hi guys..been messing around on my breadboard again....heres my latest little beast..
its really simple i know, but its got quite a good sound...just wondered if any you guys fancied adding your 2p worth on a
super simple 2 knob hi gainer project ...(but with more gain than mxr+ etc.).. so here goes..super simple..any ideas chuck em in..for all to see, change, or
whatever,..sounclip included too...
heres what ive got so far..which probably breaks all the rules but hey...dont laugh ok...it works..... :icon_rolleyes:
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/j20138666.jpg)
and heres what it sounds like..just through a mixer/ no amp..bit of verb n delay...........
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/j201386dist1.wav (http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/j201386dist1.wav)
suggestions !.. throw em in!...dont be shy!...... :icon_mrgreen:
Floating gate and great soundclip defy my logic.
:icon_eek:
That's one hell of a sound clip.
Maybe you could configure the two fets like the first stage of the BSIAB?
I was curious about your choice of leaving out input and output caps.
Quote from: culturejam on August 13, 2010, 07:36:57 PM
:icon_eek: That's one hell of a sound clip.
+1!!!
What if you put an electro parallel to the 56k res?! Would it give you too much gain?!
The main thing is...GIVE THIS MONSTER A NAMEEEEE!!! ;D
wow, i wasn't expecting THAT to come out of THIS!
why the caps in series, though? is it just to get a value that's 'just right?'
Link doesn't work for me. :icon_evil: Mind posting it some other way? I"d like to here this. The Lovepedal Purple Plexi is based around a 386IC so you might could take a look at it for some ideas. I've got a few schematics for 386 beginners projects but never really tried them because I'd hear the IC were really too noisey. Please try to post the soundclip in some other form.
Great sound clip!
How does it sound if you hold a note and allow it to fade out? I built a pedal with a 386 which sounds great - except that notes would fade out at the end with a buzzing noise. If the notes fade out nicely I may take a crack at this when I get some time, as I've got a spare 386. My only addition would be a tone stack with a boost stage afterward.
Quote from: tiges_ tendres on August 13, 2010, 07:44:25 PM
I was curious about your choice of leaving out input and output caps.
i took a look at the big daddy..no input caps etc.......
Quote from: Renegadrian on August 13, 2010, 07:52:51 PM
Quote from: culturejam on August 13, 2010, 07:36:57 PM
:icon_eek: That's one hell of a sound clip.
+1!!!
What if you put an electro parallel to the 56k res?! Would it give you too much gain?!
The main thing is...GIVE THIS MONSTER A NAMEEEEE!!! ;D
i'll try that.........as for a name!...hmmm....if its a collaboration it should be voted on by all that contribute i think.. :icon_mrgreen:
the 10uf from pin 1 going to ground really kicks it too much..i had to put a trim on there..but yeah i;ll try the electrolytic
suggestion....
Quote from: phector2004 on August 13, 2010, 09:37:40 PM
wow, i wasn't expecting THAT to come out of THIS!
why the caps in series, though? is it just to get a value that's 'just right?'
yeah it just sounded better...
Quote from: Electron Tornado on August 13, 2010, 10:31:08 PM
Great sound clip!
How does it sound if you hold a note and allow it to fade out? I built a pedal with a 386 which sounds great - except that notes would fade out at the end with a buzzing noise. If the notes fade out nicely I may take a crack at this when I get some time, as I've got a spare 386. My only addition would be a tone stack with a boost stage afterward.
yeah it gets a bit of flutter when it dies..
i had the same problem with 'krank' and a few others..thats why i just gave up and decided to attempt a basic
distortion that worked..then add a suitable tone stack afterwards...keeping it simple to start with........ :icon_mrgreen:
thats why i threw it up here so you more experienced guys can take a look and experiment on it.....
i just love messing around on breadboards without too much knowledge, but i know what my ears like.. :icon_mrgreen:
Quote from: petemoore on August 13, 2010, 07:14:27 PM
Floating gate and great soundclip defy my logic.
me too....but hey it works...by accident though!..i did say it probably breaks all the rules.ha ha.. :icon_mrgreen:
the eternal quest for excellent distortion continues........ :icon_twisted:
right heres another soundclip...as you can hear there is a break up n fizz around the dying note..
at the end i switch to rythm pickup...i love that sound..then bridge after....
i added a 100nf from the out of q1...into q2...i also tried the cap to ground off the 56k and it gave me less gain......
however it did clean up the fizz...but that not what we rock/metal heads want is it........ :icon_twisted: :icon_twisted: :icon_twisted:
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/j22.mp3 (http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/j22.mp3)
any ideas on getting rid of the fizz.....?...this seems to common with the 386!!!!
Quote from: deadastronaut on August 14, 2010, 11:06:06 AM
right heres another soundclip...as you can hear there is a break up n fizz around the dying note..
at the end i switch to rythm pickup...i love that sound..then bridge after....
i added a 100nf from the out of q1...into q2...i also tried the cap to ground off the 56k and it gave me less gain......
however it did clean up the fizz...but that not what we rock/metal heads want is it........
any ideas on getting rid of the fizz.....?...this seems to common with the 386!!!!
I had a similar problem with the fizz with my OD 386:
http://img163.imageshack.us/img163/9281/od386v21schematic.jpg
(http://img163.imageshack.us/img163/9281/od386v21schematic.jpg)
The tone stack is a modified BMP tone control and works great., however. It allows you to select mids that are humped, flat, or scooped.
The fizz remains a mystery, unfortunately.
deadastronaut,
Very good hand-grinder-jigsaw-drill-metalworshop sounding (and playing, indeed !) +
I was waiting for the decay : it cames in your second sample, and is unfortunately bad, blunt, abrupt... I am not surprised : I had the same rotten decay with my LM386 trials, but without the good sounding you achieved ! So I didn't go further. Electron Tornado seems to draw the same conclusion concerning the decay's quality.
I think that the LM386 is probably unable to de-saturate gently, even if you put truckloads of gain at its input. So maybe something can be done at the output, then... As the LM386 is a power amp, do you tested it with a louspeaker directly connected, to see if the decay changes ?
A+!
Sounds Great! I think I'll give it a try.
How does it sound with an output cap?
just out of curiosity, isn't the gate isolated from the drain and source? in other words, doesn't it just use capacitance to pinch off the current? do you really NEED an input cap, or is it just good practice?
Quote from: culturejam on August 15, 2010, 11:42:22 AM
How does it sound with an output cap?
sounds great..still has the fizz decay though!... :icon_cry: :icon_mrgreen:
Quote from: phector2004 on August 15, 2010, 12:09:46 PM
just out of curiosity, isn't the gate isolated from the drain and source? in other words, doesn't it just use capacitance to pinch off the current? do you really NEED an input cap, or is it just good practice?
hmmmmm..not sure on that man... ???
ive not seen many circuits without some input cap and resistor setup..
if you look at the big daddy it just has a 4m7 resistor to ground from input (G)...it does have a 15k from the 9v (D)though!..
also it has a 2.2k and a 2.2uf going to ground from the source.
Quote from: tubelectron on August 15, 2010, 06:30:51 AM
deadastronaut,
Very good hand-grinder-jigsaw-drill-metalworshop sounding (and playing, indeed !) +
I was waiting for the decay : it cames in your second sample, and is unfortunately bad, blunt, abrupt... I am not surprised : I had the same rotten decay with my LM386 trials, but without the good sounding you achieved ! So I didn't go further. Electron Tornado seems to draw the same conclusion concerning the decay's quality.
I think that the LM386 is probably unable to de-saturate gently, even if you put truckloads of gain at its input. So maybe something can be done at the output, then... As the LM386 is a power amp, do you tested it with a louspeaker directly connected, to see if the decay changes ?
A+!
so you think it may be an output problem then?..i havent tried it with just a speaker but i have just got an old radio that im ripping apart
i will give it a go and see if there is any difference..hmmmm interesting.
what i may do is actually use another breadboard and do the big daddy and see if that has the same fizz splutter on the dying notes too...
as long as i can still achieve hi tight gain still......... :icon_twisted: :icon_twisted: :icon_twisted:
anyone had success with big daddy and no fizz..???...hmmmm..
Quote from: deadastronaut on August 15, 2010, 12:29:34 PM
anyone had success with big daddy and no fizz..???...hmmmm..
I built a Big Daddy a long time ago, and no fizz. I've also mucked around with the 386 quite a bit and never got the fizz decay. But I have gotten it with a LM301 in a simple dirt circuit. I was too lazy to really figure out the issue, so I just tacked on a single clipping diode to ground, and that got rid of it.
Also, I've noticed that some LM386s are just bunk and sound bad when used as a distortion generator. If you haven't already, I'd suggest trying a few different 386 ICs to see if any of them sound better than what you have in there now.
Quote from: culturejam on August 15, 2010, 12:37:42 PM
Quote from: deadastronaut on August 15, 2010, 12:29:34 PM
anyone had success with big daddy and no fizz..???...hmmmm..
I built a Big Daddy a long time ago, and no fizz. I've also mucked around with the 386 quite a bit and never got the fizz decay. But I have gotten it with a LM301 in a simple dirt circuit. I was too lazy to really figure out the issue, so I just tacked on a single clipping diode to ground, and that got rid of it.
Also, I've noticed that some LM386s are just bunk and sound bad when used as a distortion generator. If you haven't already, I'd suggest trying a few different 386 ICs to see if any of them sound better than what you have in there now.
cheers . when you say you just tacked on a single clipping diode was that from the out put to ground?....
as for the 386's...i'm using lm386n-1/3/4.......i remember ubaid saying that about certain models of the same ic....
will have to do a search around for others i think....i'll definately try the big daddy then and see if i can bosst the hell out of it..ha ha.. :icon_mrgreen:
can you recommened a 386 model?...mine are JR96AC models..
Quote from: paulyy on August 15, 2010, 07:10:51 AM
Sounds Great! I think I'll give it a try.
yeah go for it paulyy..i remember you saying you were going to mess around with a j201/386 type circuit..
if we can nail this fizz problem it'll be a really cool pedal... :icon_twisted: :icon_twisted: :icon_twisted:
any ideas..improvements..welcome......
Quote from: deadastronaut on August 15, 2010, 12:43:05 PM
cheers . when you say you just tacked on a single clipping diode was that from the out put to ground?....
Yes.
Quote from: deadastronautas for the 386's...i'm using lm386n-1/3/4.......i remember ubaid saying that about certain models of the same ic....
I mean that if you have 10 of the same type of chip (LM386-n1, for example), maybe 2 or 3 of them just won't sound good in a distortion circuit. I usually audition a few of them in each circuit to see if one sounds better.
cheers . right gotcha..
ive just breaded the big daddy...heres the soundclip...same problem..if not worse..... :icon_frown:
its exactly as the schematic, except i put a 25k trim in place of the 15k resistor from 9v to drain...
must be the ic then???
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/bdaddy1.mp3 (http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/bdaddy1.mp3)
what a pain in the ass....hmmm i'll try swapping different ic's then.. :icon_rolleyes:
Hi again,
Quotewhat i may do is actually use another breadboard and do the big daddy and see if that has the same fizz splutter on the dying notes too...
as long as i can still achieve hi tight gain still.........
anyone had success with big daddy and no fizz.....hmmmm..
Among others, I tested the big daddy on its 2 variants (input FET buffer / input FET booster), none of them worked right : bad decay, bad sounding, at a point I was thinking that my LM386 were defective... A substitution proved not. But may be I had an unconsistent lot of LM386, as stated by culturejam.
A+!
cheers tubelectron..
ive tried 3 ic's, ..on the big daddy on bread...same noise!...hmmmm...
its a real shame because this ic makes an excellent distortion....
rob.
edit... back to plan a then!...... :icon_mrgreen:
Quoteits a real shame because this ic makes an excellent distortion....
I agree, very early Van Halen-esque sounding. I was waiting for you to break out in an "Eruption" :icon_mrgreen:
My thought is to somehow increase the sustain of the signal going into the 386 so the decay is delayed. I have a JOEGAGAN/ZZAGAR Bigger Muff on my breadboard that has great sustain, but I don't know enough to tell which part of the ckt. does it. Maybe someone else might.
Yes, deadastronaut...
Listening to your samples proves it : the distortion is (very) good (I never had that, or even something vaguely close !), but there is this problem of abrupt decay - I must confess that I can't stand that (mainly because I am a rhythm & blues player).
Just for info, I found a satisfactory issue with a Vintage RAT RI (3-knobs, big box) that I rebuilt to original specs, and also with my DIY Doctor FUZZ distorsion pedal (2-knobs), using a 1458 in a boosted version of the distortion section of the Muff Fuzz Crying Tone Pedal I had for years (and sold stupidly). But yes, even if these are heavy distortions with long and regular sustain and smooth vanishing decay, it is not as devastating as your sampled trials, indeed and unfortunately... (In addition, I am not very qualified for metal playing... with my ES-335TD and Silverface Fenders... And somewhat "roots" playing style).
Here's a quick shot of my 2-knobs Doctor FUZZ (made in 1996) :
(http://img7.hostingpics.net/pics/247923IMG_3898.jpg)
But there is some guys here who strangely seems to have good results with the LM386 that we haven't. The chip selection musn't be the sole mystery !
A+!
Quote from: Wild E on August 15, 2010, 04:38:55 PM
Quoteits a real shame because this ic makes an excellent distortion....
I agree, very early Van Halen-esque sounding. I was waiting for you to break out in an "Eruption" :icon_mrgreen:
My thought is to somehow increase the sustain of the signal going into the 386 so the decay is delayed. I have a JOEGAGAN/ZZAGAR Bigger Muff on my breadboard that has great sustain, but I don't know enough to tell which part of the ckt. does it. Maybe someone else might.
Maybe a simple compressor after the FETs?
maybee tack 2 opposed leds on the end, see if its the op amp clipping harshly? or try a resistor to ground at the 386 input and dial back the volume on the input of the opamp, maybee you could remove alot of the fizz without losing a noticable amount of dirt?
it does sound good expt for the fizz/decay...
and the playing is goood. :icon_twisted:
or try a series resistance at the output? 10k?
The Smash Drive has a 500k resistor coming out of the 386 to the output and as far as I know does not fizz...
nice suggestions guys.
@phil hector , a simple compressor?..how would i go about that?....
@tubelectron...yeah i dont see how krank got away with selling the distortus maximus if it has this problem?
they and others must have had this grief when designing and got round it somehow.. personally i have tried 4 different diy versions and all have the same decay fizz/flutter problem.....
@quackzed, led clipping then..or 10k out . i'll give it a go...
@bloozeman. yep i'll try it!..
i'll try these today and see what happens....
more clips to follow :icon_rolleyes:...we'll get there im sure!..... :icon_mrgreen:
aron!..did you have any grief like this with your smash drive too!.. as it is a 386!!!!
waheyyy.what an improvement... listen to this one..i tried all the suggestions apart from the compressor..
to no avail still fizzed... :'(
then i had a brainstorm and remembered a friend telling me about power filtering!.(which i have seen a million times on other circuits :icon_rolleyes:).
so i stuck a 50v 100uf across the 9v to ground..(i'll try some other values later on)..
much much better..loses a bit of top end..but that can be pulled back with an eventual tone /stack/control i think!..(maybe buffered etc.)
but for now i just want to get it cleaned up and usable first..
heres the clip..it starts with the 100uf cap on...then without it....then the last bit is putting the cap in and out while decaying...
i'm a great believer in hearing what it sounds like..rather than diagrams/pics ok..this is still the 'big daddy' i am going to revert back to my original 2 j201 design
later ok. then i will re-post that again, with the cap included... :icon_rolleyes:
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/100uf1.mp3 (http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/100uf1.mp3)
a lot cleaner!
what do you think!.. :icon_mrgreen: or :-\
Deadastronaut, see my posts on the Smash Drive thread.
Quote from: Electron Tornado on August 16, 2010, 08:51:13 AM
Deadastronaut, see my posts on the Smash Drive thread.
yep have...
anyway upon this journey of breading both the smashdrive and the big daddy i ended up (i think) improving them both and
combinig a bastardized version of them both.and it works ok...no problems...
introducing the 'big daddies bastard sister'
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/bigbastard1.jpg)
right , anyway now ive been toally side tracked ,im going to apply the same principal to the original 2xj201 design and see what happens there..keep em peeled....... :icon_eek:
Much better!
Since you still have it on the board, you should try adding a 100nf cap in parallel with the 100uf. Give it a bit more "fast response" on the ripple rejection than just having the 100uf.
You may not be able to hear any difference, but I think it's worth a shot.
