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DIY Stompboxes => Building your own stompbox => Topic started by: deadastronaut on March 14, 2014, 06:51:37 AM

Title: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on March 14, 2014, 06:51:37 AM
i ended up tinkering with Gus's ASDF  a bit, and went for a more heavy type groove :icon_twisted:.......

cleans up nice too 8)

i used a pregain as i just prefer the control of that...

cheers for the inspiration gus....lots of tweaking fun to be had.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kaBkdysrX_A&feature=youtu.be


(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/xfuzz.jpg)


well worth breadboarding..if only to annoy your neighbours.  :icon_twisted:

edit:

vero layout...something for the weekend.. ;)

(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/xfuzz%20vero.jpg)

oops left off the 100uf cap...like i say breadboard it first... ;)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: digi2t on March 14, 2014, 07:03:10 AM
In a word.....


YEOWSA!!!!!


 :icon_twisted:
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: haveyouseenhim on March 14, 2014, 07:25:13 AM
Awesome sounding :icon_cool:. And the schematic seems simple enough to help build my layout skills.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: jdub on March 14, 2014, 09:02:28 AM
 :icon_eek: Whoa!  That's a whole lotta sound for such a teeny circuit...very nice!
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: kingswayguitar on March 14, 2014, 11:08:26 AM
rippin'
presently for some reason my browser isn't showing your images so no schematic for me, but the youtube vid was dope! a bit of delay at the end? nice touch!!
i'll check back later...
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on March 14, 2014, 11:13:39 AM
cheers,  i think my dropbox is messng around today... ::)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: rutabaga bob on March 14, 2014, 12:59:31 PM
Mmmmm!  Nice n' nazty fuzz!     Where's my soldering iron?!
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on March 14, 2014, 01:06:47 PM
breadboard...breadboard...breadboard.... ;)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: rutabaga bob on March 14, 2014, 01:46:06 PM
I...still...don't have one...   :icon_redface:
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on March 14, 2014, 02:29:57 PM
what!!!!!.. get down the shops man! ;D
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: kingswayguitar on March 14, 2014, 02:35:17 PM
thanks for the image update. nice silicon cascade.
Peace
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: digi2t on March 14, 2014, 09:40:51 PM
Looks a bit like a modified front half of the BMP.

I've been testing several BMP versions on the breadboard for a month now, so I'm seeing it everywhere.  :icon_mrgreen:
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: rutabaga bob on March 14, 2014, 10:10:15 PM
Hey Rob...
  What's the bold '10k' under lug 2 of the pregain pot?  There's no 10k shown there on the schematic.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Gus on March 14, 2014, 10:21:20 PM
The circuit is different in two basic ways.

The ASDF has a gain control that adjusts both gain stages with one control.  The opamp base Blues Breaker and other effects have this control the ASDF is done with two inverting C to B feedback stages.

The ASDF has the base to ground resistor that does not need as much transistor selection as the circuit without the base to ground resistor (text book circuit, BMP type, some whas first gain stage etc.)

The ASDF also has a series resistor in in the diodes cap feedback path

There was this thread from the past
http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=92997.0 (http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=92997.0)

There are few ways to use two transistor gain stages for a overdrive, fuzz

Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: DDD on March 15, 2014, 05:35:17 AM
Very interesting sound and wonderfully simple circuitry.
Respect!
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Gus on March 15, 2014, 09:49:59 AM
I guessed at the guitar and cable cap part and used two diodes for one LED
(http://www.aronnelson.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=50656&g2_serialNumber=1)

Are the collector voltages close?

You have two gain stages set at max gain, no added series resistor from collector to base stage one to stage two. the collectors are closer to ground for higher gain. Stage one base goes to the input wiper without any added series resistance.
 
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on March 15, 2014, 01:54:05 PM
hi gus, cheers

i'll take some readings later ok...i'm using 5088's

was messing with adding that 33k back in last night ..still tinkering.


