I just finished building this and it worked well as I had hoped. It's a pretty nice hard edged ring modulator sound.
Most of the frequency pot settings work well all over the neck depending what you are playing and with chords.
Sustain is good and the notes decay smoothly, no gating etc.
(http://www.mrdwab.com/john/Aliaserboard.jpg)
Here are a few sound clips.
The Sound clip with the distortion at the begining is Jack Orman's "fat gnat" with the neck PU.
All of the clips were with a Les Paul Copy through a Fender Twin Reverb.
www.mrdwab.com/john/AliaserCMOS1.mp3
www.mrdwab.com/john/AliaserCMOS.mp3
www.mrdwab.com/john/AliaserCMOSfreakout.mp3
www.mrdwab.com/john/AliaserCMOSsweep.mp3
Here's the pdf file with a PCB layout, transfer and notes.
www.mrdwab.com/john/AliaserCMOS.pdf
There are some other clips from biroids and a schematic here: Just scroll dwon a few posts.
http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=48815.msg362504#msg362504
Thanks to Biroids for helping me with the schematic and separating the two grounding schemes.
Thanks also to JC malliet for working on the other version of this and getting it out there.
John
Thats some nice work, a really clean and cool sounding job. I'm gonna have to make myself one of these and hook it up to a sequencer, it'll sound awsome! How did you make that circuit board, PNP Blue? Hmmmmmm. I've got some CD4066's and was wondering if I would be able to sub these for the CD4016's in this circuit? As I can see they are a pin for pin replacement. Do you have any ideas on this?
- edit - The PDF you've uploaded is giving me an error when I try to open it :icon_frown:
WOW !!
... you're getting some awesome tones there John - very nice work
Thanks for confirming circuit operation and congrats again to Miguel for coming up with a CMOS version
~JC
That sounds awesome! How is the carrier bleed thru? I didn't hear any, was wondering what you had discovered.
BTW, that layout won't open for me. It says it isn't a valid PDF file.
Hey John,
Great job man! I cant listen to the sound clips right now because I am at work but I will when I get home.
-Jonathan
Okay not sound harsh, but what the heck would you use it for. It kinda sounds like one of those broken kids keyboards that my kids had when they were 5. Its kinda cool to play with but not sure what to do with it. :icon_mrgreen:
Huh..I don't why this isn't working. I uploaded it again and got the "file does not begine with '%PDF" error message.
The file address looks fine...
I'll see if I can figure it out.
Freddd
I used Staples brand "photo basic gloss" (red package #471861) and Muratic acid and 3% Hydrogen Peroxide mixed 3:1 for etching the board.
If the pinouts are the same on the CD4066's then they should work (but I don't know for sure) try em.
The carrier bleedthrough is very minimal even with a distortion in from of it. You can hear it slightly in the clips between passages.
Good enough for me at least.
John
Here's the layout in jpeg format... can't get this to load as pdf... argh!
(http://www.mrdwab.com/john/Aliaserlayout.jpg)
(http://www.mrdwab.com/john/Aliaser-PCB.jpg)
I used two CD4016BE 's from mouser.
John
Hi
for such a simple design this sounds really great.
Perhaps the legend is true: "There are many (ring modulators). But there is one ring (modulator) to rule them all".
Pretty funny, Brett.
Thanks very much for the layout! I look forward to building this one!
Hi
Looking at the schematic and the datasheet for the CD4016, it seems to me that this is a balanced modulator. So cool.
A few years ago I designed one (the Modulatron) based around a TLC555 oscillator and a CD4066 switch, but the bleed-through was a bit too much. Nevertheless, the concept seemed a good one, and in this circuit it seems to be implemented really well.
cheers
wow, sounds wonderful.
i tried to do one of these on perfboard
awhile back with zero success. thank you
for doing the layout, i'll be trotting off
to kinkos with my photo paper tomorrow.
sr
Cool! Sounds like Miguel didi a really nice job on this one. Great sounding clips, John. Thanks for the layout, too. 8)
~ Charlie
Ok, I got the link to work somehow...didn't do anything different...
Here's the CMOS Aliaser PDF file:
http://www.mrdwab.com/john/AliaserCMOS.pdf
John
Hey very cool! Nice work and the samples too
I'm really glad the layout worked out fine, do you mind if I post it at my site too?
Did you have any difficulties with the ICs or it just worked fine at the first try?