Quote from: culturejam on August 16, 2010, 09:27:53 AM
Much better!
Since you still have it on the board, you should try adding a 100nf cap in parallel with the 100uf. Give it a bit more "fast response" on the ripple rejection than just having the 100uf.
You may not be able to hear any difference, but I think it's worth a shot.
cheers man..will do!..the above schematic works fine..but yeah i'll try that too while its on there...and before my cat knocks it about :icon_mrgreen:
edit: just tried it...gave off a rumble at the decaying note though...
heres the soundclip of the 'big daddies bastard sister above....gain allthe way dow...then full on...it seems to work ok... :icon_mrgreen:
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/bastardsister1.mp3 (http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/bastardsister1.mp3)
what dya think guys..?
you have a 4.7 nf cap in series with a 2.2 nf cap ... in that configuration they behave like one 1.5 nf cap.
so to reduce parts count, remove those and try a cap right around 1.5 nf
Quote from: deadastronaut on August 16, 2010, 09:30:38 AM
edit: just tried it...gave off a rumble at the decaying note though...
That's odd. Hmmm. Oh well, go with what works!
Another thought I had (not related to the fizz):
Have you thought about cranking up the "preamp" gain (the FETs) and lowering the power amp gain (386)??
Like maybe put a 2u2 bypass cap on at least the first FET to up the overall gain and also to up the bottom end a bit.
I'll try to breadboard this later today and see what happens.
Quote from: Derringer on August 16, 2010, 09:38:31 AM
you have a 4.7 nf cap in series with a 2.2 nf cap ... in that configuration they behave like one 1.5 nf cap.
so to reduce parts count, remove those and try a cap right around 1.5 nf
oh..ok...i'll try it ..cheers....
sounclip on page 2...of the big daddies bs
so they should be parallel to make the value up then ?...i didnt have a 6,8nf..
edit: have removed the 4.7nf..all is ok still.......
Quote from: culturejam on August 16, 2010, 09:39:21 AM
Quote from: deadastronaut on August 16, 2010, 09:30:38 AM
edit: just tried it...gave off a rumble at the decaying note though...
That's odd. Hmmm. Oh well, go with what works!
Another thought I had (not related to the fizz):
Have you thought about cranking up the "preamp" gain (the FETs) and lowering the power amp gain (386)??
Like maybe put a 2u2 bypass cap on at least the first FET to up the overall gain and also to up the bottom end a bit.
I'll try to breadboard this later today and see what happens.
great yeah i'll try that when i reboard it up...cheers man,.
Thanks, deadastronaut. My schematic doesn't show it, but I also have power filtering. However, I used a J102 in front. I wonder if I should try a J201 with the trim pot and cap.
Quote from: Electron Tornado on August 16, 2010, 09:45:22 AM
Thanks, deadastronaut. My schematic doesn't show it, but I also have power filtering. However, I used a J102 in front. I wonder if I should try a J201 with the trim pot and cap.
go for it man..whats the worst that can happen...!.. :icon_mrgreen:
post ya results though man.........
It sounds great! How does it sound through an actual amp to speaker to microphone?
-Joe Hart
Quote from: Joe Hart on August 16, 2010, 09:53:06 AM
It sounds great! How does it sound through an actual amp to speaker to microphone?
-Joe Hart
hi joe. havent tried it yet..but it sounds good through a moody mixer and stereo so far...so it may just need adjusting
for an actual amp.cab situation..
will try my original design first...damn i need another bread board..ha ha ... :icon_mrgreen:
sounds good man, and the fizz is gone ! 8)
at least i can't hear anything objectionable in the last clips.
much better!
Quote from: Quackzed on August 16, 2010, 10:28:11 AM
sounds good man, and the fizz is gone ! 8)
at least i can't hear anything objectionable in the last clips.
much better!
yeah...wahhheyyyy...maybe this should be 'how to tame a 386 thread' ha ha... :icon_mrgreen:
makes me wonder now about the old projects ive binned because of this problem... :icon_rolleyes:
Quote from: deadastronaut on August 16, 2010, 10:36:42 AM
makes me wonder now about the old projects ive binned because of this problem... :icon_rolleyes:
me too!!!
(can you see all those boards with a 386 on them coming out from the bins!!! Zombies're back!!! :D
Thx for sharing your tests m8
Armando
Quote from: arma61 on August 16, 2010, 10:45:50 AM
Quote from: deadastronaut on August 16, 2010, 10:36:42 AM
makes me wonder now about the old projects ive binned because of this problem... :icon_rolleyes:
me too!!!
(can you see all those boards with a 386 on them coming out from the bins!!! Zombies're back!!! :D
Thx for sharing your tests m8
Armando
yeah ive still got most of em... :icon_rolleyes:
as for sharing...no problem..that's what its all about!.........combining forces , bouncing ideas around etc......... :icon_mrgreen:
am working on a vero of the b****d sister now...just to get it out of my head and into reality... :icon_eek:
You got rid of the fizz with a 386? Can you post the schematic, or is it the second one you posted?
Thanks
Rob
i like the collaboration idea, it would be cool to have a folder of original 'forum effects'. new, and altered circuits that have been scrutinized and honed by us 'effects guys'. like a sort of brand name... instead of 'pedal x with joes mods' it could be like, pedal x with refinements and enhancements that are forum approved or something... i can see a voting thread on what makes for the ultimate 'smooth overdrive' say... or the forum approved metal stomp etc... when people come looking for a pedal with a scooped sound for metal or a light overdrive, it could be fun to find the 'ultimate' one, just based on clips and voting and a refinement phase... get a circuit that is considered good for x by vote, then a what can we do to make this better quieter etc... then a final version type thing that can go in the folder...
maybee even nominate some interested 'heavies' as inspector 12 and tone nazi 9. might be good to have at least a somewhat 'forum approved' list of effects and their catagories...
even a 'i think my pedal z kicks forum pedal x's butt, and do a shootout. ha.
challenge the reigning 'crunch pedal' and win!
might be a fun motivator for experimentation...
Quote from: caspercody on August 16, 2010, 11:12:13 AM
You got rid of the fizz with a 386? Can you post the schematic, or is it the second one you posted?
Thanks
Rob
yep...seems so....a simple 100uf on the power to ground seems to have sorted it........
yeah the page 2 'b*****d sister'.....i took out the 4.7 nf though ok.
heres a vero of it....unverified as yet......but i just knocked it up to get it out of my head...ok ..any problems anyone can see with this?..
apart from it being untidy/big etc.... :icon_mrgreen:..
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/bastardsister1.gif)
Quote from: Quackzed on August 16, 2010, 11:29:28 AM
i like the collaboration idea, it would be cool to have a folder of original 'forum effects'. new, and altered circuits that have been scrutinized and honed by us 'effects guys'. like a sort of brand name... instead of 'pedal x with joes mods' it could be like, pedal x with refinements and enhancements that are forum approved or something... i can see a voting thread on what makes for the ultimate 'smooth overdrive' say... or the forum approved metal stomp etc... when people come looking for a pedal with a scooped sound for metal or a light overdrive, it could be fun to find the 'ultimate' one, just based on clips and voting and a refinement phase... get a circuit that is considered good for x by vote, then a what can we do to make this better quieter etc... then a final version type thing that can go in the folder...
maybee even nominate some interested 'heavies' as inspector 12 and tone nazi 9. might be good to have at least a somewhat 'forum approved' list of effects and their catagories...
even a 'i think my pedal z kicks forum pedal x's butt, and do a shootout. ha.
challenge the reigning 'crunch pedal' and win!
might be a fun motivator for experimentation...
yeah i like that idea...better to have a solid project to start with...then mods galore will be inevitable...
yeah cool......this 386 has been p***ing me off for ages...lol.... :icon_mrgreen:
probably been messing with it for over a year...dont laugh..but as im no electronics engineer i suppose thats to be expected. :icon_rolleyes:
but hey i do love the idea of getting something my ears like!...and not so much how its really meant to be done...
as i said in the first post on this, i know im bound to breaking the rules of how it should be done..but hey if it works why not!. :icon_twisted: :icon_twisted: :icon_twisted: :icon_mrgreen:
;D
don't think in terms of "breaking rules" so much
any rules to break would be those of nature and you're going to have quite a hard time doing that ;)
just think more in terms of, as you have already said, "trusting your ears" and traditional approaches be damned
now plz go and record eruption for us
k?
thx
:icon_mrgreen:
you fixed it!
gonna post any clips through an amp? I know the spaghetti monster I've got on my breadboard gets distortion just by being !@#$%^& LOUD! So loud, it boosts my SS clean channel into distortion :icon_redface:
How does it work with speakers?
(p.s. compressor idea was just a thought: http://www.fortunecity.com/tinpan/humperdinck/223/comp.gif (http://www.fortunecity.com/tinpan/humperdinck/223/comp.gif)... that's the simplest one I could find and its WAYYYY too complicated. Your new design sounds great!)
I went ahead and breadboarded it today and sounds really good Then I took another circuit from Bryan Whamplers advanced DIY effect pedals book, metal dist circuit and added the last part of the circuit to your layout and liked what I got. Still tweaking with it.
Quote from: Derringer on August 16, 2010, 11:48:31 AM
;D
don't think in terms of "breaking rules" so much
any rules to break would be those of nature and you're going to have quite a hard time doing that ;)
just think more in terms of, as you have already said, "trusting your ears" and traditional approaches be damned
now plz go and record eruption for us
k?
thx
:icon_mrgreen:
thanks derringer wise words.....i dont know about eruption though!...ha ha.....used to know it....i'll have a think on that!. :icon_mrgreen:
Quote from: phector2004 on August 16, 2010, 11:52:11 AM
you fixed it!
gonna post any clips through an amp? I know the spaghetti monster I've got on my breadboard gets distortion just by being !@#$%^& LOUD! So loud, it boosts my SS clean channel into distortion :icon_redface:
How does it work with speakers?
(p.s. compressor idea was just a thought: http://www.fortunecity.com/tinpan/humperdinck/223/comp.gif (http://www.fortunecity.com/tinpan/humperdinck/223/comp.gif)... that's the simplest one I could find and its WAYYYY too complicated. Your new design sounds great!)
yep . will set up my amp tomorrow and give it a go ok...cheers man..
Quote from: paulyy on August 16, 2010, 12:01:36 PM
I went ahead and breadboarded it today and sounds really good Then I took another circuit from Bryan Whamplers advanced DIY effect pedals book, metal dist circuit and added the last part of the circuit to your layout and liked what I got. Still tweaking with it.
nice one paulyy...got any clips man!......gotta hear em...by law of this thread!.. :icon_mrgreen:
im off to the shops to treat myself to a well deserved beer .phewwww.....and sit in the sun...i said sit!.. :icon_mrgreen: :icon_mrgreen: :icon_mrgreen:
cheers guys...let us
all know the results of your efforts...keep up the spirit of collaboration... :icon_mrgreen:
I mentioned this somewhere else, but just as a suggestion, try removing the gain pot and just use a toggle to switch between high and low gain, there's really no in between.
See if a gain pot like the Krank Distortus Maximus gives better control.
morning m8s (at least for Europe!)
as fas as the name is concerned I would like to suggest DREADNOUGHT (The battleship) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dreadnought
Cheers
morning all....9.15 here....yawn!..stretch....yawn!.............
Quote from: arma61 on August 17, 2010, 03:48:05 AM
morning m8s (at least for Europe!)
as fas as the name is concerned I would like to suggest DREADNOUGHT (The battleship) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dreadnought
If that's to long, name it after the battleship USS Missouri: "Mighty Mo", or "Big Mo".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Missouri_(BB-63) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Missouri_(BB-63))
Of course, if someone decides that's more of a Three Stooges reference, then you'd have to come up with "Larry" and "Curly" mods. :icon_lol:
Since this is a "hair metal" type sound, I'd recommend you call it Aqua Net.
(http://www.frank151.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/09/aquanet2.JPG)
by request, an amp demo of the 2 knob distortion....still on breadboard... :icon_mrgreen:
youtubes compression has made it slightly tinnier.(as always) :icon_rolleyes:.so ignore that..you get the idea!.....
http://www.youtube.com/user/100roberthenry#p/u/6/W_5SZVyUP-Y (http://www.youtube.com/user/100roberthenry#p/u/6/W_5SZVyUP-Y)
enjoy..my cat didnt.. :icon_mrgreen:
anyone tinkered with it yet?
anyone see any flaws in the vero layout?
i am going to build this one anyway just to free up my breadboard so i can crack on with the original 2xj201 design....build it guys..you wont be disappointed...sounds excellent. to me anyway..:icon_twisted: :icon_twisted: :icon_twisted:
Whoa. I'll have to break my 770DX out of the closet! ;D
Quote from: culturejam on August 17, 2010, 10:48:29 AM
Whoa. I'll have to break my 770DX out of the closet! ;D
yeah do it!.... :icon_twisted: :icon_twisted: :icon_twisted:
With the "bright" on (in your demo), it sounds like Annihilator on their "Alice in Hell" album. :icon_mrgreen:
Quote from: culturejam on August 17, 2010, 11:00:39 AM
With the "bright" on (in your demo), it sounds like Annihilator on their "Alice in Hell" album. :icon_mrgreen:
yeah that kicks ass on the bright setting...this is definately going in a box.
just waiting on some nice jewel amp lights for it...well nice look too........ :icon_twisted: :icon_twisted: :icon_twisted:
hi guys..i can confirm the vero .........ive built it...yay...
it all works fine and mean etc....
but when i unplug the guitar input and leave the effect on it hums.......any ideas on this little prob...???
it doesnt do it when plugged in!..........
@electron tornado. i tried it without the pot..and it screams..(oscillates like hell..lol.)..
the pot tends to keeps it under control...just to let ya know ..
rob.
Quote from: culturejam on August 17, 2010, 11:00:39 AM
With the "bright" on (in your demo), it sounds like Annihilator on their "Alice in Hell" album. :icon_mrgreen:
silly question.......
where the "bright " switch come from ?! is it on the amp ?
Quote from: deadastronaut on August 17, 2010, 04:05:16 PM
but when i unplug the guitar input and leave the effect on it hums.......any ideas on this little prob...???
it doesnt do it when plugged in!..........
Sounds like something isn't grounded properly.
are you using a stereo jack for the input? for power off when unplugged? or do you mean unplug from the guitar with the chord still in, if so that seems normal, at least for high gain/fuzz type stuff...either way, thats not the intended use and shouldnt be a problem in use... can't think of a time when your gonna have it plugged into an amp with nothing at the input?..
Quote from: arma61 on August 17, 2010, 06:10:16 PM
Quote from: culturejam on August 17, 2010, 11:00:39 AM
With the "bright" on (in your demo), it sounds like Annihilator on their "Alice in Hell" album. :icon_mrgreen:
silly question.......
where the "bright " switch come from ?! is it on the amp ?
yep its on the amp..... not silly at all..
thx thought I've missed something along the way!
btw great f&^*ng demo..... :icon_evil: do you think I can get close to that sound (sound-wise not playing-wise :D) with a strato and a Peavy Revolution? or your Marshall amp is "part" of that sound ?
Thx
Armando
Quote from: arma61 on August 18, 2010, 04:53:16 AM
thx thought I've missed something along the way!
btw great f&^*ng demo..... :icon_evil: do you think I can get close to that sound (sound-wise not playing-wise :D) with a strato and a Peavy Revolution? or your Marshall amp is "part" of that sound ?
Thx
Armando
cheer armando. i have no idea on the amp your using..but this is a very different monster through an amp..
i suspect you will get a nicer hendrixy and bluesy sound when the volume is backed off too...using a fender etc....
Quote from: Quackzed on August 17, 2010, 09:45:29 PM
are you using a stereo jack for the input? for power off when unplugged? or do you mean unplug from the guitar with the chord still in, if so that seems normal, at least for high gain/fuzz type stuff...either way, thats not the intended use and shouldnt be a problem in use... can't think of a time when your gonna have it plugged into an amp with nothing at the input?..
hi quackzed. no im not using a stereo plug,...im plugging the vero into my breadboard just to test and use its in/out/9v/ground..
i see your point of never having to use it that way, but my boogie isnt half as hummy in the same situation..
guess i'll have to look for any stray solder or something...hmmmm...strange...
btw i socketed the 2.2nf just to be able to change rather than solder in..could be switched!..rotary!..etc..hmmm..options..
heres the vero built..
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/P180810_09.51%5B01%5D.JPG)
if you use an 8 pins (or more) IC socket then you can parallel caps to "uncommon values" and mix type (ceramic, poly, electro..)