@larry: the 10k is from 9v to collector. ;)

don't build yet...breadboard it..
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: rutabaga bob on March 15, 2014, 05:42:30 PM
@Rob:
  I saw the labeled resistor...I was just wondering if there's supposed to be something at that spot that's not on the schematic...don't mean to be obtuse.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on March 15, 2014, 05:49:50 PM
 ;D ahhh i see, ignore that..that was when i had a standing 10k instead...

no worries.. ;)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: cctsim on March 15, 2014, 07:15:34 PM
Are D1 and D3 needed ? It looks that the Q2 will start clipping the negative wave much earlier.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 07, 2014, 08:01:03 AM
X ROCK.

pretty cool overdrive/dist...with just a tinker or 2 to the x fuzz...its pretty amazing what you can squeeze out of 2 trannies... :icon_twisted:

(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/XROCK.jpg)

quicky clip..

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/FUZZOVERDRIVE.mp3

edit: you can lose the 220k and 220pf too, and even lose 1 led, (the one with the negative to collector)..even smaller 8)


updated

(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/XROCK2.jpg)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: samhay on April 07, 2014, 09:31:47 AM
I see your recent adventures in automobiling haven't damaged your ability to shred too badly.

You can probably lose R1 too.

Alternativel you could try moving the gain pot to R3. For extra marks, you could try a Blues Breaker-style gain control with lug 1 connected to base, lug 2 to collector and lug 3 to C5.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 07, 2014, 09:45:49 AM
hi sam, i'll give that blues breaker style a whirl.. 8)

i did try the gain pot as R3 but prefered it at the front...but i'll try that.

its a pretty cool little circuit, it has a good metally/rock feel to it for sure....sounds cool through my amp (clean channel) :icon_twisted:
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: samhay on April 07, 2014, 09:57:02 AM
Cool - I just re-read the thread and see that Gus suggested the Blues-Breaker style gain control too. It might tame it a little (or just break it).
I have just about finished the chorus, so will have some free breadboard space soon and will give it a try.

Oh - as drawn, your second (new) schematic has a typo - you have the a C-B short in Q2.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 07, 2014, 10:24:07 AM
yeah give it a go man,  8)

the Q2 is fine, .. it wont work without that base/collector split  connection. just tried t to make sure.


 just tried the 'blues break' pot...yeah i find it better, more control at the front...goes from slight break to full on.. :icon_cool:

edit: forgot the 33k... ::)  sorted. ;)
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/XROCK2.jpg)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: samhay on April 07, 2014, 11:24:56 AM
Fair enough, but you still have a direct connection between C and B in Q2...
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 07, 2014, 11:37:44 AM
ahh gotcha!...image updated.  ;)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: samhay on April 07, 2014, 11:43:46 AM
nice one.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 07, 2014, 12:41:54 PM
tinkering a little more

i found switching between the 1 led, or 2 1n4148's in series to be kinda cool too...different flavours.   8)

Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 08, 2014, 11:06:39 AM
ok, back to breading..

this thing is fine, sounds great...not grate ;D

anyway, a little issue i have is with the pregain maxed i like to turn my guitar down to its minimum and have 'jangly' chord stuff going on...

however at guitar minimum there's a kind of gating (holding back) going on, ive tried tweaking the collector on Q1, to no avail...

and having a resistor stopping the pregain pot from going to zero...to no avail...(as per schemo above)

?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: samhay on April 08, 2014, 11:25:20 AM
Have you tried a resistor from the gate of Q1 to ground?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 08, 2014, 11:30:41 AM
yeah tried that too, even a lower gain trannie 3904....

this has got some lovely compression and sustain, even on a crappy single coil...very nice. 8)

but yeah the jangly part is eluding me...hmmmm....


Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: samhay on April 08, 2014, 11:41:17 AM
emitter resistor(s)?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 08, 2014, 11:56:57 AM
yeah tried 100r's  and 220r's ....on both emitters...no joy,

and it takes the edge of it too....hmmmm...
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 10, 2014, 04:43:03 AM
i was playing with this yesterday with a crybaby in front, its really sweet, and the tone is nice and  'creamy' on neck and bridge  pups,''

and the wah when on/off lies in there seamlessly...really sweet. 8)

it has a kind of eric johnson type fluid feel to it  that just makes you want to fly all over the neck.....it really is that good imo.

i just want need to sort that guitar low volume holding back issue on it..

i stuck a SWTC on it just for now which is cool too...

@sam: do you have a breadboard spare?...be nice to get anothers opinion/test on this..
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: samhay on April 10, 2014, 04:56:22 AM
I'll bump it to the top of my list.

If it plays nice with a wah in front, then maybe you should try a buffer in front of the gain pot?
How does it compare to the Sptifire?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Elijah-Baley on April 10, 2014, 05:04:17 AM

vero layout...something for the weekend.. ;)

(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/xfuzz%20vero.jpg)

oops left off the 100uf cap...like i say breadboard it first... ;)

I'm sorry... I didn't understand. The vero layout is wrong?
Somebody could post the correct layout for avoidin misunderstanding? Or adding an hint for correct it.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 10, 2014, 05:58:34 AM
I'll bump it to the top of my list.

If it plays nice with a wah in front, then maybe you should try a buffer in front of the gain pot?
How does it compare to the Sptifire?

i just tried a bjt buffer in front but it buzzed like hell, and still gated when low...hmmm..must've done something wrong there i think.

i haven't got a spitfire here at the mo, its up my mates gaff...

got a buffer to try?..


@elijah,  breadboard the circuit first... or hold fire on it for now, as i was thinking of incorporating  XFUZZ/XROCK in one...eventually. ;)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: samhay on April 10, 2014, 06:23:29 AM
What did you try?
I would have thought a simple emitter follower should do in this case.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 10, 2014, 06:26:48 AM
fifth one down..

http://www.muzique.com/lab/buffers.htm
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: samhay on April 10, 2014, 06:57:27 AM
That should work. Perhaps try a resitor between the input cap and base?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 10, 2014, 07:03:02 AM
cheers sam, yeah i'll give it another go...

edit: yep the buffer works ok now with a resistor, but the 'holding back' at min guitar vol is still there.....

Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 11, 2014, 10:48:47 AM
X rock on breadboard..DI..mixer...no amp.

jamming along with a YT backing elevator music ::)...just testing out on HSS crapocaster ...goes nice with wah, and lovely and round with tone turned down on neck pup...i love it, quite versatile.

get jazzy baby.. 8)

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/jazzjamxrock.mp3

p.s. i pm'd gus about the 'gatey' issue...hopefully he'll chime in...i'm off to get beer its friday..whoohooo.. :icon_cool:
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 13, 2014, 12:16:07 PM
i went back a step and took out the gain pot to see if it was that causing the 'hold back'

but nope...still does it,

i put 2 leds in series to get a bit of level boost/ tried other diodes...still does it..

much more prominent 'hold back' on single coil neck pup too...hmmmm....

i have a feeling the issue must have something to do with the very edge of the diodes/leds clipping (off/barely lighting)...

hmmmm what to do?.

edit:

aha, i seem to have cracked it...A 1M resistor in parallel with the leds...PUKKA.  nice n clean to full on.  8) 8) 8)





Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: samhay on April 13, 2014, 02:31:37 PM
yep - it was a biasing issue.
Haven't found any breadboard time yet, but should do this week - is the 1M resistor the only change to the latest schematic?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 13, 2014, 02:52:32 PM
just updating schemo now..

i added a SWTC in there just for now (after Q2) ...tinkering with that a little first.  8)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Will.mendil on April 13, 2014, 03:09:11 PM
Wow! Now I know what I am building Tuesday. This is great! Will be testing your variations and let you know which I will enclose.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Will.mendil on April 13, 2014, 03:09:34 PM
Where did it come from? who designed it?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 13, 2014, 03:34:08 PM
its just random breading really...

