closed.. right?"
Actually I'm talking about this stuff you can buy in the store in a sheet. It is self-adhesive and you can cut with scissors to any size you like. This is made for placing things like paper onto the front/side of a refrigerator.
"I'm think that you may be perfectly right and the "polarity" issue could be really a matter of "horizontal orientation". Just what I believed to be a matter of change in polarity by flipping the maget upside down, could be perfectly a mere change in horizontal orientation too. I'll investigate it."
It could be that when flipped it, you also rotated it, which could possibly have some kind of effect on the sound.