Quote from: arma61 on August 18, 2010, 05:19:44 AM
if you use an 8 pins (or more) IC socket then you can parallel caps to "uncommon values" and mix type (ceramic, poly, electro..)
i think i know what you mean..!
what like another socket full of caps.to choose from by way of switching on the input?..sorry its early..im still half asleep. :icon_mrgreen:...?
ahhhhh the inevitable mods are already coming...
while i m at it , ive got a tonestack on a small breadboard , i'll try it with that today and see how it behaves...just out of curiosity..
edit: wow! this thing is loud as it is an amp i suppose......i matched my bypassed level to this and the volume on the effect goes
to about 10 oclock on the pot...to be unity....
Have you tried it as an amp?
Haven't read up on the chip, but its the 'heart' of the noisy cricket, ruby etc, maybe it can drive headphones at 4am when the neighbors would otherwise be sharpening their knives :icon_mrgreen:
In reference to the vero build: where's the other FET? I only see one.
Quote from: phector2004 on August 18, 2010, 11:35:20 AM
Have you tried it as an amp?
Haven't read up on the chip, but its the 'heart' of the noisy cricket, ruby etc, maybe it can drive headphones at 4am when the neighbors would otherwise be sharpening their knives :icon_mrgreen:
no i havent but i bet it would drive a speaker though!.......so you know my neighbours then?... :icon_mrgreen:
i'll have to find a speaker and try it...(yep noisy cricket, ruby)...amps.
would it have to be an 8ohm speaker...or any?..
Quote from: culturejam on August 18, 2010, 02:27:40 PM
In reference to the vero build: where's the other FET? I only see one.
yep 1 only (for now)..this was where i was trying out the big daddy and smash drive.. trying to see if they fizzed...
going to try the original schematic again...with the 100uf cap 9v to ground..again!!!..got a lot on at the moment
busy busy busy...will do it asap........ :icon_mrgreen:
I built the Purple Plexi, and Krank pedals and these do not fizzle out on a sustained note. But it sounds like something is getting louder as the note fades off. I can not describe it any better than that. I looked at the schematics for these pedals and both of them have capacitors on the power supply side to ground. The Purple Plexi has additional diodes on the power supply.
Quote from: caspercody on August 19, 2010, 10:31:49 AM
I built the Purple Plexi, and Krank pedals and these do not fizzle out on a sustained note. But it sounds like something is getting louder as the note fades off. I can not describe it any better than that. I looked at the schematics for these pedals and both of them have capacitors on the power supply side to ground. The Purple Plexi has additional diodes on the power supply.
hi caspercody...no fizzle?...but sounds like its getting louder?...i take it the purple plexi is a 386 too!..(havent looked yet)..
as ive said' i built 4 versions of the 'krank' and they all fizzled on the decay, even when changing the ic's....it seems like a very 'sensitive' ic..
ive even asked youtubers demoing the 'krank' and they have confirmed the fizzle too....
ive looked at the schematics over again..yep they do have caps to ground too..but still have noise issues...
it seems like an inherent problem with 386 circuits...the vero on this thread is verified and seems to work ok.
i am working on a simple tone control for it at the moment...mainly because i have an old enclosure with 3 holes drilled already.. :icon_mrgreen:
and to see how it sounds...cheers rob.
The Purple Plexi is a 386 based pedal. There is also a 10 ohm resistor in series with the positive battery to pin 6 and a 100n to ground.
Quote from: caspercody on August 19, 2010, 11:16:12 AM
The Purple Plexi is a 386 based pedal. There is also a 10 ohm resistor in series with the positive battery to pin 6 and a 100n to ground.
cheers i'll take a look at that...but it still has problems though!!!!....im not sure what the cure could be on that!..
its a shame that these problematic circuits get circulated before they are completely tested..thoroughly eh!... :icon_rolleyes:
What 386 are you using? JRC386? LM386? N1? N3?
Quote from: Slade on August 19, 2010, 11:26:41 AM
What 386 are you using? JRC386? LM386? N1? N3?
hi slade...lm 386n-1
The other thing I read is that the manufacturer does recommend a 10u from pin 7 to ground. This is to help stabilize the circuit.
Quote from: caspercody on August 19, 2010, 11:39:45 AM
The other thing I read is that the manufacturer does recommend a 10u from pin 7 to ground. This is to help stabilize the circuit.
yep...done that on the vero page 3...
Quote from: deadastronaut on August 19, 2010, 11:28:19 AM
Quote from: Slade on August 19, 2010, 11:26:41 AM
What 386 are you using? JRC386? LM386? N1? N3?
hi slade...lm 386n-1
Daniel Schwartz recommends using LM386 N-3 for this 386 based pedals.. Maybe you should try that.
Quote from: Slade on August 19, 2010, 11:44:04 AM
Quote from: deadastronaut on August 19, 2010, 11:28:19 AM
Quote from: Slade on August 19, 2010, 11:26:41 AM
What 386 are you using? JRC386? LM386? N1? N3?
hi slade...lm 386n-1
Daniel Schwartz recommends using LM386 N-3 for this 386 based pedals.. Maybe you should try that.
ok...i think i have one..and a 4....is there any noticable difference between a jrc..and a lm..then?
edit: i stuck a simple tone control on the end...volume unity is now at 2oclock on the volume pot...
it goes from bassy to very bright..but a good range.. needs tweaking a bit...i would prefer more of a scoop .but its sounds great with my morley wah too...
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/tonecontrolvero1.gif)
just made this for the hell of it..and to fit an old box i have with 3 holes ready drilled...shame to waste a hole etc......
anyone messed with this yet then?....... :icon_cool:
Hi deadastronaut,
It seems that you get rid of the "bad decay" by filtering the +9VDC with a 100µF... It is so simple that we often forgot it ! So your circuit was surely suffering High Frequency (RF) or ultrasonic oscillation - I wonder how I forgot to suggest it to you, as I do it on nearly all my stompboxes : a RC filter which stops the hum coming from a non-filtered PSU wallwart and AC grounds the + to mass (-) to avoid RF oscillation.
ButButBut : saying that, I am not sure, but I think I forgot it when I have done my 386 trials... The job will have to be redone then... What a nut.
About the hum when unplugged : maybe your circuit is badly shielded, or the input jack is not grounded when unplugged, or a mass connection is lacking somewhere... It is so simple that we again often forgot it !
Anyway, congratulations - your dual fet + 386 will be a killer machine, then.
A=!
Quote from: tubelectron on August 22, 2010, 03:34:04 AM
Hi deadastronaut,
It seems that you get rid of the "bad decay" by filtering the +9VDC with a 100µF... It is so simple that we often forgot it ! So your circuit was surely suffering High Frequency (RF) or ultrasonic oscillation - I wonder how I forgot to suggest it to you, as I do it on nearly all my stompboxes : a RC filter which stops the hum coming from a non-filtered PSU wallwart and AC grounds the + to mass (-) to avoid RF oscillation.
ButButBut : saying that, I am not sure, but I think I forgot it when I have done my 386 trials... The job will have to be redone then... What a nut.
About the hum when unplugged : maybe your circuit is badly shielded, or the input jack is not grounded when unplugged, or a mass connection is lacking somewhere... It is so simple that we again often forgot it !
Anyway, congratulations - your dual fet + 386 will be a killer machine, then.
A=!
hi tubelectron. i take it mass=ground?....im guessing.!.. ???
yep the 100uf has definately helped. am back on the 2 fet j201's project now...
just trying to get the right gain out of the fets going into the 386!...
any thoughts on what the 2 fets setup should be...as i am just experimenting with many values on the breadboard...?????
cheers rob.
There is a "design" flaw in the first schematic. The lack of a gate to ground input resistor and output cap. You are relying on a path to ground for the gate to ground resistor at the input that a guitar or effect before this MIGHT supply(interesting thing with JFETs is you can use high value resistors for the gate to ground or ref, 3gig etc so a leakage path can work as a resistor sometimes). Also you are relying on a input cap on the following effect amp etc device after the first circuit. DC on the output might "upset" the following circuit. If this is feeding a tube preamp check the operating points of the first tube in the amp with the first circuit plugged in the amp.
Two caps in series are just the same as one cap of a lower than the smallest value cap, easy to find math on the web to figure it out.
removed by rob..ha ha...
Hi deadastronaut,
Yes : mass is ground... Sorry.
The Dr Boogie schematics looks like if there was here a "tube-to-FET substitution"... If it behaves like the equivalent tube circuit, the 1st stage gives clean gain, and the 2nd, 3rd and 4th gives a "progressive clipping distribution" between the different stages : it explains many of the inter-stage RC filters and attenuators, in order to obtain touch-sensitive and stable distortion, good sustain and decay. Let me say that it is not so easy to achieve (with tubes), by experience, mainly if you want a very broad range of overdrive while staying consistent at any gain level, and particularly at the low levels.
A+!
removed by rob....of no use... :icon_mrgreen:
Quote from: deadastronaut on August 22, 2010, 09:40:43 AM
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/boogiesections.jpg)
I don't know if you drew that schematic originally, but I'd appreciate it if builders did not use runoffgroove.com's schematic symbols for other circuits to prevent confusion: http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=44909.0
i have no idea....it was on google...didnt mean to offend.......!..
i dont remember seeing a dr boogie on runoffgroove?..
No offense was taken. That thread is quite old (downright ancient in terms of "teh intarwebz") and since this thread is getting a lot of views, I figured it was a good spot to mention it.
Hi Rob, I now have $.02 to throw into the pot. Experimenting with values might get some good sounds, but it could take a while. I'm a big fan of the fetzer valve article at http://www.runoffgroove.com/index.html (http://www.runoffgroove.com/index.html) to help learn about biasing fet's. It'll sidetrack you for a bit but should help. After you read the article I would say set your source resistor to Idss then vary Vd between 1/2 V+ and Vp untill you get that sweet spot. You can omit the gate cap if you want. As a note from experience, two fetzer valves set at Vp is too much so I would set the second one closer to 1/2 V+.
I plan to try your 1 fet version as soon as I get the parts I'm missing, it sounds great!
I think B Tremblay has ESP! He posted while I was typing about his site. too funny.
Quote from: Wild E on August 22, 2010, 10:51:08 AM
Hi Rob, I now have $.02 to throw into the pot. Experimenting with values might get some good sounds, but it could take a while. I'm a big fan of the fetzer valve article at http://www.runoffgroove.com/index.html (http://www.runoffgroove.com/index.html) to help learn about biasing fet's. It'll sidetrack you for a bit but should help. After you read the article I would say set your source resistor to Idss then vary Vd between 1/2 V+ and Vp untill you get that sweet spot. You can omit the gate cap if you want. As a note from experience, two fetzer valves set at Vp is too much so I would set the second one closer to 1/2 V+.
I plan to try your 1 fet version as soon as I get the parts I'm missing, it sounds great!
cheers mike..yeah i need to actually learn that stuff , and put the time in...instead of guessing and trial and error etc..
its such terminology as 'idss' that gets me!..whats that mean?...sorry for dumbass questions!.. :icon_redface:
i'll read it, and stuff it in my head ok...cheers mike. thanks. rob. (good luck with he 1 fet its great!)..ijust want a bit more gritn gain..(i am greedy)..lol.
Quote from: Wild E on August 22, 2010, 10:57:12 AM
I think B Tremblay has ESP! He posted while I was typing about his site. too funny.
yeah must have... :icon_mrgreen: ive been told off. :icon_redface:..but fair play to him i didnt know it was his stuff!.. :icon_rolleyes:
edit: cheers mike.for the link..great article...a must read for a dumbass like me ha ha... :icon_mrgreen:
It took me a couple of times for it to sink in, but I guess I'm a "catch on quick after a long time " kinda guy. Give it a read or two, it will help.
Hi again deadastronaut,
Quotewould this give hi gain distortion ?..or would it be like the boogie a matter of doing all sections..!..
As you guessed it, I am more specialized about tubes, so my answer is subject to validation, as we spoke about FETs here :
I think that what you've circled is nothing more than a "cascode"-type hi-gain stage (invented in the tube era), but again, it is not designed to give distorsion but hi-gain in order to drive the following stages, which will then deliver the distortion.
It is very difficult to obtain good distortion in a single stage preamp (tube or transistor). You can try to tweak the bias and the voltage, but you will usually obtain a bad fuzz tone, with an abrupt decay (you know what I mean, I guess). If you add diode clipper to that single stage, then you will have more coherent overdrive-sounding distortion (have a trial with the simple-to-die Electra distortion to get an idea), but it is not hi-gain highly distorted pattern as I heard it on your samples. Sorry, you need multi-stage design !
A+!
Quote from: tubelectron on August 22, 2010, 11:44:25 AM
Hi again deadastronaut,
Quotewould this give hi gain distortion ?..or would it be like the boogie a matter of doing all sections..!..
As you guessed it, I am more specialized about tubes, so my answer is subject to validation, as we spoke about FETs here :
I think that what you've circled is nothing more than a "cascode"-type hi-gain stage (invented in the tube era), but again, it is not designed to give distorsion but hi-gain in order to drive the following stages, which will then deliver the distortion.
It is very difficult to obtain good distortion in a single stage preamp (tube or transistor). You can try to tweak the bias and the voltage, but you will usually obtain a bad fuzz tone, with an abrupt decay (you know what I mean, I guess). If you add diode clipper to that single stage, then you will have more coherent overdrive-sounding distortion (have a trial with the simple-to-die Electra distortion to get an idea), but it is not hi-gain highly distorted pattern as I heard it on your samples. Sorry, you need multi-stage design !
A+!
cheers again bruno.
i have just been reading the runoffgroove fetzer article suggested by mike...great article...still got to get my head around some of the
terminology/maths etc ..but i can look that up in the faq's...getting more of an idea on how to go about it though!...valve versus fets etc..
i'll get this j201-386 bugger going if it kills me(and my cat!ha ha ).i know theres a serious kick ass sound to be had out of this combination..somehow...someday.... :icon_confused:
anyone dabbled with this idea?...rough schematics ...etc.... :)
edit: so roughly im looking at sticking a fetzer.(or 2).into a 386?..... :icon_idea: :icon_idea: :icon_idea:
Quoteedit: so roughly im looking at sticking a fetzer.(or 2).into a 386?..... icon_idea icon_idea icon_idea
Pretty much. There is a suggestion for replacing the buffer stage in the Ruby amp with a fetzer valve in their faq section I believe. But it doesn't have to be an exact fetzer, you can drop the miller cap, add the presence cap and play around with the drain trimpot until you get a good sound. It's a good way to get a starting point instead of throwing in some random values.
Quote from: Wild E on August 22, 2010, 12:41:07 PM
Quoteedit: so roughly im looking at sticking a fetzer.(or 2).into a 386?..... icon_idea icon_idea icon_idea
Pretty much. There is a suggestion for replacing the buffer stage in the Ruby amp with a fetzer valve in their faq section I believe. But it doesn't have to be an exact fetzer, you can drop the miller cap, add the presence cap and play around with the drain trimpot until you get a good sound. It's a good way to get a starting point instead of throwing in some random values.
yeah am going to try this...looks very much the same as the ruby, but hey i'll have a go....
its always strange looking at diagrams..with no idea of the sound they produce..!!!...
and yep...ill try and learn instead of the random value..'ready fire then aim' approach!...ha ha..cheers. :icon_mrgreen:
Rob,
Another thing to look at is the different schematics for amps you like. Look at the different values on each stage, and between stages. From what I have seen so far, almost all pre amp stages of amps have the same layout. just different values on the resistors, and caps. But within each manufacture, their amps all look the same.
Quote from: caspercody on August 22, 2010, 01:21:31 PM
Rob,
Another thing to look at is the different schematics for amps you like. Look at the different values on each stage, and between stages. From what I have seen so far, almost all pre amp stages of amps have the same layout. just different values on the resistors, and caps. But within each manufacture, their amps all look the same.
cool...cheers caspercody...i'll look around..for some kick ass amps.....
i just boarded the fetzer valve (slight overdrive crackle) then i put it into a 386 setup as before..got hi gain..but very soft and mushy...no bite to the note..or definition...
fuzz fans might like it... :icon_mrgreen: not my cup'o'tea..(very english ha ha) :icon_mrgreen:
the journey continues.......might try the lower gain fetzer version after too...
It's kind of funny. I started a thread because I was building a ruby and it has the fizzy decay just like you guys have mentioned. I have tried everything to get rid of it but it stays. I am building it on a breadboard and its given me enough promise to build a proper board and put it in an enclosure. I hope this fixes the decaying fizz since it sounds like not everybody gets this. I'll probably put a dip socket in so I can switch chips in and out to try to get the fizz to disappear.