i highly suggest  getting  the breadboard out...there are 3 different fuzz/dist so far...

the X fuzz (extreme)

the X rock (2 variants.

after adding the tone control it will need a recovery stage too..these are just preliminary experiments really, but i intend to be able to switch between the over the top X FUZZ and the Xrock...2 in 1  effect.

eventually...these things take time..well it does with me anyway.. ;)..but it should be pretty cool in the end. 8)

Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Will.mendil on April 13, 2014, 03:56:44 PM
Indeed that is a good idea. How long do you recon it ll take you? Should I wait ? I'll still breadboard this one and see what mods I can bring to it but i have not got much time so id rather get stuff other people have perfected :s
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Will.mendil on April 13, 2014, 03:57:24 PM
Do you have sound clips f you different mods ? Please :)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 13, 2014, 04:21:21 PM
@wil, i suggest you hang on for a bit....these things can't be rushed...but its a tiny circuit, nice n quick to breadboard up, so give it a go man. 8)

anyway:

one little problem i just noticed (there always is eh ::)) 

as the gain is lowered , so the top end rolls off too....hmmmm.... ???

heres the latest..

(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/XROCK3.jpg)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Will.mendil on April 13, 2014, 04:43:36 PM
@deadastronaut sorry if it looked like I want to rush you. My bad. Moreover by the time I get all the parts from tayda ( enclosure and stuff, as I got all the components here) you ll be able to finish 20 new designs ;)

The three LEDs are the clipping diods aren't they? Aren't you supposed to put at least two, one  opposite the other? Anyway as you said. Will be putting and testing them next week
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Gus on April 13, 2014, 05:07:07 PM
Why do you have R1?
Voltages help.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Will.mendil on April 13, 2014, 05:17:40 PM
It a pretty standard design. The r1 pulls down unnecessary current if I am not mistaken (might be though)

This guy explains stuff pretty well. It is applied to tubes though

http://youtu.be/mrMGGHp8yLk
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Gus on April 13, 2014, 05:20:25 PM
There is no need for R1 a 500K input volume control would work.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 13, 2014, 06:41:35 PM
Hi gus, Yeah R1 isnt on my board , ....

why would the tone change when adjusting the pregain though?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Brymus on April 13, 2014, 07:09:41 PM
With the pre gain pot,R1 isn't needed as it actually just lowers the input impedance by way of paralleling the pot.
Would be different if there was a DC blocking cap before the pre gain pot after R1.
I think,the pot is forming a filter with your C2 which is why it is rolling off some high end.
Not versed on filters just guessing.
Sounds really cool,nice doomy fuzz Rob  8)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Brymus on April 13, 2014, 07:16:39 PM
Also instead of SWTC why not a BMP (with the body mod)  tone control?
That would give you scoop or hump ability which should sound good with this fuzz.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: PRR on April 14, 2014, 12:08:10 AM
No output DC-block capacitor?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 14, 2014, 03:43:00 AM

I think,the pot is forming a filter with your C2 which is why it is rolling off some high end.


yeah that makes sense now i look at it... (i'll take a look at that BMP with contour too, cheers bryan. 8)

@prr: oops yes...i shall remedy.  8)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 14, 2014, 06:39:10 AM
ok, i give in  ;), i put the 1M gain pot across the collector and base of Q1...which works , and now it doesn't change the tone etc...great

however there is DC on it as its scratchy as hell...

@gus: added v for ya!.. ;)

(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/XROCK4.jpg)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Brymus on April 14, 2014, 12:36:26 PM
Now you need R1 again ,since you moved the pre gain pot.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 14, 2014, 01:46:03 PM
oops oh yes... 8)

i tried a recovery stage on it today too, much better, (lifted from the big muff ( at least that came in useful lol. ;D.)

sounds cool still... 8)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: samhay on April 14, 2014, 03:56:02 PM
As promised, I have this on the breadboard.

