Hi
I had this planned out a while ago and I forgot about it until I saw Zvex's inventobox the other day. So I finally built it up.
Basically, there are alot of effects that I want to build that are small and something I may not use very often. I did not want to spend all the money to build them all into nice enclosures with all the expensive hardware. So this is my solution:
(http://i48.tinypic.com/332xv1k.jpg)
The PCB inside the pedal contains the footswitch circuit, a millennium bypass LED, power supply filtering and protection, and a buffered Vref. The header from the PCB contains the V+, GND, Vref, Effect Input, and Effect Ouput wires.
I build all the "interchangable" effects onto a certain size PCB template to fit into the space available (which is quite a bit, actually) with the PCB mount pots in the correct places, and an optional secondary LED (for LFO, or whatever) at the top for the corresponding hole on the top of the pedal. To change out the effects, all I do is take off the knobs, unscrew the pots, disconnect the header, pull the effect assembly out, then put the new one in the same way.
The knobs were made the way they were so that one, two, or three knobs would all have the right holes to make it look good, i.e. one knob will go on the bottom, centered in the pedal, two knobs on the top, three knobs... You get it.
For each effect I will have a square aluminum plate that goes with it to place on top of the enclosure and be tightened down onto it by the potentiometer nuts. This panel will have the effect specific control titles, etc, and also serve to cover up whatever holes were not used on that particular effect.
So now whenever there is a simple, interesting effect I want to build, all I need is a piece of PCB, some PCB mount pots, the circuit board components, and a piece of aluminum! And the effect doesn't need a Vref system or any protective components. Very cheap overall.
I don't have any effects built up for it yet cause I finished the box yesterday :icon_biggrin:
And you can tell that I messed up by forgetting to think about the screw protrusions into the enclosure, so had to cut bits off my PCB and the text on it :'(
;D
Looks more useful that the inventobox already!!
Nice work.
John
Quote from: John Lyons on January 24, 2010, 07:27:28 PM
Looks more useful that the inventobox already!!
Nice work.
John
Thanks!
May not be as versatile as the Iventobox is but it's sure got a number on it for reliability and ease of interchangeability
More of the veteran DIY'er solution to the endless drive to make more circuits, more, more! :icon_lol: I have so many cheap parts amassed but not many expensive enclosures, I kept forcing myself to stop at the breadboarding stage because I felt the circuit was just shy of getting it's own box and permanent place on my pedal board. No longer! Wacky noise boxes and freaky effects are guilt free now :icon_biggrin:
Now I just got to decide what my first board for it will be.....
Great idea. There are a lot of things that I want to build and test. But I'm not sure if I want to box it up. It's hard to test these out without a box. I've built up a lot that maybe don't deserve a box.
Why not use a short length of wire from the pots ending in a little three prong plug with a header on your FX PCB. Similar to the jack this guy has in this picture.
http://axeandyoushallreceive.com/images/Socketed%20Screamer%20populated.JPG
Nicely done!
Only thing that would bother me is the location of the input and output jacks. They are prone to be stepped upon being so close to the front of the pedal.
Quote from: soggybag on January 25, 2010, 01:02:10 AM
Why not use a short length of wire from the pots ending in a little three prong plug with a header on your FX PCB. Similar to the jack this guy has in this picture.
It just makes it easier to exchange effects this way, you don't have to mess with changing pots out as well as the PCB and referencing what pots you need for it, you just stick the PCB in and you are done. It's also to hold the PCB in place, the potentiometer nuts are the connection to the chassis. That screamer uses those sticky standoffs, I didn't want to deal with those.
Quote from: ~arph on January 25, 2010, 03:10:26 AM
Nicely done!
Only thing that would bother me is the location of the input and output jacks. They are prone to be stepped upon being so close to the front of the pedal.
I think they are okay, at least for me. I won't have a problem with them. I put them there to get the most room for the effects PCB as possible, and it's a small box, so... If you want some room to breath it would be best to do this in a 1590 box instead, the jack/switch/peripheral PCB could be layed out across the width and the jacks placed farther up, and you'd have much more effects room. I wasn't planning on building anything really complicated in this fella, but something like a rebote 2.5 could definitely fit.
Here's what I was talking about as far as the "plates" with the control info on them, effect specific. This one's just a general distortion/fuzz plate, with gain, tone, and volume. Sadly, still no circuit! I barely managed to squeeze this into my schedule, I have a massive homework load that just got dumped on me this week :icon_sad:
(http://i50.tinypic.com/73ctuq.jpg)
Nice work. I like the plate. I was thinking about etching a name plate myself. I like the idea that you can take this off and install a new one for another module.