Rob,
have you considered feeding higher voltage into the FET?
i.e. maybe +18V with a trimmer
I had a variant of the first third of Aron's Shaka express + LED clippers breadboarded, made things LOUD when around 13-15V, with distortion, but nothing fuzzy (unless you starve it). Might also have had a lot to do with the 4558 chip though
Edit: gonna try it this week when my 386's come in :)
The fizzle sound on a sustained note is from the 386. I have built many distortion pedals based on Jfets, Cmos, and op amps and the only ones that fizzled at the end of a sustained note was the 386 pedal.
oops, also happened on a Jfet build. but that was because I did not bias the Jfet.
i still tend to think of this fizz problem as being a consequence of trying to drive too low an impedence, like hooking an amp up to too low an ohm speaker...
i had fizz problems through lower 4 -ohm spkrs where it cleaned up with higher ohm speakers.. a ruby thst is, dedicated to drive a speaker, rather than a stompbox- to drive the input of an amp...
leads me to believe that without a decent load on the output of the whimsical 386 , you get fizz.
Quote from: davidallancole on August 22, 2010, 03:28:21 PM
It's kind of funny. I started a thread because I was building a ruby and it has the fizzy decay just like you guys have mentioned. I have tried everything to get rid of it but it stays. I am building it on a breadboard and its given me enough promise to build a proper board and put it in an enclosure. I hope this fixes the decaying fizz since it sounds like not everybody gets this. I'll probably put a dip socket in so I can switch chips in and out to try to get the fizz to disappear.
hi david. yep it seems like a very common problem...let us all know how you get on with the final project too....
rob.
Quote from: phector2004 on August 22, 2010, 03:40:05 PM
Rob,
have you considered feeding higher voltage into the FET?
i.e. maybe +18V with a trimmer
I had a variant of the first third of Aron's Shaka express + LED clippers breadboarded, made things LOUD when around 13-15V, with distortion, but nothing fuzzy (unless you starve it). Might also have had a lot to do with the 4558 chip though
Edit: gonna try it this week when my 386's come in :)
are you going to try the 386 / 1 / 3 ......?
hi phil. i am unable to try that as i only use a 9v psu..and 9v batteries...interesting idea though..i did notice a difference
in the distortion qualities when using a psu compared to the battery though!..like being starved etc...could be onto something there man!..
Quote from: caspercody on August 22, 2010, 06:43:33 PM
The fizzle sound on a sustained note is from the 386. I have built many distortion pedals based on Jfets, Cmos, and op amps and the only ones that fizzled at the end of a sustained note was the 386 pedal.
oops, also happened on a Jfet build. but that was because I did not bias the Jfet.
we have got to tame this 386 beast!.... :icon_twisted:
it would be interesting to hear from diyers that have built
daniel scwhartz's 'burning crunch' too 386-1 based too.
i think he actually went into production with that.(not sure though).going by the youtube video of it...but alas the demo doesnt
show a decaying note....unless he did get round it ......ive looked at his schematic too...anyone built it?..
Quote from: Quackzed on August 23, 2010, 03:11:37 AM
i still tend to think of this fizz problem as being a consequence of trying to drive too low an impedence, like hooking an amp up to too low an ohm speaker...
i had fizz problems through lower 4 -ohm spkrs where it cleaned up with higher ohm speakers.. a ruby thst is, dedicated to drive a speaker, rather than a stompbox- to drive the input of an amp...
leads me to believe that without a decent load on the output of the whimsical 386 , you get fizz.
hmmm..you may well be right on that!..it is after all an amp...unlike the normal dual opamps..072.4558 etc...
as for calling it 'whimsical' i can think of a more abusive name for it.. :icon_mrgreen:
edit:...found an interesting thread...especially the comments by PRR...on the 386/grace/big daddy.
http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=84410.0 (http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=84410.0)
hmmmmmm!.....in the datasheet the applictaions all have a 0.05uf and a 10 ohm on the output to ground!..also a 10k on the input.
hmmmmm again!....... :icon_mrgreen:..i dont have a 50nf...but i do have a 47nf..will have to try this too...
i think that may be the culprit... i hope it is anyway...
Hi guys,
You could try 0.1uF and 10 ohm in series to ground as well. PRR mentioned that in the thread you linked to deadastronaut. The capacitor is double what the data sheet says, but the HI-FI guys use 0.1uF and 10 ohms a lot.
Some other suggestions I found on headphone forums were to add a 2.2k resistor in series with the input as well as change the input from pin 3 to pin 2. Give those a try. I have but they didn't help me much. I still have to try the 0.1uF and 10 ohm. I have a 0.047uF and 10 ohm right now.
Hi all,
Enfer et Damnation - This LM386 is another great FF - not FuzzFace, nor FuzzFactory but... FizzFactory ! Or may be there is something missing again in the design ?
A+!
I am starting to thing there is nothing you change but possible the chip to get rid of the fizz. I changed my output to have the 10 ohm, 0.1 uF cap and that changed nothing. Changed inputs, that changed nothing. Added resistor in series with input, that changed nothing. Added 100uF cap to power supply, that changed nothing. Added bypass cap on pin 7, that changed nothing. Swore a ton, that did nothing. Drew pentagrams, killed chickens and prayed to the powers that be, that did nothing.
100uf on the power elmiminated all fizz from my smash drive (which I gotta say sounds pretty dang good)
I also have 100uF on +9 to gnd, longest decay but still "short", not like Rob's last video but good enough, could it be the position of the cap on the board ? (mine is still on breadboard)
Shall we all also start to state which LM386 we are using, makers,N ? I will tonight.
you can not compare Spaghetti cooked in Italy with the ones cooked in ... (put any land in the world you want!), they both are named spaghetti but the taste is completely different! (you know what I mean!)
my 100uf cap is directly soldered to the power jack in the pedal. The 386 is an LM386 N-3. I have an N-1 that I will swap and see what happens.
Edit: Just tried and did not hear a significant difference ( both did not fizz ). The N-1 might have been slightly noisier but that's it.
Quote from: arma61 on August 24, 2010, 06:03:37 AM
I also have 100uF on +9 to gnd, longest decay but still "short", not like Rob's last video but good enough, could it be the position of the cap on the board ? (mine is still on breadboard)
Shall we all also start to state which LM386 we are using, makers,N ? I will tonight.
you can not compare Spaghetti cooked in Italy with the ones cooked in ... (put any land in the world you want!), they both are named spaghetti but the taste is completely different! (you know what I mean!)
what is on your breadboard...the big daddies b*****d sister!...(the big daddy/smash drive hybrid). :icon_mrgreen:
i wouldnt have thought the placing of the cap would matter...by the way i used a 50v 100uf..not that i think that would matter
either..but just to let you know ok.....oh and yes.the spaghetti analogy..yep state which chip number too..and bolognese sauce :icon_mrgreen:
rob.
Quote from: blooze_man on August 24, 2010, 03:58:29 PM
my 100uf cap is directly soldered to the power jack in the pedal. The 386 is an LM386 N-3. I have an N-1 that I will swap and see what happens.
Edit: Just tried and did not hear a significant difference ( both did not fizz ). The N-1 might have been slightly noisier but that's it.
hi adrien. so it did fizz without the 100uf then?...good to hear you got a good result...
Quote from: davidallancole on August 23, 2010, 03:56:04 PM
I am starting to thing there is nothing you change but possible the chip to get rid of the fizz. I changed my output to have the 10 ohm, 0.1 uF cap and that changed nothing. Changed inputs, that changed nothing. Added resistor in series with input, that changed nothing. Added 100uF cap to power supply, that changed nothing. Added bypass cap on pin 7, that changed nothing. Swore a ton, that did nothing. Drew pentagrams, killed chickens and prayed to the powers that be, that did nothing.
so swearing a lot didnt help then?.. :icon_mrgreen:
but seriously, so it didnt change anything....shame... some projects seem to have got round it though!..
or maybe they havent, because we havent heard the proper decay on them.......!!!!!!!
Quote from: deadastronaut on August 24, 2010, 05:02:12 PM
hi adrien. so it did fizz without the 100uf then?...good to hear you got a good result...
Correct. I wish I had the parts to breadboard this pedal so I could be working with the same circuit as you, but sadly that's not possible at the moment.
right im going to go with the original circuit (page 1)..even with its design flaws just out of curiosity..and try the 100uf cap with it tonight..its 10:30pm here...
so i'll be having a late one..and maybe a beer or 2..will post the results later or tomorrow ok guys....
Quote from: deadastronaut on August 24, 2010, 05:00:42 PM
what is on your breadboard...the big daddies b*****d sister!...(the big daddy/smash drive hybrid). :icon_mrgreen:
yes it's the big daddies b.... on the breadboard with a JC8RA LM386N-1 I still have to test an UTC WMAD LM386L and a JR56RQ LM38N-1
will report later on about these last 2 ICs
Quote from: deadastronaut on August 24, 2010, 05:00:42 PM
i wouldnt have thought the placing of the cap would matter...by the way i used a 50v 100uf..not that i think that would matter
either..but just to let you know ok.....oh and yes.the spaghetti analogy..yep state which chip number too..and bolognese sauce :icon_mrgreen:
rob.
BEWARE NOOB THINKING AHEAD ;D ;D
I was thinking about this
when the guitar signal decays the IC is still trying to amplify it so it try to "suck " more power and that power may come from the volts stored in the cap ?! (really I don't know what I'm talking about !)
(really I don't know what I'm talking about !)
ha ha that makes 2 of us then! :icon_mrgreen:....nor do i ha ha ....i tried different value caps on the power...but the 100uf seemed the best
behaved....
cant wait to hear your results with the different ic's...
Quote from: deadastronaut on August 24, 2010, 05:58:42 PM
cant wait to hear your results with the different ic's...
sorry m8 you'll have to wait, I 'm going to bed now, it 00:02 here
I've got National N1's.
Quote from: arma61 on August 24, 2010, 05:53:30 PM
yes it's the big daddies b.... on the breadboard with a JC8RA LM386N-1 I still have to test an UTC WMAD LM386L and a JR56RQ LM38N-1
will report later on about these last 2 ICs
Hi all
so.... I just did a couple of tests (sorry I'm not set up atm for recording yet),
....hmm none of them did the trick! I'm almost convinced, as I red somewere here, that "N-3" should be the one, I've found a shop here in Italy that sells them (€0.88) and even an "N-4" (€0.67), but it'll take a month before I 'll put together an order worth a trip to them.
Ciao
Armando
So, what's the trick with this: http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=65308.msg517338#msg517338 ??
??? ???
that's what I was talking 'bout !
Quote from: Slade on August 25, 2010, 05:32:55 PM
So, what's the trick with this: http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=65308.msg517338#msg517338 ??
??? ???
hi slade the problem is that nobody ever records the decay of a note..(which is prone to fizz/rumble/short decay etc)...
which is where the problem lies...
the 386 distortion is easy to accomplish....but not so easy to perfect!...whether its a n1 or n3 or n4....
Quote from: arma61 on August 25, 2010, 04:45:28 PM
Quote from: arma61 on August 24, 2010, 05:53:30 PM
yes it's the big daddies b.... on the breadboard with a JC8RA LM386N-1 I still have to test an UTC WMAD LM386L and a JR56RQ LM38N-1
will report later on about these last 2 ICs
Hi all
so.... I just did a couple of tests (sorry I'm not set up atm for recording yet),
....hmm none of them did the trick! I'm almost convinced, as I red somewere here, that "N-3" should be the one, I've found a shop here in Italy that sells them (€0.88) and even an "N-4" (€0.67), but it'll take a month before I 'll put together an order worth a trip to them.
Ciao
Armando
hi guys...so no difference on the 386's then... :icon_rolleyes:
anyway been tinkering again....
ive redone the original schematic with 2 j201's..sounds good..just need to sort out where to put the gain control....
i thiink im going to put it straight after the 1st or 2nd fet..will try both...have also gone for the
pin 2 on the 386and it cleans up better too....still experimenting..
.so i may remove the gain pot from the 386 altogether and stick a
100r and a 47uf to ground from pins 1 and 8 instead.....and use the gain of the fets..(which i think someone suggested)..
am going on holiday for a week or so.....so will be unable to finish it soon..but it will give me time to step back and think ...!(logically).
the way it is on this schematic sounds good..just no real control over the gain..but when the gain is turned right down its a nice straight rock
sound.
.with no issues at all...... its sounding promising so far!..heres the scheme
without the gain pot mods i was talking about!.if any of you have got it on ya board, have a play and see what you think!.....!!!!!!! :icon_rolleyes:
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/j201386aug26th.jpg)
have fun guys...see ya soon........... :icon_mrgreen:
Has anyone tried this with a JRC386? I've heard they're more stable than the LM.
I have heard the same thing. It seems like you can never buy the two from the same place, except Small Bear!
back in town again!....had a good break from it all!... :icon_cool:
anyone messed with this yet?...ive still got it on bread board..
jrc386's..hmmmm..will have a look around the uk!... ;)
The sound clips of your circuit sound unbelievable.
In my experience with the 386 it has a tendency to be too bright. If that's what your looking for I wouldn't change a thing
as I said, the circuit sounds great!
If you want to warm the tone, have you considered inserting an alembic stratoblaster into your circuit in place of a J201?
To my ear, the stratoblaster responds well to pick attack and sweetens the tone.
Sorry if this is coming along a little too late, but the circuits are so similar, it seems a shame not
to try it while it's still breadboarded. Just a thought.
Quote from: will queue for free stuff on September 06, 2010, 01:47:09 PM
The sound clips of your circuit sound unbelievable.
In my experience with the 386 it has a tendency to be too bright. If that's what your looking for I wouldn't change a thing
as I said, the circuit sounds great!
If you want to warm the tone, have you considered inserting an alembic stratoblaster into your circuit in place of a J201?
To my ear, the stratoblaster responds well to pick attack and sweetens the tone.
Sorry if this is coming along a little too late, but the circuits are so similar, it seems a shame not
to try it while it's still breadboarded. Just a thought.
cheers craig, all suggestions are welcome...have u a schematic for it...?..
and would it be replacing both j201's...or just 1...sorry not familiar with that circuit..
i do like the bright sound. it tends to fatten up through a proper amp etc...but hey i'll try all sorts while its breaded ..
im not a fender strat player..more of a humbucker dude....ibanez /les paul....rob.
I'm just working on drawing the idea up in Eagle.
The perfboard layout is here:
www.aronnelson.com/.../ALEMBIC_STRATOBLASTER_PERFBOARD_001.gif.html -
The schematic is at General Guitar Gadgets.
You can find a soundclip of the pedal alone here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h5xu34mrIFg
Thanks for considering the idea
Good luck!
Quote from: will queue for free stuff on September 06, 2010, 02:30:27 PM
I'm just working on drawing the idea up in Eagle.
The perfboard layout is here:
www.aronnelson.com/.../ALEMBIC_STRATOBLASTER_PERFBOARD_001.gif.html -
The schematic is at General Guitar Gadgets.
You can find a soundclip of the pedal alone here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h5xu34mrIFg
Thanks for considering the idea
Good luck!
cool, i'll take a look. cheers . rob.
edit:. top link broken...will search ok..
yeah thats a cool booster...youtube..
edit: ahhh just found it as a schematic..and a vero!...
so im guessing this would go after the first j201-into the alembic then the 386?...yes?
Sorry about the link.
I was trying to direct you to another UK builder since he's already attacked the problem of
parts available to you in the UK.
You'll notice he's used the 100uF cap to filter power also. A nice fit.
http://www.aronnelson.com/gallery/main.php/v/album174/ALEMBIC+STRATOBLASTER+2N3819.gif.html
cheers craig, thats a tidy little circuit!..very neat...
i found a j201 version too..
http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://www.aronnelson.com/gallery/main.php%3Fg2_view%3Dcore.DownloadItem%26g2_itemId%3D11258%26g2_serialNumber%3D2&imgrefurl=http://www.aronnelson.com/gallery/v/DRAGONFLY-LAYOUTS_0/album14/album150/ALEMBIC_STRATOBLASTER_PERFBOARD_001.gif.html&usg=__pSoX_L_J7_Bn-pVa1H56ltPWdws=&h=343&w=415&sz=11&hl=en&start=1&zoom=1&um=1&itbs=1&tbnid=n1odGQix145cfM:&tbnh=103&tbnw=125&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dalembic%2Bstratoblaster%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dopera%26sa%3DN%26rls%3Den%26tbs%3Disch:1
i dont have those value transistors.!. what a link ! :icon_mrgreen:
One last thing I forgot to pass along.......