I think the LEDs should be oriented with cathode towards base. Once I figured this out, it wasn't noticeably gated and worked ok with the volume rolled back.

It is savage at max gain, but mostly in a good way. I added a base resistor to Q1 to tame it a little and make it play nice with others. It was squealing pretty badly on the breadboard without a buffer in front, so a small cap to ground here might help too.
I tried the 'Blues Breaker' style gain control with lug 3 of the gain pot connected to C4. At max gain, this is equivalent to how its drawn at the moment, but it lets you back the gain off a little easier.
You certainly need to roll of some fizz, and the SWTC does this nicely.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: PRR on April 15, 2014, 02:03:00 AM
> there is DC on it as its scratchy as hell

On what? The Gain pot?

The way you have it on #61, the "gain" really does violence to the DC conditions. (Meter the collector while you diddle "gain".) I suspect the C-B resistor should be fixed, and an input level pot put before the input capacitor (you may have done this before?). There's other ways but more complex.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 15, 2014, 09:38:05 AM
@sam: ahh cool, you have it on bread too...

yep cathodes/anodes ...i'll sort that, :icon_redface:

the SWTC tames it a lot for the better for sure, non squeely... 8)

is your gain pot scratchy?.... i'll meter mine in a bit.

''violence to the DC conditions''  :)  i'll check for violence too.. ;D

edit:

@paul: whilst diddling the gain pot i get...0.63-2.54v..

edit:
sam, i put my gain pot the same as yours now, but still scratchy... :)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: DDD on April 15, 2014, 10:40:36 AM
Is the gain pot actually necessary here?
Guitar volume pot does srtrictly the same without any scratchy sounds and without extra components IMHO.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 15, 2014, 10:46:14 AM
@DDD:  its a nice option to have it just for slight breakup in an amp really....
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Will.mendil on April 15, 2014, 11:00:07 AM
Since I started on solid stat amps I need really use the volume pot on my guitar which might be a shame but really preference the pedal to self contained. I only use the volume on the guitar to kill the humms and feedback a when I am not playing.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 15, 2014, 12:39:48 PM
one other issue i found is the volume on guitar when lowered also rolls of the hi tone too (  on single coil neck pup)

the bridge hum pup fairs much better...
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Will.mendil on April 15, 2014, 02:27:48 PM
I d like to go back to the x fuzz. I ve bread boarded it making sure it was exactly what you did and I don't get at all the sound you have on your YouTube video. What set up did you use? Do you have any further information ? Has anyone tested it ?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Will.mendil on April 15, 2014, 02:28:06 PM
I like the rock but I love your fuzz
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 15, 2014, 02:51:07 PM
the schemo on page 1 is what i used for the vid,,

i used yellow 5mm leds if that makes a difference.

try taking the 220k to base ...
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Will.mendil on April 15, 2014, 03:13:54 PM
obviously it had to be the only colour I cannot find :(.
What do you mean taking the 20K to base?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Will.mendil on April 15, 2014, 03:15:55 PM
I can only find 3mm yellow, they are 1.841V, what are yours?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 15, 2014, 03:18:04 PM
try taking R5 220k to base of Q2 . instead of collector..(page 1 schemo)

not sure of 5mm yellow voltages...2.4v maybe..
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Will.mendil on April 15, 2014, 03:33:09 PM
That's what I understood, but R5 is already on base, and collector, putting both legs of R5 to base do you mean?
I know that the yellow's voltage are between the green and red, and i tried both but it only does the x rock sound.
Has anyone else managed to get the same sound? I'm pretty clueless there :s
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 15, 2014, 03:36:21 PM
i mean take the 220k to base, and not to collector..

ok, give me a minute and i'll adjust my breadboard to the x fuzz and test again ok...