Those knobs look like some I got from Futurlec. Mine are a little too small to fit a 1/4" shaft. Though they look like you could force them over a knurled press on type shaft.
Quote from: JKowalski on January 30, 2010, 06:31:31 PM
Here's what I was talking about as far as the "plates" with the control info on them, effect specific. This one's just a general distortion/fuzz plate, with gain, tone, and volume. Sadly, still no circuit! I barely managed to squeeze this into my schedule, I have a massive homework load that just got dumped on me this week :icon_sad:
(http://i50.tinypic.com/73ctuq.jpg)
Im digging the plate..could someone share how thats done?
Quote from: soggybag on January 30, 2010, 06:48:38 PM
Those knobs look like some I got from Futurlec. Mine are a little too small to fit a 1/4" shaft. Though they look like you could force them over a knurled press on type shaft.
I think these are the same, ordered from futurlec a while back. They fit fine over a 1/4", that's kind of weird?
Quote from: realizewhoitis on January 30, 2010, 08:01:35 PM
Im digging the plate..could someone share how thats done?
Just go and buy a thin sheet of aluminum, and etch it like you'd etch an enclosure.
Cutting it to size is the annoying part.... Though the right kind of wire cutter tool can cut through the plate marvelously like a pair of scissors as long as you go slow with it and make sure you aren't bending the plate as you cut :icon_biggrin: Then a file to get the edges down smooth and precise. In other situations, I have used a drill press (drill a bunch of holes along the line you want to cut and then cut the bridges between the plate and the piece) and a hacksaw (self explanatory)
Finally drill some holes for the pot shafts, and then to attach to the enclosure just screw the nuts onto the pots over the plate and it's not gonna go anywhere.
awesome! thanks for the info. where would you recommend getting the aluminum and is there a thickness i should look for?
Hmmm.... I just had a couple sheets lying around in my shop that I could use, but I think you can get a good medium sized piece of aluminum sheet at any home depot. I think that's where I got one of my sheets, but I remember it being a little bit expensive. Look around for a metal yard in your area, if you want something cheaper?
As far as thickness it's totally up to you and what you want but the thicker pieces are obviously harder to cut. Mine was like.... You know when you get a spiral notebook and the back cover is made of this card material? It was that kind of thickness, maybe very slightly thicker. Kind of a weird comparison I know but hey its the first thing that came to mind :icon_lol:
Quote from: JKowalski on January 24, 2010, 05:59:44 PM
(http://i48.tinypic.com/332xv1k.jpg)
That is really great work. I love the PCB to header connector!
I've been working on a breadboard implementation of the same idea. I went with a larger BB enclosure that has 5 replaceable pots. I figured 5 pots would handle 90% of the designs out there.
(http://www.beavisaudio.com/Projects/Open_Source_Stompbox_Platform/Test_1_Inside.jpg)
(http://www.beavisaudio.com/Projects/Open_Source_Stompbox_Platform/Test_1_Outside.jpg)
As far as the plates thing goes, yours looks very killer. I envisioned 1mm thick aluminum strip, one with 5 holes, one with 3, etc. That way you could easily remove the pots you don't need and have a nice cover to boot.
I'll post pix of the plates that I came up with.
Either way, your work is most excellent :)
I think it's a great idea for any diy'er to have a 'base unit'. brilliant design!
the fact that , like you said, you can build any weird circuit and not have the expence of box jacks switches, to prevent you from using it is a big plus for many diy'ers.
and the fact is, you could build 3 or 4 'base units' and then plug any of your 'plate circuits' into them individually in any combination.
less drilling, painting, wiring, etc. as well.
i like that the pots are discreet to the circuit as it solves the problem of mounting,
as well as making it more user friendly and less complicated.
i was playing with the modular idea, using a molex connector for +,-,in,out.
but here you've figured out a simple way of 'plugging in' your circuits.
very cool, i hope people read this thread and see how valuable this idea really is.
+10
what about using plastic plates with aluminum tape shielding. like pickguards!
1. easier to cut
2. cheaper
3. can be grounded through volume pot
you could use clear acrylic sheets that 'light up' via a super bright led...
you could use waterslide decals. print stickers even...
paint pens and clearcoat...
or something different for each one...
though i do like the etched aluminum look!
Hey JK, how are you attaching your pots to the different boards? My experience with board mounted pots is that once you started desoldergin/resoldering them their reliability nosedives and they'll soon be intermittent.