Try removing your 10uF cap from the 1 to 8 jumper you have for gain
(keep the pot of course) and insert it in place the 100nF cap.
If you have a larger value cap, another 100uF perhaps, try it.
I've found this really helps to clean up the decay.
In response to your question re where the stratoblaster might be inserted,
I was drawing it up in the primary position.
At the very least, I hope the stratoblaster circuit gave you some ideas about boost
options with your circuit (with a dual gang pot?)
See ya!
yeah cheers..its always helpul to see other designs, especially for general gain stuff.....i will give it a go..
before i do though, its funny i just did that pot thing with pin 1 -8 ...took out the 10uf...!
heres a clip of what ive got so far..you hear the gain go right up halfway through ok...it cleans up nice too...
i'll try the other ideas as well, thanks again man .rob.
heres the latest clip!..
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/latest1.mp3 (http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/latest1.mp3)
heres the schematic for the clip!..the gain does get hissy though on full gain ok...needs sorting!...but will try craigs ideas too!..and post results!..
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/3rdsept1.jpg)
If I could play like that......
Nice.
Wouldn't change a thing.
Quote from: will queue for free stuff on September 06, 2010, 04:05:01 PM
If I could play like that......
Nice.
Wouldn't change a thing.
cheers man, yeah i like it...gets a bit too hissy on max gain though!...gotta sort that out!...
oh yeah i see what you mean with the dual gang pot too!...cool.
Rob,
I had an idea for you.....
but I'm not sure it'll work.
I guess thinking about dual gang pots and putting it together
with your comment about the circuit getting hissy at high gain
lead me to the idea of a dual gang pot here too.... channeling the output of the 386 through the second tier of the pot
and using the pot as a variable resistor as part of a low pass filter.
IF, and I say IF, my math is right, by placing a 15nF cap to ground, as the resistance
increases to 1K the frequency attenuated should be about 10kHz. When the gain is set low, frequency attenuation should be
well above 50kHz leaving your signal unchanged.
So lug 1 would be signal in, lug 2 would be signal out, and lug 3 would be to 15nF and then to ground.
Of course this needs to jibe with your wiring for the gain on the LM 386.
Hopefully someone will jump in and tell me how wrong I am before you waste money on a dual gang 1K pot. :icon_wink:
Good Luck.
i have a couple of 100k dual pots i pulled from an old amp...!!!
revision: on the schematic above/page 8 i stuck a 1M on the output into the 100k pot..to tame the level....no wonder it hissed like f***... :icon_mrgreen:
@ armando!
so you built the big bastard (big daddies bastard sister ha ha) then? hows it sound to you?...is there any fizz..there shouldnt be, as all is fine with mine!..soundclip please!..
havent boxed mine yet..but will for sure!... :icon_twisted: :icon_twisted: :icon_twisted:
You should consider doing a 'final revision'/build report thread.
mention some of the problems and how you arrived at the final schematic, 386 notes etc...
just to sort of 'edit' this thread and have a concise build report with soundclips.
Quote from: Quackzed on September 09, 2010, 01:15:23 PM
You should consider doing a 'final revision'/build report thread.
mention some of the problems and how you arrived at the final schematic, 386 notes etc...
just to sort of 'edit' this thread and have a concise build report with soundclips.
+1!
I'll be waiting for it :)
Quote from: Quackzed on September 09, 2010, 01:15:23 PM
You should consider doing a 'final revision'/build report thread.
mention some of the problems and how you arrived at the final schematic, 386 notes etc...
just to sort of 'edit' this thread and have a concise build report with soundclips.
yeah good idea!..a condensed version.....will do soon!. :icon_cool:
am boxing the big bastard this weekend for a friend who loves it!..... :icon_cool:..
Hello together,
I have read this thread today and I am really surprised
about this simple circuit sounding really awesome (I listened to the clips)!!!
I'm a friend of "roaring heavy distortion with cutting-edges" 8)
I can read and write english but as I am german I surely didn't understand everything,
but I think I could understand 95%, so I finaly have two questions:
Is the latest shown schematic in this thread the advanced (and best sounding) version?
I have to do a perfboard version of this for sure :)
Greetings and regards from Germany
Magnus
Quote from: Magnus on September 11, 2010, 08:35:40 AM
Hello together,
I have read this thread today and I am really surprised
about this simple circuit sounding really awesome (I listened to the clips)!!!
I'm a friend of "roaring heavy distortion with cutting-edges" 8)
I can read and write english but as I am german I surely didn't understand everything,
but I think I could understand 95%, so I finaly have two questions:
Is the latest shown schematic in this thread the advanced (and best sounding) version?
I have to do a perfboard version of this for sure :)
Greetings and regards from Germany
Magnus
hi magnus. the schematic and vero on page 3 of this thread are verified.!..(big daddies b****d sister)
the most recent schematic is working fine, but needs a few adjustments ok....will be updated soon.
and yes im a fan of bite in my distortion, rather than overdrives too... :icon_mrgreen:
Hello,
I thought that the Big Daddy ***** was an other project
differently from your own built version - correct me if I am wrong...
Or is your circuit a mix of the Smash-Drive/Big Daddy and so got a new name (bastardized one)?
btw:
If the project will be finished in future I can make a nice perfboard-layout
and a separate etching-template for it so that everyone with some skills can build it,
I have experience making layouts and pcb's so I will do it gladly for you!
Greetings
Magnus
Quote from: Magnus on September 11, 2010, 08:44:53 AM
Hello,
I thought that the Big Daddy ***** was an other project
differently from your own built version - correct me if I am wrong...
Or is your circuit a mix of the Smash-Drive/Big Daddy and so got a mixed name?
btw:
If the project will be finished in future I can make a nice perfboard-layout
and a separate etching-template for it so that everyone with some skills can build it,
I have experience making layouts and pcb's so I will do it gladly for you!
Greetings
Magnus
hi. yep that is a higher gain hybrid of both the smash/and big daddy in my opinion...and works fine too...checkout the youtube video demo!.
http://www.youtube.com/user/100roberthenry#p/u/6/W_5SZVyUP-Y (http://www.youtube.com/user/100roberthenry#p/u/6/W_5SZVyUP-Y)
i havent ever done perf looks a bit too fiddly for me...but i do a fair bit of vero...andt i do etch pcb's...that would be great if you could do a nice pcb layout too...cool.
when the most recent project is finalised of course!...thanks.
as always i suggest breadboarding it and seeing if you like the sound first!..rob.
:icon_eek:
Probably gonna try this out and play around with it this week now that I've got some 386's (N1s, (unfortunately?))
But I'm short on a lot of parts, cause I love to buy things before making sure I didn't forget anything...
Don't have any free pots right now, and I've borrowed jacks from another build to breadboard with. I see a 1k on the 386, wired as a variable resistor, but I don't even have a 1k trimmer. :icon_evil: Which would give me full gain in its place, 0R or a 1k?
Quote from: phector2004 on September 12, 2010, 06:13:27 PM
Probably gonna try this out and play around with it this week now that I've got some 386's (N1s, (unfortunately?))
But I'm short on a lot of parts, cause I love to buy things before making sure I didn't forget anything...
Don't have any free pots right now, and I've borrowed jacks from another build to breadboard with. I see a 1k on the 386, wired as a variable resistor, but I don't even have a 1k trimmer. :icon_evil: Which would give me full gain in its place, 0R or a 1k?
hi phil. you'll get away with a 5k..it just wont have the sweep, but i think most values will give you the full gain, it will just be on of off
without the full range sweep ok..but will work ok...to hear it..
the 386n1 will be ok, ive used that in my one...(tried the n3, no real difference)...
are you doing the big bastard?....i re-breadboarded the big bastard last night out of curiosity...heres a few changes i tried and are fine.
swap the 4.7M for a 1M,/
25trim can be a 50k/ more tweakable....
leave off the 10r and 47uf off the 1k pot (the 1k pot is fine on its own)
add a 1M after the 100nf on the output..this lowers the overall output and gives better control over the volume...
and use input 2 on the 386....
rob.
:icon_eek:
Got this thing running, sounds amazing! Tried your suggestions but subbed in an SK117, and it's fizzing and crackling below a certain sound threshold... at higher amp gains, it turns my amp into an insect zapper sizzle simulator ;D
I'll try it out with a J201 and see if the fizz goes away. I remember your original dual JFET design did the same thing, so I'm guessing its that.
Also, what do you mean with:
Quote from: deadastronaut on September 13, 2010, 05:07:08 AM
and use input 2 on the 386....
I'm an opamp noob, so I'm guessing you mean I should plug the inverting input somewhere other than ground?? Gotta figure this stuff out sometime...
It's REALLY high gain, though... and loud as an obnoxious bastard sister. Love it!
EDIT: Works well as a headphone amp too. Not too loud, but maybe a 2nd IC for the 2nd channel will do
Quote from: phector2004 on September 13, 2010, 11:04:10 AM
:icon_eek:
Got this thing running, sounds amazing! Tried your suggestions but subbed in an SK117, and it's fizzing and crackling below a certain sound threshold... at higher amp gains, it turns my amp into an insect zapper sizzle simulator ;D
I'll try it out with a J201 and see if the fizz goes away. I remember your original dual JFET design did the same thing, so I'm guessing its that.
Also, what do you mean with:
Quote from: deadastronaut on September 13, 2010, 05:07:08 AM
and use input 2 on the 386....
I'm an opamp noob, so I'm guessing you mean I should plug the inverting input somewhere other than ground?? Gotta figure this stuff out sometime...
It's REALLY high gain, though... and loud as an obnoxious bastard sister. Love it!
EDIT: Works well as a headphone amp too. Not too loud, but maybe a 2nd IC for the 2nd channel will do
hi phil. glad you like/tried it..yeah i love it through my marshall clean channel...nice and mean.
as for the 386 , i meant pin 2 or pin 3..but
ground which one you are not using...ive tried both..theres not any difference really
that i can hear..may be on an oscilloscope..but i wouldnt know what to do with one ha ha... :icon_rolleyes:
anyway today i built a brilliant 'capacitor substitution box'
i tried it on various parts of the big bastard circuit..but i found the input works a treat for bright or fat sounds..
when set to 470nf it gets fat n fuzzy...when set to 1 or 2.2nf it is as is..normal distortion..great little box..
(I just built it to quickly hear the difference in cap values instantly...)..
as for it being an amp..yep!!...very loud if you take the 1M off the output.. i put that there to tame the volume to be
normal..when on the 100k pot..
please post a clip phil....would like to hear your version..!...
rob.
Been playing around swapping FETs, unfortunately I don't have a mic and my attempt to record direct didn't work... the level was barely audible (even without 1M resistor!). Here's what I noticed, though
There's a noticeable difference switching between J201 and SK117. my FET seems a bit 'tamer' whereas the J201 is 'harsher'. J201 also gives more pronounced harmonics... I wasn't even CLOSE to where the node point was, maybe 3-4 frets away, and the note still rang off, loud and clear. The SK117 still sounds a bit 'beefier', IMO. I can go on and on trying to explain the differences with 'single-quotated' vague, general 'terms', but 'somebody' here is probably gonna 'smack me silly' ;D
Gotta play around with it tomorrow though as I've been reducing the crackling noise at the expense of JFET gain by meticulously lowering and fine-tuning my 100k drain trimpot. I'll try this again with a J201 to see if I can kill the noise, but the different pinout is a royal pain.
As well as being a total IC noob, I really need to read up some more on jfets (hint: I may say something stupid now), but the FET stops conducting before the volume is low enough for the sudden cut not to be noticeable. I'd like to see if J201s need a smaller signal to stay open. (Would this be due to different Vp values? What other terms are used for this, that I can look for on data sheets?)
If I find time later this week, I'll try tossing in a 2nd JFET too, as you had originally intended
Great sound Rob +1
@ bryan. cheers man..yeah its a cool sound hi or low..(volume on guitar backed off)nice and bluesy too... 8)
@ phil.
i have no idea of the fet your using!..sounds like your on to a good experimental stage though!...
shame about the clip, would've liked to have heard it!... :icon_neutral:
yep..try the double fet idea...i have it on oe of my breadboards all the time...to tinker with.
and now i have a spare board again too...waheyyy...
i re-drew the vero for the big bastard with the revised list..much smaller and more concise.
here it is. the finalised bastard vero. sounds cool. and less parts too...
just to let all you guys following (or understandably ignoring :icon_rolleyes:) this thread, i tried the lm386n-1/-3/and even the -4...no difference and all behaved well :icon_biggrin:
with no fizz at all....job done on this side project...
now back to the 2 fet again!.(once ive built 2 of these for friends. they are well happy
with the sound through their amps!..tried and tested. :icon_cool: :icon_cool: :icon_cool:
very very very verified... :icon_mrgreen: :icon_mrgreen: :icon_mrgreen:
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/BIGBASTARD14SEPT2010.gif)
I've had my eyes on this project for a while and waiting for that final version! Finally!
Since I like to do PCBs I made one (just ripped your vero) and I thought I would post it so here goes!
(http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc514/Keeb2/bigbd.gif)
(http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc514/Keeb2/bigbdPCB.gif)
I, too, have been watching this thread with interest, and waiting for the PCB layout! :)
Thanks Keeb and everyone else. I'll let you know how i go!
Paul
nice one keeb!......now lets play the bastard... :icon_twisted: :icon_twisted: :icon_twisted:
rob.
hi, this is my version of the B...d (ExpessPCB and ExpressSCH for those who want to "play" with it)
(it's related to page2 schem)
.SCH file (http://www.aronnelson.com/gallery/main.php/v/diyuser/Arma61/Dreadnought_sch.html)
.PCB file (http://www.aronnelson.com/gallery/main.php/v/diyuser/Arma61/Dreadnought__1__pcb.html)
Ciao
Tone stacks?
great sounding pedal but im looking for suggestions in tone stacks. Maybe a three band Marshall tone stack or something similar. Any suggestions out there?
Baxandall tonestack.
Sort of late, but have you seen these? Check out the Rambler, Smokey Amp and Stupidty Box. Great site.
http://web.archive.org/web/20050119104631/www.geocities.com/tpe123/folkurban/fuzz/snippets.html
Has anyone tried the JRC version? Tim seems to think that is the way to go. Radio Shack used to have them. :icon_cool:
Quote from: Scruffie on September 15, 2010, 02:29:48 PM
Quote from: caspercody on September 15, 2010, 02:29:10 PM
Baxandall tonestack.
Seconded.
good to see more dudes onboard with this..
@ scruffie . would the baxandall tonestack give a good classic scoop to it!..? ???
Quote from: deadastronaut on September 16, 2010, 07:19:42 AM
Quote from: Scruffie on September 15, 2010, 02:29:48 PM
Quote from: caspercody on September 15, 2010, 02:29:10 PM
Baxandall tonestack.
Seconded.
good to see more dudes onboard with this..
@ scruffie . would the baxandall tonestack give a good classic scoop to it!..? ???
Yes and the nice thing is, with the right values you can have it give you a scoop at some settings but with both knobs at say 8/9 o'clock, flat mids... I might have the values for such a tone-stack, i'll have a look, or you can play about in Duncans yourself.
Quote from: Scruffie on September 16, 2010, 07:24:33 AM
Quote from: deadastronaut on September 16, 2010, 07:19:42 AM
Quote from: Scruffie on September 15, 2010, 02:29:48 PM
Quote from: caspercody on September 15, 2010, 02:29:10 PM
Baxandall tonestack.
Seconded.
good to see more dudes onboard with this..
@ scruffie . would the baxandall tonestack give a good classic scoop to it!..? ???
Yes and the nice thing is, with the right values you can have it give you a scoop at some settings but with both knobs at say 8/9 o'clock, flat mids... I might have the values for such a tone-stack, i'll have a look, or you can play about in Duncans yourself.
sounds cool....can you post it up here..so we can all play about with it..cheers man. rob. :icon_cool:
edit: just had a look around...baxandall..bass and treble only? no mid?.. ???
@ armando...
so you went with the 'dreadnought ' then...less offensive eh?...ha ha..cool. :icon_mrgreen:
Quote from: deadastronaut on September 16, 2010, 07:28:38 AM
Quote from: Scruffie on September 16, 2010, 07:24:33 AM
Quote from: deadastronaut on September 16, 2010, 07:19:42 AM
Quote from: Scruffie on September 15, 2010, 02:29:48 PM
Quote from: caspercody on September 15, 2010, 02:29:10 PM
Baxandall tonestack.