Good luck!
Miguel
I bought 2 sets of CMOS chips. I tried two CD4016BCN chips but they did not work, I didn't even check the pin outs yet...lazy!
Then I tried the CD4016BE and they worked fine. Everything else worked right away. As I say, the output was a little too low when the effect was in so I added on a LPB circuit with a trim pot to adjust the output level. The LPB has a lot more output than needed so maybe you can make alterations for a lower gain circuit to tack on the end.
I tried to tack on a a cap to ground at the output to get some more mellow sounding ringing but that introduced noise for some reason...?
Yes, Miguel. You can use the PDF or any of the layouts... Thanks so much for your advice on the grounding between digital and analog etc.
I'll have to check out your site
John
Yes, I experienced noise problems when trying to add capacitors at different places... but I still don't understand exactly why. I suppose there is a lot of noise going around and the cap somehow couples it into the sound path?
Hey, I think you can change R5 to 15K or maybe 18K to increase a little the gain and avoid using an extra LPB stage.
On my site, there is not much, just random stompbox related stuff I try from time to time. I don't even remember if I posted the Aliaser schem, but in any case I'll do it now including your pdf PCB and layout. It is at www.bioroids.com.ar
Luck!
Miguel
Thanks for the tip on raising the volume Miguel. I'll have to try that next time.
I poked around at your site. There are some things I need to look at further, when I have more time.
John
John, it looks like your CMOS Nyquist Aliaser is a big sensation. Nice job there on the board as usual. Of course I'm eventually going to try building one of those. Question, have you seen this schem and has anyone had success with it?
http://www.diyitalia.it/index.php?option=com_zoom&Itemid=37&page=view&catid=130&PageNo=1&key=0&hit=1
I've been out of town and didn't get a chance to make samples of my Nyquist yet. Yours sounds great by the way and yet different than mine so that's going to be awesome when I build the CMOS version too. I'll all add the LPB at the end and see how that goes. Did you add any auto sweep circuits to yours?
oldrocker; Ive built that circuit; it's pretty good but suffers from bleedthrough issues :icon_frown: It's still a cool sounding box though.
All of the thanks goes to Miguel/biroids. He made the circuit work. I just made a layout and put it together.
Keeping the grounds for the digital and analog separate has a lot to do with the bleedthrough issues.
I suspect that layout has a good deal to do with the other aliaser schematics as well.
Try Biroids suggestion first and see what you get. (make R5 bigger, try 18K or so) Try a pot actually and see what works. Maybe making it a panel pot would be best since the higher frequency sounds seem louder, you may need to turn up or down...
I was thinking about some sweep options but I need to look at the options. I haven't done any LFO designing yet.
John
Hi, I finally posted this circuit and John's layout on my site:
http://www.bioroids.com.ar/circuits/c01_aliaser_cmos.php
Luck!
Miguel
I just built this and I like the sound quite a bit, but I am definitely getting oscillator bleed. I used John's layout, but built it on perf. Any ideas what could be done about this? I would call it more than just a slight bleed.
BTW, at first my freq. pot was not grounded, and the pot shaft acted like a theremin for controlling pitch, sensing my hand's proximity. Might be a fun mod for the noisier/more chaotic musicians among us.
Stop the oscillator (http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=53567.msg616681#msg616681) when not playing notes...
Quote from: puretube on April 12, 2009, 05:15:20 PM
Stop the oscillator (http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=53567.msg616681#msg616681) when not playing notes...
Hmm, what a puzzle... I don't know anything about how the Freqbox does what it does. I'm not going to bother building something like a noise gate, since it seems other people have gotten this to not oscillate so much.
Should I try swapping in some other 4016's?
Is there a special way for connecting the ground in this project? Or just the usual stuff, like in a distortion pedal, where we connect all the jacks, and the minus from the supply, together? I'm asking that because the IC's in my build are overheating too quickly, and I'm not getting any sound out of it. I've checked the PCB for continuity before assembling, tested all the parts one by one, and everything was OK... I'll buy some new CD4016's tomorrow to see what happens, but anyway, do you have any ideas? Thanks!
Hi, some one have the schematic?
here i vectorized the pcb image for best resolution but i want the scheme.
Thanks
(http://img213.imageshack.us/img213/8519/aliaserpcbvectorized.jpg)
Someone tried to use a CD4066 instead of CD4016. ???