Quote from: Quackzed on February 01, 2010, 01:43:50 PM
I think it's a great idea for any diy'er to have a 'base unit'. brilliant design!
the fact that , like you said, you can build any weird circuit and not have the expence of box jacks switches, to prevent you from using it is a big plus for many diy'ers.
and the fact is, you could build 3 or 4 'base units' and then plug any of your 'plate circuits' into them individually in any combination.
less drilling, painting, wiring, etc. as well.
i like that the pots are discreet to the circuit as it solves the problem of mounting,
as well as making it more user friendly and less complicated.
i was playing with the modular idea, using a molex connector for +,-,in,out.
but here you've figured out a simple way of 'plugging in' your circuits.
very cool, i hope people read this thread and see how valuable this idea really is.
+10
Thanks! Yes, I was thinking about making more then one of these "base units" for the exact reason you described :icon_biggrin:
Quote from: Quackzed on February 01, 2010, 02:01:50 PM
what about using plastic plates with aluminum tape shielding. like pickguards!
1. easier to cut
2. cheaper
3. can be grounded through volume pot
you could use clear acrylic sheets that 'light up' via a super bright led...
you could use waterslide decals. print stickers even...
paint pens and clearcoat...
or something different for each one...
though i do like the etched aluminum look!
That acrylic sheet idea is an interesting one, I might have to try that! I have the space for the led that sticks OUT of the front (if you want it there), maybe sanding around the sides of the LED in a circle might shine some of the light sideways and light up the sheet a little bit...
If you using plastic there is no need to shield it. The metal enclosure underneath does the job for you, the plate is just totally decorative! The only thing that might be "unshielded" is if you don't use all the holes and leave some of them open, but that won't make enough of a difference in the shielding to go through the effort.
Quote from: trjones1 on February 01, 2010, 02:17:28 PM
Hey JK, how are you attaching your pots to the different boards? My experience with board mounted pots is that once you started desoldergin/resoldering them their reliability nosedives and they'll soon be intermittent.
I think you are assuming I will desolder the pots again and replace them for some reason, the answer is no. The pots are permanently soldered on to each individual effect board, they never come off. To remove the circuit (with pots) you just unscre the pot nuts and slide the board out of the enclosure, then slide the new board (with pots on it) into the pot holes and screw it on. You don't have to deal with individual parts or anything, it's a complete self contained board, you just hook up the header to it and you are done!
I will have a (germ?) fuzz board done for this unit very soon and you guys can see exactly how it all works :icon_biggrin:
Also, I was thinking about making a "big daddy" base unit - two foot switches, and two side by side pot hole systems in the same shape as this box has. So you could put two different units side by side in the same box, with a switch for each, or one really big effect spanning the whole box. The switching would be electronic, controlled by momentary switches, with a interior switch that can turn one switch into a tap button for tap tempo effects. (Took that idea from the invetobox ::)
Wow that is really clean work...very nicely done:)
Jeffrey
Ok dano now your pics have convinced me i could make/use something like this (had a mental block on how to work it out). As soon as i get some spare cash I'm gonna give it a go
That's great work Chris.
The PCB header idea is key. If the future PCBs are going to be floating around inside, I recommend coating the inside with electrical tape, just to be safe.
Also, you could make a standard PCB for the three pots with a header, so you can re-use the same pots for different effects if you want to, and not have to swap them out unless you need to. Standardize it with the LED too and a standoff so you can change LED colors if you want. If you are really ambitious, set it up for 2 color LED. A 12 pin header should do the trick. The circuit PCB could connect to the pot header and the switch PCB header at a standard distance which would make designing drop in PCB's a breeze.
You might also want to consider a 1/4" jack for an expression pedal or tap tempo control on the main PCB.
Quote from: MoltenVoltage on February 02, 2010, 08:32:38 PM
That's great work Chris.
The PCB header idea is key. If the future PCBs are going to be floating around inside, I recommend coating the inside with electrical tape, just to be safe.
Also, you could make a standard PCB for the three pots with a header, so you can re-use the same pots for different effects if you want to, and not have to swap them out unless you need to. Standardize it with the LED too and a standoff so you can change LED colors if you want. If you are really ambitious, set it up for 2 color LED. A 12 pin header should do the trick. The circuit PCB could connect to the pot header and the switch PCB header at a standard distance which would make designing drop in PCB's a breeze.
You might also want to consider a 1/4" jack for an expression pedal or tap tempo control on the main PCB.