Seconded.
good to see more dudes onboard with this..
@ scruffie . would the baxandall tonestack give a good classic scoop to it!..? ???
Yes and the nice thing is, with the right values you can have it give you a scoop at some settings but with both knobs at say 8/9 o'clock, flat mids... I might have the values for such a tone-stack, i'll have a look, or you can play about in Duncans yourself.
sounds cool....can you post it up here..so we can all play about with it..cheers man. rob. :icon_cool:
edit: just had a look around...baxandall..bass and treble only? no mid?.. ???
Yeah that's what a Baxandall is, the two have an effect on the mids though depending on setting and unlike the Big Muff Tone control don't suffer the annoying See-Saw Effect of Treble means no Bass and Bass means no Treble. It's nice because it's simple and has a good amount of control for 2 knobs, if you wanted you could add in a switch to scoop or flatten the mids too.
got ya!...there is no 'baxandall' in the tsc though!...or am i missing something?.
would be nice to actually hear the baxandall on it, if anyone does it!...
i have a small breadboard with a bass/mid/treb tonestack on it for such experimental purposes...i'll mess around and see what happens.
NB: the initial idea was to have a 'simple' distortion without the trimmings of a tonestack, just to get the distortion 'right' first....
but now that is done it would be nice to have more control i agree...'the super b''''''d..(dreadnought).ha ha... :icon_mrgreen:
i'm guessing the output 1M on the distortion would have to be removed though, to lift the tonestack...otherwise output would be to quiet yes?... ???
Quote from: deadastronaut on September 16, 2010, 08:36:13 AM
got ya!...there is no 'baxandall' in the tsc though!...or am i missing something?.
It's labelled 'James'.
Quote from: Scruffie on September 16, 2010, 08:37:24 AM
Quote from: deadastronaut on September 16, 2010, 08:36:13 AM
got ya!...there is no 'baxandall' in the tsc though!...or am i missing something?.
It's labelled 'James',
got ya!.. :icon_redface: :icon_redface: :icon_redface:
....if all we are looking is " that kind of sound with that mid scoop and that quantity of treble and bass" it shouldn't be hard to have a "fix" tonestack, I mean ( and here you live-player can correct me) you are not going to change tone setting every song or two on stage, isn't it ?
....so once you've got on a breadbord the tone you like (combined with your axe and your amp) just stick the right value of res and caps and you'll have your 2 knobs distortion with the tone "you were looking for", though I don't know (yet!) how to build a tonestack with fixed component, but that should not be that hard.... ok if it's build for friend/selling that's another story....
Dreadnought...... yeah I like the "name" and I like also how it sound when pronounced by you English native speaker! :D
hi armando.
yeah the distortion sounds great on the amp anyway..using the amps eq..i agree!.
nice to have a little control at your feet too..when i was messing with it originally i messed with changing caps to best suit my
axe and amp...other setups may need a bit of eq tweaking...according to their axe/amp though!.
'dreadnought' the battleship. pronounced in english...dered -nawt... :icon_mrgreen:
other useful english phrases.:as pronounced:
cuppa tee= cup of tea
bluddy el=bloody hell
get ahht the fahhhkin moata= could you please exit the vehicle :icon_mrgreen:
heres the built vero..tiny eh!.. (my cat decided to tap it onto the floor after i sprayed it.
thats why its a rough finish.... :icon_rolleyes:
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/P160910_16.26.jpg)
Are you going to put the tonestack at the end, or between the Jfets and 386? :icon_twisted:
IIRC someone rescaled a tonestack to work at the end of the 386 because of it's low output impedance maybe. :icon_cool:
Quote from: WGTP on September 16, 2010, 03:05:26 PM
Are you going to put the tonestack at the end, or between the Jfets and 386? :icon_twisted:
IIRC someone rescaled a tonestack to work at the end of the 386 because of it's low output impedance maybe. :icon_cool:
hi. at the end of the circuit!....on this vero...
do you mean this?
http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=83372.0 (http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=83372.0)
Looks like you have already done a vero for one. For simplicity, I'd recomment the BMP stack. :icon_cool:
http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=65308.0
http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=71680.0
That one looks scaled by a factor of 10. The other one uses a factor of 15 IIRC.
cheers wgtp.
yep i also built the bi muff tones stack...didnt really get on with that.cheers though man.
some guys suggested the baxandall..havent tried it yet..
im after a good mid scooped control, and not to trebly...been looking at the tsc , i also noticed daniel schwartz said
what he sees on the screen with the tsc doesnt sound like it in reality...so i think its going to be a bit of trial and error on various
types of stack, with modifications to suit my ears...any other suggestions welcome though!.. :icon_mrgreen:
cheers rob.
The carvin Legacy uses a Baxandall tonestack, with a added mid control. There is a Jfet version of this amp I think on this site called the Leegazzy by Antonio Pelaez that has this tonestack. It is a great tonestack.
Quote from: caspercody on September 16, 2010, 06:19:02 PM
The carvin Legacy uses a Baxandall tonestack, with a added mid control. There is a Jfet version of this amp I think on this site called the Leegazzy by Antonio Pelaez that has this tonestack. It is a great tonestack.
thanks. i'll take a look..
disclaimer:
warning no blues or fuzz players should listen!(you have been warned!)
or if your ears are easily offended....ha ha...
hi guys...its grunge day today. because i said so.. :icon_mrgreen:
heres a sneak preview of a droptuned C# f****n mean sound...( THE MALEVOLENT DISTORTION)
Definition of MALEVOLENT...
1
: having, showing, or arising from intense often vicious ill will, spite, or hatred
2
: productive of harm or evil
not me by the way...the pedal.. :icon_mrgreen:
the recording doesn't do it proper justice..bear in mind this is straight into a mixer..no amp....
so through an amp it should be monstrous....
and yes its still a 386n-1..and still a simple 2 knob project too... :icon_rolleyes: still messing around with it ok...
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/grungeo1.mp3 (http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/grungeo1.mp3)
Quotedisclaimer:
warning no blues or fuzz players should listen!(you have been warned!)
or if your ears are easily offended....ha ha...
hi guys...its grunge day today. because i said so.. icon_mrgreen
That, my friend, is one MEAN pedal you have made yourself. That is the sound of the schemo on pg 2? If so, I am throwing this on the board this weekend with the baxandall.
Quote from: jcgss77 on September 24, 2010, 08:33:51 PM
Quotedisclaimer:
warning no blues or fuzz players should listen!(you have been warned!)
or if your ears are easily offended....ha ha...
hi guys...its grunge day today. because i said so.. icon_mrgreen
That, my friend, is one MEAN pedal you have made yourself. That is the sound of the schemo on pg 2? If so, I am throwing this on the board this weekend with the baxandall.
hi j.
yeah its pretty much the same as the schemo...i just adjusted a few bits for lower tunings..could be made switchable too...
if you do it with baxandall i would love to hear it...also if you have/or create a vero of the baxandall that would be handy too...
so i can make a seperate tonestack to add to various projects and try out!....cheers rob.
Here's a link to various tone stacks....
Baxandall, or is it Baxandahl, is about two thirds down the page.
Good notes.
Craig.
http://amps.zugster.net/articles/tone-stacks
cheers craig..nice link ........excellent in fact!!!.... :icon_mrgreen:
is it me or are the pots wired/numbered backwards?...
shouldnt the 3 lug be the input on these??.. ???
hi guys ,
just looked at the tsc version of 'james'..(baxandall)..doesnt seem to scoop much though!!!!...to look at...havent tried it yet!.. ;)
when i look at my 7 band graphic pedal with the scoopy settings i like (for chunky metal, grunge, thrash riffs) they are as follows...:
100/0 200/-5 400/-10 800/-15 1.6k/-10 3.2k/-5 6.4k/0.....roughly..
so i guess my question is...how do i get this sort of graphic tonestack setting but with (2 or 3 ) knobs at 12 oclock already so i get full tweakability
of a good scoopy sound.. a full on scoopy eq if you like!. without maxing out all the pots to achieve it...
ive messed about with values in the tsc but cant seem to get it!!!...even with the marshall BMT...
armando hinted on this earlier as a set eq...which got me thinking!!!!... ::)
edit: just been doing a vero of the carvin/leegazzy eq(suggested by caspercody)...BMTVP...phew!..that was a brainache!..
@caspercody , where does the pin 1 on the mid pot go..ground?.
No connection to pin 1 on the Mid control.
cheers man...
done a vero of it...bit messy i know..what dya think?.
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/carvintonestack1.gif)
Quote from: deadastronaut on September 25, 2010, 08:15:15 PM
just looked at the tsc version of 'james'..(baxandall)..doesnt seem to scoop much though!!!!...to look at...havent tried it yet!.. ;)
Remember my Scruffiestortion? Look at the Baxandall on that, it can do scooped mids with both knobs up and flat with both down.
Quote from: Scruffie on September 25, 2010, 10:08:01 PM
Quote from: deadastronaut on September 25, 2010, 08:15:15 PM
just looked at the tsc version of 'james'..(baxandall)..doesnt seem to scoop much though!!!!...to look at...havent tried it yet!.. ;)
Remember my Scruffiestortion? Look at the Baxandall on that, it can do scooped mids with both knobs up and flat with both down.
yep i remember it...i still have the schematic...i'll take a look man...cheers.
i did a vero of the baxandall too...different values to your though!..
what dya think?..
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/baxandall.gif)
That looks good! I used one cap for the C5, C^, and C7 combo. I think it was 11nf. I didn't do the presence part of this tonestack, so curious to hear your version??
Quote from: caspercody on September 25, 2010, 10:13:07 PM
That looks good! I used one cap for the C5, C^, and C7 combo. I think it was 11nf. I didn't do the presence part of this tonestack, so curious to hear your version??
yeah i thought the c5-7 bit was weird!...
im curious to see how it sounds too...
has anyone built the leegazzy...?..is it very hi gain ?....just curious to hear it!..
Threw this on the breadboard the other day and started messing with parts. Here's what I've got:
(http://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af105/phil2004/higain.jpg)
I popped in a 2N5089 before the IC, and tried it without the FET. It sounded very "constricted" and not metal enough so I opted for a lower gain 2N2222 and put the fet back in. Swapped J201 with 2SK117 after, giving it a bit less gain and softer highs, also lowering the voltage a bit to taste. Tried recording again, but I think I need to invest in a new soundcard or a box of some sort.
My plan is to add a tone control between the FET and the BJT, maybe the baxandall, but I need my shipment of pots first. Until then, I have to learn about filters. Also picks up a Crapton of radio/computer noises...
Overall a very fun project to work on, though. I'm learning loads more adding stuff to this than by trying to dissect more complex circuits. Thanks!
P.S. is it ok to post modified schematics, or should I be writing/doing something before posting?
Quote from: phector2004 on September 26, 2010, 05:56:09 PM
Threw this on the breadboard the other day and started messing with parts. Here's what I've got:
I popped in a 2N5089 before the IC, and tried it without the FET. It sounded very "constricted" and not metal enough so I opted for a lower gain 2N2222 and put the fet back in. Swapped J201 with 2SK117 after, giving it a bit less gain and softer highs, also lowering the voltage a bit to taste. Tried recording again, but I think I need to invest in a new soundcard or a box of some sort.
My plan is to add a tone control between the FET and the BJT, maybe the baxandall, but I need my shipment of pots first. Until then, I have to learn about filters. Also picks up a Crapton of radio/computer noises...
Overall a very fun project to work on, though. I'm learning loads more adding stuff to this than by trying to dissect more complex circuits. Thanks!
P.S. is it ok to post modified schematics, or should I be writing/doing something before posting?
hi phil. great to see your experimenting example...fet and a bjt .interesting...
why a tonestack before the 386?..curious!...it has plenty of output to drive a stack at the end!..
ive seen some where the gain is controlled straight after the fet too rather than at the 386..just as a note..
im fairly sure that when this has a sheilded input, and boxed ,most or any noise should go...(i had a neighbours mobile phone p***ing me off yesterday :icon_rolleyes:)
as for the baxandall havent done it yet!..i have got loads of tonestacks to try..i'll board em try em, and if i like em i'll
put em in little boxes, to add as a module to projects..seems the way to go!..there are so many out there!..
yep im learning much more, now its in front of my face, im not a great studier of books ,i get distracted easily,mainly by postmen and my cat.
and friends turning up with beer etc..but i figure if i start at the bottom and get a greater understanding of a simple distortion (ic or fet)then it will
stand me/us all in good stead for future projects too...
just a note:
i built a
capacitor sub box,and now i have built a resistor sub box too..(with most common values).what a tool ha ha... :icon_rolleyes:
they are brilliant, instantly sub a part without having to go through my trays of bits and trying them..i highly recommend
building those ...saves so much time and its effortless.and instantly
'hear' the difference a cap/resistor makes....coz im lazy too.. :icon_mrgreen:
here they are:
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/P270910_10.45.jpg)
im enjoying this project immensly too..my girlfriend on the other hand maybe not so much :icon_mrgreen:
so post away!!!!!..no problem dude!... :icon_mrgreen:
heres a better pic of the sub boxes..
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/subboxes2.jpg)
love the sub boxes! gonna buy a few 1590As next time I order. More getting up to find stuff = more time taken to drink my beer = warmer beer :icon_lol:
I'm thinking of putting the tone stack before the 386 for a more traditional "amp" design, with the chip acting as a sort of power amp and the transistors as a preamp. Then again, it has way too much power to begin with so I'll try it out after the chip as well, see which one sounds better.
Quote from: phector2004 on September 27, 2010, 10:36:08 AM
love the sub boxes! gonna buy a few 1590As next time I order. More getting up to find stuff = more time taken to drink my beer = warmer beer :icon_lol:
I'm thinking of putting the tone stack before the 386 for a more traditional "amp" design, with the chip acting as a sort of power amp and the transistors as a preamp. Then again, it has way too much power to begin with so I'll try it out after the chip as well, see which one sounds better.
yeah warm beer ...urghhhh!..my sub boxes are plastic ones...!!! cheapo.. :icon_mrgreen:but very handy
just been messing with this again.with my amp...as an experiment i took out the 2,2uf...less gain but no radio noise..but less gain :icon_rolleyes:...just a thought!.edit:...i just put a 220nf in there.hi gain again..less noise tho...probably illegal but it works ha ha....
arghhhh i also need to build an electrolytic sub box now !.... :icon_rolleyes:
i also changed the output section to a 10nf into a 220k...attached a 10k volume..now it has a 12oclock level..
yeah i get the pre/amp idea....cool post ya results...
nb: i bought a usb soundcard for a mate a behringer uca202 usb, cheap as, and good too...check em out..about 25 quid in english :icon_mrgreen:
edit:
heres a quick sample of the experimental noise reducing...just for a laugh!..
first sample is wth the 2.2uf..and a 22k resistor going to ground...
second is with a 220nf and a 22k....quieter
and third is with no cap at all....22k...very quiet but gainless...
hear the difference in noise/hiss..?....
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/hisstest.mp3 (http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/hisstest.mp3)
interesting... I read your post before you added those...
Been playing with LPFs today. Threw a 220Ω in series between the FET and the 10n cap, with a 47n after it going to ground. The radio man shuts his pie hole, and it doesn't affect the sound too much (its blocking stuff broadly, starting at about 20kHz and peaking near the 100kHz range) but it's just not the same
I'm thinking of replacing the BJT with a FET again, but the dense green-wire afro growing on my breadboard might just mean another adding it in front :icon_twisted:
well at least we know how to make a radio or not now ha ha........
yeah i think the 2 fets is a good way to go...more experimenting i guess...
am getting sidetracked at the moment with a book ive just been reading about flashing leds and ldr's...tremolo's basically..
dont know why, but i cant resist a flashing led or 2....
also in this book it shows a 386 amp with 200 gain with a 0.1uf on pin 4 to ground, and a 0.5uf on the bypass pin 7...
and a 10r on the output going to ground....reckons to use them if it oscillates or whines by itself....just to throw that in.
but in the datasheet it has a 0.05uf and a 10r on the out going to ground...and an anonymous cap to pin 7..hmmmm...... :icon_rolleyes:
Hey Deadastronaut, I build it and it sounds, hm, incredible! ;D
Not so much compression, more like an amp.
But with EMG pickups it sags down on the "hit" of a tone. More like a fuzz (just the behavior). Is this normal?
By the way - I´m a real nob. What is the pot (VR1) for? Just for the J201? Vol is also a voltage downer, so why the VR1? Just turned it with ears.
Thanks for this distortion. Today I put it inside the box, pic's will follow...
Quote from: Maik on September 30, 2010, 03:29:47 AM
Hey Deadastronaut, I build it and it sounds, hm, incredible! ;D
Not so much compression, more like an amp.
But with EMG pickups it sags down on the "hit" of a tone. More like a fuzz (just the behavior). Is this normal?
By the way - I´m a real nob. What is the pot (VR1) for? Just for the J201? Vol is also a voltage downer, so why the VR1? Just turned it with ears.
Thanks for this distortion. Today I put it inside the box, pic's will follow...
great you built it! did you build the 'big daddies b****d sister then?.....dont know why it would sag though on a hit?..(different pickups maybe?)
maybe you should breadboard it and change a few values to suit your pickups, just a thought ...maybe the 2.2uf..2.2k...
the vr1 is there to 'tune' the j201'...it could be replaced by a resistor,but i just wanted to be able to tweak it....ok.
many other circuits use this method to tweak the j201's too....
soundclips...????.
p.s im still a noob/nob too!... :icon_mrgreen:
Yeah, a noob... :icon_idea:
Soundclips? OK, this evening...
I play a Line6 Variax, with other pickups everything is just great. The EMG-style has VERY high output, around +10dB I think.
I build the big bastard ( the one and only from page 9). Is it the "sister"?
My box (1509B) shows the big black man from WW2 (a german idea for a "listener", like "Feind hört mit"-enemy is listening).
I think you will like what I´ve done, pics with the soundfiles...
Got the things together for the baxandall you painted on page 10. I want to put it together with the big bastard (and an on/off switch for it). For the switch: can I use a pushbutton style on/off? Have to figure out how to solder this...
Can´t wait to come home and play this little bastard...
beware i havent tried the baxandall vero design yet..so its not verified ok...if you do make it let us all know ...
and give soundclips...or even a youtube video would be great!..
so you want to be able to switch the tonestack on/off then?...good idea!..
i take it your putting the tonestack on the end?..if so it should be relatively easy to do...
put a switch from the output before the tonestack...3 pin toggle switch...
output to the middle pin..
and left pin to tonestack then out
and right to normal out.. i think... :icon_rolleyes:
maybe someone else has a better way!!!...? ;)
UGHHH
Everything I try to add in front becomes unstable
Tried adding an opamp in front, terrible oscillation. Tried adding a J201 in front, strange oscillating/crackling noise whenever you touch the strings. Switched to a 2SK117, same thing to a lesser degree....
Tried raising source resistor value to 10k, but it completely changed the sound of the circuit.
At this point, I'm thinking of throwing in the towel and just perfing up the modified bastard sister I posted earlier...
Quote from: phector2004 on September 30, 2010, 11:04:25 PM
UGHHH
Everything I try to add in front becomes unstable
Tried adding an opamp in front, terrible oscillation. Tried adding a J201 in front, strange oscillating/crackling noise whenever you touch the strings. Switched to a 2SK117, same thing to a lesser degree....
Tried raising source resistor value to 10k, but it completely changed the sound of the circuit.
At this point, I'm thinking of throwing in the towel and just perfing up the modified bastard sister I posted earlier...
hi phil.dont give in to the beast!!!! :icon_twisted:.. what was it you were trying to change about the original bastard sister..?...sounds ok to me...
i prefer the gain control on the smaller version though...
just messing around ;D
unfortunately, the more stuff you add, the more stuff you need to add to make it sound nice/work as desired... at least now I won't complain about how boss pedals are overly complicated.
Before I empty my breadboard, I'll play around with a tone control. I'm guessing I can replace the output resistor with a tonestack?
yeah take it off..the stack will suck it down too much otherwise...
im making a couple of the original big d,b,s's for friends.(as in the video)..they love it..(without any stack).it will be interesting to see how it performs when its got sheilded cable and box etc.....ive got my marshall in the front room now to test things properly...the neighbours hate me..but f**k em..
btw i just posted a tremolo i knocked up today check it out man..only 6 components...
in the 'tiny tremolo000000000 thread..thats what happens when i mess with leds ha ha...
Here Rob this is what I did last year with the 386 as a distorter.
Same idea as you more input signal = more grind on the output.
But I used an op amp and added different clipping options and a Marshall tonestack.
I had to link this for another thread so I thought I would share with you too. :icon_mrgreen:
This will do everything from clean and chimy to tube OD to all out hard core metal grind.
The downside is the knob count is high and so is the switch count,but it will dial almost any type of dirt in.
Soundclips in my gallery.
(http://www.aronnelson.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=42527&g2_serialNumber=2)
wow..that looks busy......cheers bryan i'll check ya clips out!!!...thanks rob.
Some pics of that little bastard http://profile.imageshack.us/user/Brgl/
Sounds will follow
Quote from: Maik on October 05, 2010, 05:44:18 AM
Some pics of that little bastard http://profile.imageshack.us/user/Brgl/
Sounds will follow
yeah i like that .cool..yet very sinister...stop listening... :icon_mrgreen:
look forward to ya clips...
Quote from: deadastronaut on September 16, 2010, 08:36:13 AM
NB: the initial idea was to have a 'simple' distortion without the trimmings of a tonestack, just to get the distortion 'right' first....
but now that is done it would be nice to have more control i agree...'the super b''''''d..(dreadnought).ha ha... :icon_mrgreen:
Hi
I've just red this in a DrBoogie related thread
"I built one without the tone stack and at the output to volume pot I used a "ROG" type
filter of 15k in line with 2n2 to ground and another 15k in line with 2n2 to ground.
Sounded a bit more "amp like" to me."
By MartyMartmay be interesting !!
@armando, yeah sounds cool, i have a couple of boogies populated on boards , could try that!...
id like to hear it, i was going to put one in an amp..for when travelling...etc...
Hi, Maik´s here. Jip, I did it this evening. Had to create an acount on dropbox also... :icon_mrgreen:
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/12956424/Big%20Bastard%20Test1.mp3
It´s just drums, bass, a synth, rhythm guitar from "getto metal".
Guitar left is a Les Paul´s treble pickup with gain at 3 o clock.
Guitar right is a Strat treble pickup with gain at 3ó clock and guitar vol a little bit down.
Guitar middle is: from beginning to 2:32 a Jackson, from 2:32 Corel sitar, from 3:21 Les Paul.Everything running thoug the bastard with gain at 3ó clock and vol at 2.
Very rough mix, no eq or anything else. FX comes from a Line6 Pod X3 live. No clean (without the bastard) sound on this mix, have to upload a clean sound also...
The Bastard is a little bit too bright for me, have to build the baxandall, tune the pots and build it inside the bastard box. Or turn the bass up on amp :icon_mrgreen:
Have to stop writing-need to play again.
Found out why this bastard had to sag when hitting the guitar hard-voltage was too high. Now it´s 4,9 when batery is around 8,4 volts. Now it´s fine...
nice one maik, nice to hear a bastard long clip :icon_mrgreen:
good to hear you got ya sag problem sorted out!.
and yeah i agree it can be bright, so as for tone controls their is a whole bunch out there to try!...
cool. rob.
anyone else got clips of their bastard build?????? :icon_eek:
So rob which is the best layout? it blows my head reading1-12 woooh very hot thread
Page 9 is ok. Velo and pcb.
Any chance you guys can post the voltages from the j201 and the IC,I built the vero version from page 9 and im trying to debug this at the moment :icon_redface:
Knowing my luck it will be something simple i missed
Quote from: axemurderforhire on October 30, 2010, 03:42:45 PM
Any chance you guys can post the voltages from the j201 and the IC,I built the vero version from page 9 and im trying to debug this at the moment :icon_redface:
Knowing my luck it will be something simple i missed
hi , glad you built it,
you wont even need the voltages, just turn the trim till it finds the sweet spot, all should be ok,
as for 'it being something simple, it usually is...
double check your trace cuts and jumpers if your on vero!...
especially under the ic ok.....the jumpers should be the first to do!!!!....good luck, rob
waheyyy i finally got round to building it for myself...and a friend...
photos and video demo.....
http://www.youtube.com/user/100roberthenry#p/u/0/sFtDgkbgLqg (http://www.youtube.com/user/100roberthenry#p/u/0/sFtDgkbgLqg)
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/P021110_15.48%5B01%5D.jpg)
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/P021110_15.48.jpg)
Hi Rob,
why 2 led´s?
Sounds cool ;D
hi maik, it was an old 3 knobber box, i like to use leds for spare holes
it acts like a pilot light too... :icon_mrgreen:
I know I'm a strange guy, but I find drawing PCBs about as much fun as building effects or playing guitar, so here's one, well two actually, for the Big B*****d. One small and one big b*****d :D
I'm not however an etching guy, so it's still unverified. If someone etches I'd love to have one if there'd be any extras you don't need :)
(http://i832.photobucket.com/albums/zz249/Perrow_MLP/Stomp/BigBastard.png)
@pelle, nice job man...yeah im strange in that way too, i get a kick out of converting schematics to all sorts these
days..i do more of that than actual building... :icon_rolleyes:
nice one, what prog are you using for them?..
Quote from: deadastronaut on November 08, 2010, 04:34:47 AM
nice one, what prog are you using for them?..
diylc 2.0.1 Beta
ahh ok...yep i have that too, just never tried doing a pcb on it,
i also downloaded express pcb...got to get used to that one.... :icon_cool:
Quote from: deadastronaut on November 08, 2010, 04:41:46 AM
i also downloaded express pcb...got to get used to that one.... :icon_cool:
Tried, couldn't. Though multi layer does potentially solve a lot of problems :)
But as long as I just post designs here I think I'm quite safe just using diylc. I've considered the possibility to draw double sided designs, but I figure there'd never be anyone etching them for me so I stick with just the one side.
ps. I like them curved traces, does that show?
curvy curvy..yeah i noticed. should try drawing women... :icon_wink:
yeah i wouldnt be arsed to do double sided either..
keep it simple eh!..
Quote from: deadastronaut on November 08, 2010, 05:19:03 AM
curvy curvy..yeah i noticed. should try drawing women... :icon_wink:
I get to excited drawing women for my drawings to be anything to be excited about :icon_eek:
hey rob have you tried this one?looks same as you have designed? including other people who helped :) heres the link http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=82435.0 (http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=82435.0)
Quote from: askwho69 on December 12, 2010, 12:58:05 PM
hey rob have you tried this one?looks same as you have designed? including other people who helped :) heres the link http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=82435.0 (http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=82435.0)
no i saw it ages ago, i dont think scruffie ever built it though!...you'll have to ask scruffie on that man...
easy enough to bread though!.. :icon_cool:
ohh hahaha ok! i wont bother to try because iateallthe bread hehehe! :) by the way this is very interesting LM386 proj . . .http://users.skynet.be/emma.creations/electro/documents/pititamp.pdf (http://users.skynet.be/emma.creations/electro/documents/pititamp.pdf)
le' 386.... :icon_mrgreen:
i cant read french!....... :icon_wink:
heheh me neither by the way never mind that link im hi jacking robs thread if this continues :icon_lol:
Quote from: deadastronaut on December 12, 2010, 03:52:04 PM
le' 386.... :icon_mrgreen:
i cant read french!....... :icon_wink:
Me neither but I can use Google Translate :)
@perrow.....blua bluer blurrre...see..fluent... :icon_mrgreen:
@askwho..top tip:.wear a balaclava when hijacking.... :icon_mrgreen:
Quote from: deadastronaut on December 12, 2010, 04:10:51 PM
@perrow.....blua bluer blurrre...see..fluent... :icon_mrgreen:
@askwho..top tip:.wear a balaclava when hijacking.... :icon_mrgreen:
hahaha I'am really wearing heheh holding a handmade grenade (DIY)
HAHAHA
Quote from: deadastronaut on December 12, 2010, 01:07:46 PM
Quote from: askwho69 on December 12, 2010, 12:58:05 PM
hey rob have you tried this one?looks same as you have designed? including other people who helped :) heres the link http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=82435.0 (http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=82435.0)
no i saw it ages ago, i dont think scruffie ever built it though!...you'll have to ask scruffie on that man...
easy enough to bread though!.. :icon_cool:
I did breadboard it... but I really can't remember what it was like, I do remember I intended to change the input buffer to a gain stage instead but didn't it was pretty heavy though, tonestack worked nice and that 22uF cap off pin 1 was very important I seem to remember for high gain and no oscillation.
I'd do it differently now probably, but I got bored of the limitations of the 386 Chip and always fighting that horrible decay.
oohh here you are scuff! hehehe its ok rob made this thing(386) tamed though :)
@deadastronaut, just read the whole thread, I must say this pedal sounds amazing! And your guitar playing is also top notch.
thanks man, yeah ive built a few and people love em....... :icon_twisted: :icon_twisted: :icon_twisted:
edit:
this is it on breadboard through an amp....i was testing it out...for decay sound etc... :icon_twisted:
http://www.youtube.com/user/100roberthenry?feature=mhum#p/u/7/W_5SZVyUP-Y
Sounds great and such a simple circuit. Your playing does it justice.
One day left handed guitarists will rule the world.
Quote from: Ice-9 on February 10, 2011, 04:53:54 AM
Sounds great and such a simple circuit. Your playing does it justice.
One day left handed guitarists will rule the world.
cheers man, yeah its nice and simple, like me :icon_mrgreen:...it took a while to tame it, but it was well worth the perseverence...
and yes, us leftie's will.... :icon_wink:
Quote from: Ice-9 on February 10, 2011, 04:53:54 AM
One day left handed guitarists will rule the world.
Quote from: deadastronaut on February 10, 2011, 04:57:25 AM
and yes, us leftie's will.... :icon_wink:
(http://www.thoseshirts.com/images/model-commies-LE375.jpg)
not that kind of lefty.....
yeah i agree with her...and she is very agreeable too... :icon_cool:
What a great sounding pedal !! this rocks !!!!
Cheers From Fellow Lefty - Australia
Paul
a big hi to down under.....another lefty...see we will take over the world.. :icon_mrgreen:
Wow that sound clip sounds sick!!! Great playing too!
Now- has anyone tried this on bass? And an active bass at that? I play active Ibanez 5 string.
nope!...i have a 5 string bass, not active though!.... :icon_cool:
I just built it but thought there was too little bass, so i changed the output cap to .47uF. I put a Marshall 18 watt tone stack (only treble) on the end (From this site: http://amps.zugster.net/articles/tone-stacks (http://amps.zugster.net/articles/tone-stacks)). Changed the tone pot value to 100KB. 500K didn't work right on this thing. I'm pretty pleased with the sound so far. It's now late at night so i cant crank the amp. I'll try it louder tomorrow.
I think somewhere in this thread someone told the best voltage for the trimpot setting, but i can't find it anymore. Does anybody know? I tuned it by ear, so i guess that's always best... ;D
@servas.
cool, glad you tried it..and modded it to suit your ears....
i deliberately left off any tone control as i use an eq pedal for that...i just wanted drive and volume..nice n simple. :icon_wink:
yes i trim by ear...rob.
I was playing with the circuit on a breadboard to get it to be bass friendly. I played with caps values, then added a buffered clean blend. It sounds pretty good with an active bass. With the clean blend added, I opted to actually remove some bass from the distortion, so the low end would still be clean and defined, but the high end would be distorted.
+1 more lefty for world domination.
@tim. sounds good for a bass version...for us superior lefties... :icon_mrgreen:
I tried it louder now and... Sounds great, but max volume is below unity! :'(
So the tonestack is sucking way too much gain. Have to try others. I only want one tone knob.
To be continued...
yes thought it would...stick a buffer on the output,
Buffer before or after the tonestack?
And can you please draw up a schematic of the last vero version for reference?
Thanks man!
Quote from: Der Groovemeister on February 11, 2011, 08:05:35 AM
I tried it louder now and... Sounds great, but max volume is below unity! :'(
So the tonestack is sucking way too much gain. Have to try others. I only want one tone knob.
To be continued...
hi
search for SWTC (stupid wanderful tone control, something like that!) it's supposed to be a low gain drinker!
Cheers
Armando
I lowered the 1M res at the output to 220K and now there's enough volume to drive the tonestack. We don't need no stinkin' buffers! :D
This is a great distortion pedal! Awesome! ;D
cool.... :icon_twisted:
interesting project man, congrats. i was thinking of adding it to a amplifier (this one http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=89893.0 (http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=89893.0) to be specific) any advice on how to add it with just gain control replacing the existent?
I can't see the details, but I think you'd need to add another power section for 9v
Basically a regulated wall wart (see generalguitargadgets / Small Bear projects) in addition to your high voltage power supply.