I am planning a couple different probable changes to the unit before I start making boards for it. I am anxious to use it, but I want to get the whole convention perfected since this will be a sort of "standardization" for me. It should be as well thought out as possible.
1. Buying a better header connector (something with a shorter profile, since the current header presses against the lid when connected to the effects PCB). Also looking for a latching set. Another option is those "PCB" headers, where you etch pads onto the side of the PCB and carve out a little notch on each side, and the header slips onto the side of the PCB.... More space efficient, maybe less reliable...
2. I got a few strips of SMD components and SMD op amps, I might have a go with trying out SMD for the base board, since the SMD components can be mounted underneath the input/output jacks!
3. Maybe adding a 5v regulator to the base board for digital chip uses
The tap tempo input was an idea I was considering. Like I believe I said earlier, I was going to make a larger base unit with two switches. The unit would use electronic switching with momentaries. This will allow the footswitch controls to be utilized as either tap tempo switches or bypass switches, depending on the position of a DIP switch on the internal PCB. The footswitch LED's would change color according to their current mode, and they will turn on/off in accordance with the mom/latching style they are set for. The smaller version will be like the one I made, true bypass, likely external tap input.
I'm sticking to the potentiometer plans. I still think that having the pots directly mounted on the effect will make the whole process much easier. Pots are so expensive that I would be worried about conserving them...
Basically I think the header will end up having pins designated
Effect Input
Effect Output
Tap Input
V+
V-
5VDC
1/2V+
If you think of anything else please suggest it :icon_biggrin:
for tap tempo, you could have a dedicated jack (maybee 1/8" mono) on the base unit, and build a single tap tempo switch box with a 1/8" jack and just plug it in for effects that utilize the extra 'tap tempo pins' on the connector.
wow. both of those designs look way more useful and elegant than that over-complicated inventothingie. nice job guys!
Actually, use a stereo jack for the tap tempo and you could run two separate switches off a single stereo cable.
Or it could be used as an LFO input if you wanted to make a central LFO unit for your board, like in this video:
http://www.moltenvoltage.com/mv-53.html
The LFO unit connects into the other unit with a 1/4" cable and runs three different effects, each of which has a buffer on the LFO input. Its a nice way to sync up all your LFO-based effects.
Just put all three connections on the header for the main switch PCB.
Quote from: Quackzed on February 13, 2010, 05:53:55 AM
for tap tempo, you could have a dedicated jack (maybee 1/8" mono) on the base unit, and build a single tap tempo switch box with a 1/8" jack and just plug it in for effects that utilize the extra 'tap tempo pins' on the connector.
Thats exactly what I was going to do. If you look at my tap tempo trem I made a while ago I have a bank of 1/8" connectors for tap tempo interfacing among all my modulated pedals. This would follow the same convention.
I'm almost done with the tap control box, I have the hardware/software designed and ready but I need to pick up an quad XOR gate (the controller outputs through 8 jacks. They are arranged in banks of two, and any bank can be made to output either pulse or clock (set in the software), and invertable (set by dip switch and XOR gate).
Quote from: MoltenVoltage on February 13, 2010, 03:21:59 PM
Actually, use a stereo jack for the tap tempo and you could run two separate switches off a single stereo cable.
Or it could be used as an LFO input if you wanted to make a central LFO unit for your board, like in this video:
http://www.moltenvoltage.com/mv-53.html
The LFO unit connects into the other unit with a 1/4" cable and runs three different effects, each of which has a buffer on the LFO input. Its a nice way to sync up all your LFO-based effects.
Just put all three connections on the header for the main switch PCB.
My board is set up so that all my modulated pedals utilize Electric Druid's TAPLFO chip, and they all carry a tap tempo clock output and input, so they are all synch-able. Plus, each pedal can be synced to each other but use different timing intervals (1/2, 1, 2, etc.) and a different wave, since the interconnection is just a base time instead of an actual LFO.
;D
great mind think alike, right?
i really like the idea of a master lfo/clock that keeps everything in sync , and allows you seperately sync each pedal to double or half etc.. the rate,AND is adaptable to any modulated effect ...
its not obvious, but it seems like syncronization is a byproduct of making a modular lfo.
or at least an lfo that is feeding more than one effect.
but if your doing an lfo tap tempo,
what about a volume pedal controller you can plug in (1/8")and have control of one pot from each effect...rate for chorus, wet level for delay, gain amount, or even clipping threshold for diodes...etc.