Shouldn't be too hard to implement. From that point on, you can feed this distortion circuit's output into the amp's input, maybe adding a DPDT toggle switch to bypass it if you want. On a similar project, I'm looking at using a trimpot to set the resistance between my preamp and poweramp to keep the power amp from clipping, so you can probably replace the volume pot with one of those.
One thing to note: I think people were mentioning the gain control didn't do much... so it might be smart to test it out on your own.
Good luck!
I experimented with different types of tonecontrol, but i like the SWTC best! I removed the 1M res, put a 1k res, then a 10K pot with the wiper via a 22n cap to ground. Then lug 1 of the 10K pot to the 1M and then a 50K vol pot.
It sounds great this way. ;D The only thing i can't temper is the fingersqueek. It seems that these very high frequencies are somewhat emphasized. It squeeks much more than for example my Purple Plexi, which is also a 386 based dist.
Does anybody experience that too? And how can i attenuate that? Maybe raise C1?
Rob... Anybody... ideas?
id say you could probably dump some high end at the input via a 50-150ish pf to ground rather than after in the tone section. my thinking is that the circuit is probably amping those freqs so much that you might find removing them after steals too much clarity, and makes for a slightly muffled sound... just a theory... you could probably see if turning your guitars tone controll down a bit lessens the string squeak and go from there...
Tried several small caps from in to gnd. Doesn't help.
@Rob: I saw an other version of the vero layout you posted in your gallery that has a cap and a res more: R4 and C6.
What do these do?
hi servaas, if i remember correctly, it was to have better control/range of the gain pot...i think i prefered that version... (page 3)
its been a while since doing that project....
Ok so it probably did nothing to the sound?
not that i recall...
so which schematic/layout shall i use?? I can't seem to find the latest one
hi V.
i made this one...my mates very happy with his...through an amp of course... :icon_twisted:
http://www.aronnelson.com/gallery/main.php/v/chickpea/bastardsister1.gif.html
change c3 to a 4.7nf for a warmer sound..or make them switchable...or socket it to see which cap suits you and your amp/cab best ok... :icon_idea:
here it is on breadboard into a clean marshall ok...
http://www.youtube.com/user/100roberthenry?feature=mhum#p/u/10/W_5SZVyUP-Y
its a nice easy build... :icon_wink:
Hey Rob, thanx for the response, that layout does look cool, the only thing I'm missing here is a trim pot but Hey! just remembered I have a 25k pot left there... Might try it out even now if nobody bothers me :)
ahh ok before i do that i'll got try and breadboard Bass fuzz with a starve knob.. just wonder what's gonna happen... ???
Hi all,
I recently built a D*A*M Sonic Titan, and it sounds AMAZING. However, I too am having a decay problem just like what was mentioned earlier in this thread, as it also uses a 386 chip.
I read on this thread that "a simple 100uf on the power to ground" can fix this decay problem. My tech skills are pretty bad, so I was wondering if somebody could explain a little better to me how to wire this 100uf cap "on the power to ground." I'd greatly appreciate it, as I'd love to get this decay issue fixed, cause like I said, it sounds amazing!
Thanks!
it's easy mate.. just look at the layout on this thread and take a good look on the 100uf on how the thingy is intall.
Look at page 6, reply number 103 from B trembley. He has a schematic that shows the cap in question (upper left corner). It is basically the positive side of the cap connected the the positive side of the battery, and the negative side of the cap connected to ground.
Hi, thanks for the responses!
Well, I only have a 220uf cap on hand. I tried that, I can can't hear any difference in sound and no change in fizzy decay.
I connected the positive side of the cap to the same lug on the DC jack that the positive battery wire connects to, and the negative side of the cap to the ground lug on the 3pdt switch. Is this correct?
Just connect the positive + to the positive power on your board and the negative to the ground... thats it
Yeah, I tried this cap with no improvement.
I did however find a solution this morning! This circuit (DAM Sonic Titan) seems to hate batteries. The decay is just awful. However, I finally used some DC power from my Voodoo Lab Pedal Power and it decays PERFECTLY! This is totally fine with me, as I always gig using DC Power, and only use batteries around my apartment when I'm too lazy to fetch the Pedal Power.
Thanks again for the help. It was much appreciated! I'm learning more and more about this stuff every day thanks to this forum.
Quote from: deadastronaut on April 06, 2011, 10:02:50 AM
hi V.
i made this one...my mates very happy with his...through an amp of course... :icon_twisted:
http://www.aronnelson.com/gallery/main.php/v/chickpea/bastardsister1.gif.html
change c3 to a 4.7nf for a warmer sound..or make them switchable...or socket it to see which cap suits you and your amp/cab best ok... :icon_idea:
here it is on breadboard into a clean marshall ok...
http://www.youtube.com/user/100roberthenry?feature=mhum#p/u/10/W_5SZVyUP-Y
its a nice easy build... :icon_wink:
Hey there, Mr. deadastronaut here's my contribution for this pedal in SPRINT LAYOUT program; based in your 1 FET prototype for your consideration man; it is no verified; you see any error on this? thanks for the inspiration!!! :icon_twisted:
(http://img856.imageshack.us/img856/5670/bigbdschemelayout.jpg)
hi roberto: that looks fine, but put the unused input 3 to ground too ok...then it'll be fine!. ;) cool layout.
its been a while since i messed with this, i remember i used input 3 on the bastard sister...!
but on the big bastard i used input 2...
i would socket the cap that goes into the input on the 386 for your/amp/ taste ok...have fun!. :icon_twisted:
i always wanted to whack a one knob tone control on this but never got round to it...the tone from the 'spitfire' would probably go nice on this!!!!...
theres pleny of volume on it to cope with any loss of volume if you added one.. :icon_idea: ;)
Quote from: deadastronaut on January 23, 2012, 05:02:44 AM
hi roberto: that looks fine, but put the unused input 3 to ground too ok...then it'll be fine!. ;) cool layout.
its been a while since i messed with this, i remember i used input 3 on the bastard sister...!
but on the big bastard i used input 2...
i would socket the cap that goes into the input on the 386 for your/amp/ taste ok...have fun!. :icon_twisted:
i always wanted to whack a one knob tone control on this but never got round to it...the tone from the 'spitfire' would probably go nice on this!!!!...
theres pleny of volume on it to cope with any loss of volume if you added one.. :icon_idea: ;)
Thanks my friend for your recommendations; I have to applied it soon; an a question!! I see that a resistor an d a cap in the pin 1 of gain in one of the layout are loosed?? in your scheme there is a resistor an a cap between pin 1 of gain pot and pin 2 of this pot to pin 8 of the IC!! this is Right?? thanks man it sounds awesome in your YOUTUBE sound!!!
I want to know what layout you use in it??
hi man , i'm pretty sure i used this layout (from breadboard video) . note the socket cap..
it actually uses pin 3 input instead of 2 ok.....for a bit more gain iirc....
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/P180810_09.51%5B01%5D.JPG)
http://www.aronnelson.com/gallery/main.php/v/chickpea/bastardsister1.gif.html
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/BIGBASTARDOS.jpg)
have you got a breadboard?...its quick to put on a board to try out!...
Quote from: deadastronaut on January 24, 2012, 04:38:47 AM
hi man , i'm pretty sure i used this layout (from breadboard video) . note the socket cap..
it actually uses pin 3 input instead of 2 ok.....for a bit more gain iirc....
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/P180810_09.51%5B01%5D.JPG)
http://www.aronnelson.com/gallery/main.php/v/chickpea/bastardsister1.gif.html
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/BIGBASTARDOS.jpg)
have you got a breadboard?...its quick to put on a board to try out!...
OK thanks it's clear man; I've made a PCB all in one without any cable and jumper; all in one circuit; If I've time I will put a photo of the creation!!! THANKS man it's great!!!!
cool, i look forward to seeing/hearing it... :icon_twisted:
Quote from: deadastronaut on January 25, 2012, 06:02:30 AM
cool, i look forward to seeing/hearing it... :icon_twisted:
Well man this is my design of all in one, from this:
(http://img404.imageshack.us/img404/1038/bigbdmainpotslayoutmodi.jpg)
The part named main pots layout, were I solder all the parts and POTS; this PCB is solder in 90 degrees in a base PCB named JACKS PCB:
(http://img842.imageshack.us/img842/4217/bigbdmainjackslayoutlit.jpg)
Well it's only the design; I will make it the next week o in a few days!!! I take it photos soon!!
that looks great...nice one!....
erm...deathastro?....not deadastro?... ;) :D
what programme did you use for that?....its really pro looking!.. :icon_cool:
Quote from: deadastronaut on January 25, 2012, 08:43:22 AM
that looks great...nice one!....
erm...deathastro?....not deadastro?... ;) :D
what programme did you use for that?....its really pro looking!.. :icon_cool:
OK OK I will correct the name!!!! jajajajaaaaaaaaaaaa!! I use the SPRINT LAYOUT I'm a vicious of that program 100% recommendable for pedal mods!! it's great man and you will able to do your signs libraries!!!!! I made my ones!!!
(http://img546.imageshack.us/img546/4217/bigbdmainjackslayoutlit.jpg)
corrected;
(http://img687.imageshack.us/img687/1038/bigbdmainpotslayoutmodi.jpg)
corrected; anymore errors you see? please tell me!!! thanks!!
looks fine to me.. 8)
Quote from: deadastronaut on January 25, 2012, 09:55:47 AM
looks fine to me.. 8)
A final note, the bias control for the JFET in your scheme is a trimpot 100K, and in others 25K, or 50K what is the best?? or a multi turn ones??? and the voltage will be 4.5V??
25k will be fine... those others were all i had to hand at the time......
turn till it sounds :icon_twisted:
;)
Quote from: deadastronaut on January 25, 2012, 11:25:28 AM
25k will be fine... those others were all i had to hand at the time......
turn till it sounds :icon_twisted:
;)
OK thanks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
can I use other JFET than J201?
mpf102 or 2N5458 for example....
yep...
OK!! this is my new adiction, a 3D figure of this pedal; my new colaboration:
(http://img829.imageshack.us/img829/4152/bigbastardgodsavemetall.jpg)
Enjoy!!!!!!!!!!!!
@roberto: that looks cool. great work.
i must get round to whacking a good one pot tone control on this one day too......... :icon_cool:
I wanted to make a little practice hi-gainer, so I combined some schematics, and voila.
http://www.mediafire.com/view/?d8kmgdyxae1gzzt (http://www.mediafire.com/view/?d8kmgdyxae1gzzt)
Nothing fancy, just Lil Bastard+SWTC+Dual LM386.
Here's the file from old DIYLC.
http://www.mediafire.com/?il9dgtg2priab2a (http://www.mediafire.com/?il9dgtg2priab2a)
What do you think - will it work? :D I'll probably try to make it tomorrow.
@meffcio, From what I've heard, the 386 doesn't like being bridged, you might be better off doing something with a TDA1905, or some other small power amp chip. Otherwise, breadboard it and find out!
Quote from: psychedelicfish on December 25, 2012, 12:18:34 AM
@meffcio, From what I've heard, the 386 doesn't like being bridged, you might be better off doing something with a TDA1905, or some other small power amp chip. Otherwise, breadboard it and find out!
Well, that's the problem, I don't have a breadboard. :( Only perfboard, and that's why I made this layout already.
Anyway, I used LM386 for two reasons - I have just enough of them, and they only need 2 additional components in this configuration. TDA1905 looks nice, gives a lot of output, but needs a lot of other components, which I may not have, and which would make my board grow a lot bigger. Still, I'll try to find it somewhere and experiment. But right now I also have TBA820, and TDA2822, which both could give good results, but still need some additional stuff to work. Maybe I'll experiment with TDA2822, but I'' certainly look for TDA1905 someday. For now, I'll stick to LM386 and see what happens.
Meffcio ,
My virusscanner tells me there is a virus in your 1st file ! Are you aware of this ?
Say what? :icon_eek:
ESET Smart Security with an up-to-date database shows nothing.. Maybe it's smth on mefiafire? :icon_confused:
Could be ! I use Avira premium suite.
Fatal flaw on the PCB! (-) leg of C9 should be connected to GND, not +9V!
Well, I perfboarded it with a TDA2822M and BF245A, and something's wrong. At first when I turned the amp on, playing loud power chords wolud make it cause some clicking. So I started adjusting voltage coming to jfet. Max drain-ground voltage I could get was about 3,2V. Going further the amp started to sqeal like hell, so I settled with that value. Now gain goes from low (clean-like) to overdrive, but very far from hi-gain like in the samples provided earlier by Rob. Tone control works in a strange manner. From muddy (like 3/4 of potentiometer's area) to a little trebley than what I think is normal. Also, increasing volume works normally to about half of pot's range. Going further the sound gets only slightly louder but much more distorted, with really unpleasant sounding of palm muting, so I'm assuming the distortion comes from the TDA chip.
I'll provide schematic and the layout later, because I don't have them on this PC.
Gave up on that idea - I'll just have the big bastard as a stompbox.
Anyway, that leads me to another question. Did anybody try to put a 3 knob tone stack with this effect? Like the one used in Krank DM. Anybody?
^ hi meffico: nope, never got round to it, but i think it could handle it...
Well, I'm stupid. I have a breadboard now, I'll just try it, as soon as I get spare jacks. :)
haven't you got any crocodile clips?...just clip to guitar leads..
which is the best working layout of this project?
check my gallery...
whats the difference between the big bastard and the bastard sister in terms of sound,?
not a lot in it IIRC, i think the big bastard is better though, imo.
i built that one.. ;)...i always meant to stick a tone control on it though, just never got round to it.
I've read the big bastard is pretty amp like.. To what amp does it sounds like? Also, can I put a pot at the end of the jfet stage as gain control and putting a jumper on pin1 and 8?
try it on bread board first..
socket C1 to taste..
this is what it sounds like , demo test, i was teting for the notorious fizz wih 386's...but the 100uf power filter sorted that..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W_5SZVyUP-Y&list=UUGP0eO8ADt0H9FY5UcHTf8A&index=35
brutal carnage! This pedal is hellish! btw, does the trimpot serves as another flavor to taste part or a certain value has to be followed?
why did snoop dog build a big bastard ?
because he doesn't care for the fizzle ...
http://tinyurl.com/2vk8z8d
@mark, its to bias the fet...turn till you get it right....you'll know when. \m/ :icon_twisted: \m/
if you have a lm386n-3 try that in it also....if not no problemo.. ;)
do you have it on breadboard...?..if so try a tone on it.
as I turn the trimmer, I noticed many shades of distortion but which one is the intended one. Im kinda confused..Gotta have to try a marshall tone stack to it when I got the time. Great circuit BTW. Still playin it right now, its getting me addicted!
cool, glad you like it, the fets drain should be around 4.5-5.0-5.5 v on the drain of the fet...(officially)
but that is a matter of taste and opinion really...
see whats best when you have your guitar volume at the lowest without gating...thats generally a good way of getting it right.
NICE VIDEO, ROB! I will have to give this one a look-see...I know someone who might REALLY like this! Larry
thanks for the trick Rob! What can I say? i think this one sounds better than the krank DM IMO. Meets my shred tone standards.
^ cool, yeah i built a few versions of the krank, and it fizzed like a sod...so i gave up on that...
its a great little mean ass pedal..my mate has my old one and loves it.
did you try a tone on it?..
try this one..
http://www.aronnelson.com/gallery/main.php/v/chickpea/bluesmetalthrashtone.jpg.html
where do I have to stick a master volume in that tone control? And what value.?
I would try a 100K off of pin 2 of the tone control.
^ yep.. 8)
I mean, should pin 2 or 3 of the master pot(dial pointing to face) be connected to that corner between C2 and 50-100k tone pot? if not, on which point should I stick the master pot?
Yes. Pin 3 connected to that corner between C2 and and pin 2 of the tone pot. Then pin 2 of the volume would be your output, and pin 1 would go to ground.
:)
(https://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/tone.jpg)
Went looking for something a little more than an LPB-1 for the 'SMT Thread' and this bastard popped up on the 'show new replies page'. So here goes, totally unverified, SMD 386 drops in the empty space, through hole components on the reverse side (back of screen). Test for the value of 'VR1' and order a resistor of the appropriate value.
(http://i832.photobucket.com/albums/zz249/Perrow_MLP/Builds/Layouts%20and%20transfers/BigBastardSMT.png)
300dpi.
is it possible to add a TMB tonestack on this bastard? Do I need to add a booster or buffer afterwards?
@mark: try it on breadboard, but i'm pretty sure the amp will have lots of output to handle it.. 8)