even if it was utilized by only a few select pedals, it would be interesting to design something around the ability to have some level of foot control. where it is impractical to have a volume pedal attached to every fuzz you build, it suddenly isn't verry difficult to imagine a dedicated volume pedal jack to the connector to any effect that wants to use those pins
Quote from: Quackzed on February 13, 2010, 09:46:04 PM
what about a volume pedal controller you can plug in (1/8")and have control of one pot from each effect...rate for chorus, wet level for delay, gain amount, or even clipping threshold for diodes...etc.
even if it was utilized by only a few select pedals, it would be interesting to design something around the ability to have some level of foot control. where it is impractical to have a volume pedal attached to every fuzz you build, it suddenly isn't verry difficult to imagine a dedicated volume pedal jack to the connector to any effect that wants to use those pins
Ah, but now you are starting to make a modular synthesizer :icon_lol:
I'm not going to go that far, especially for this "base unit". It's not really meant to (well, my take on it) do complex circuits, it's more focused on the various tiny circuits that I feel would be useful in some situations but not worth the money to place it into a nice, dedicated box. I haven't found anything that I absolutely need foot controlled on any of my "dedicated" effects, but I suppose when I did I would design for that specifically.
Remember, the "expression pedal" is a system already in place on many commercial effects. I'm not sure... is that just a rheostat with either end connected to a stereo jack? I've never had the opportunity to look into one. Regardless, designing for those would be the obvious solution.
Quote from: dano12 on January 31, 2010, 09:43:39 PM
(http://www.beavisaudio.com/Projects/Open_Source_Stompbox_Platform/Test_1_Inside.jpg)
Hey that's pretty nifty, great idea. Cheaper than an Invento Box!
Looks like you could build a lot of stuff on that. You have it set up to use a PS. What if you moved the switch to the left or right, you could put a battery clip in there and run it off a 9V.
Looks like the switch overlaps the two breadboards a little?
Finally got around to remaking stompbox base unit, with two modules: a BMP and a Rebote Delay. Also finally found a use for the handful of SMD parts I have lying around.
(http://i28.tinypic.com/2gx30bp.jpg)
Fixed all the problems I had in the prototype. Though in hindsight, it would have been alot easier to use a larger box for this. :icon_rolleyes:
Great idea, that looks great.
Just out of curiosity, do you know what alloy of aluminum you are using for the etched plate? If you are using 2024, it should etch much more quickly than 6061 which is the other common high-strength alloy. What thickness are you using for it?
Quote from: soggybag on July 20, 2010, 05:42:44 PM
Great idea, that looks great.
Thanks
Quote from: amptramp on July 20, 2010, 06:57:24 PM
Just out of curiosity, do you know what alloy of aluminum you are using for the etched plate? If you are using 2024, it should etch much more quickly than 6061 which is the other common high-strength alloy. What thickness are you using for it?
No idea whatsoever. I had some scrap pieces lying around that I've been cutting up and using over time. They are both about the thickness of my driver's license
Actually, the two plates you see are from different scrap pieces. In real life you can see that the eagle design plate is a
little shinier and bluish while the doctor who plate is a
little more matte and greyscale. The second one etched ridiculously fast - so fast that the toner started melting from the intense heat of the reaction and ruining the etch even when using used ferric chloride (with enclosures its not so bad, it acts as a heat sink... but these are so small. I had to do a couple tries....) The eagle design plate, while about the same thickness, is sturdier then the who plate and etches a little slower.
Quote from: John Lyons on January 24, 2010, 07:27:28 PM
Looks more useful that the inventobox already!!
Nice work.
John
Oh, really? (http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=81880.20)
this is a nice idea! I had a similar one, but i was gonna thing to wire up a multi-fx box that can be added to as i go, not sure how to though.. so if i really like the effect i can put it in it's own box, otherwise i add it into the multi-fx enclosure. Needs some thinking, though...
Wow, that is great. Seems like it makes so much sense that it would be impossible to not make money off of this idea. This is definitely one of those 'wish I had thought of it' things.
My only thought on that thing is that you can only use pedals which actually use those 3 specific pot values. If you want more pots or different values and curves, you're pretty much SOL. Any workaround on that?
QuoteMy only thought on that thing is that you can only use pedals which actually use those 3 specific pot values.
If you're talking about the 'base unit' , the pots are part of the circuit board, and come out of the 'base unit' along with the circuit. It uses the pot shafts to mount the circuit, so they are a permanent part of the modular circuit board, not the 'base unit itself.
so if you want a different effect with different value pots, you'd just put different value pots on the circuit board of your new circuit, but in the same spots, so you can 'fit' it into the base unit. so its covered. ;)