back in a bit..
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Will.mendil on April 15, 2014, 03:52:32 PM
(http://i161.photobucket.com/albums/t208/lekoala/ScreenShot2014-04-15at213729_zpscc05c3a5.jpg) (http://s161.photobucket.com/user/lekoala/media/ScreenShot2014-04-15at213729_zpscc05c3a5.jpg.html)

is that what you mean???? i am confuse.

thanks though
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 15, 2014, 04:00:25 PM
nope forget that...

ok tried it as per schemo page 1..

and it IS correct, it works as it is...

tried red leds 5mm...ok

tried yellow leds 5mm...ok

1n4148's -  very quiet..

are you using humbuckers?..

the schemo calls for a 10n on input, but try 22n for a fatter sound....


edit:

i just did a side by side comparison, and the yellow 5mms definately sound better...they just have that extra edge.. :icon_twisted:

you could try doubling up the leds you have... so use 4 instead of 2...  

 >  >
 <  <
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Will.mendil on April 15, 2014, 04:24:51 PM
Thanks. I'll find the yellow LEDs and test it tomorrow.

It's very odd that mine sounds like your rock instead if fuzz . Could it be the amp? I tried single and hunbercker but it does not change drastically. Bizarre bizarre cette histoire.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 15, 2014, 04:32:32 PM
ok, i have my low E dropped to D in the vid...

and i had it going into a clean channel of a marshall AVT275..

i just tried 3mm yellows...but 5mm yellows are much better.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Will.mendil on April 15, 2014, 05:01:53 PM
It seems you are using some sort of reverb aren't you?
Anyway just ordered some yellow LEDs. So I'll be back whining in a couple weeks ;)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 15, 2014, 05:16:36 PM
yeah reverb /delay on mixer..
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: samhay on April 16, 2014, 08:31:16 AM
@sam: ahh cool, you have it on bread too...
is your gain pot scratchy?.... i'll meter mine in a bit.

''violence to the DC conditions''  :)  i'll check for violence too.. ;D


Not much time to play with it at the moment, but it is on the breadboard.
I didn't notice that the gain pot was scratchy, but it certainly could be - there is DC across it, which varies with the pot. I think the fact that the gain pot is shifting the Q1 collector voltage is the violence that PRR was referring to.

Edited for typos
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 16, 2014, 08:38:20 AM
we need more violence... :icon_twisted:

yep, the pot is definately scratchy, i'll try it again in the pregain position and see...

Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: samhay on April 16, 2014, 08:40:29 AM
The other option is to AC couple the gain pot, by adding a cap in series. You will probably have to parallel an e.g. 1M resistor from C-B in order to maintain the Q1 bias.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 16, 2014, 10:39:54 AM
out of curiosity i tried lots of different leds superbrights of all colours..for the X FUZZ.

the nearest that came close to the yellows was 10mm orange clear brights...but 5mm yellows pips it..

X FUZZ:

i moved the gain to pregain again, no more scratchyness...however now there is mad synthy oscillation across the pot travel until its on full gain

then it behaves...strange as the guitar pot behaves fine... ???

i also stuck a 220pf across the Q2 C/B to reduce fizz between notes. much better, 

the way the x fuzz is you could do away with the gain pot entirely and have a good one pot vol control pedal...1590a etc.,,,

anyway...
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: samhay on April 16, 2014, 10:46:55 AM
It might be the capacitance of the LEDs you are hearing differences in. Did you audition the LEDs before or after adding the 220pf C-B cap to Q2?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Will.mendil on April 16, 2014, 03:02:55 PM
Obviously I had to find the yellow LEDs after ordering some. Anyways. Tried, not satisfied.
Has anyone else tested the fuzz? Sorry if I am insisting but it really is a smashing pedal.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: justice on April 16, 2014, 04:09:17 PM
I had this on my breadboard for a bit (first version posted).  I really liked it!  With 4 4148s it I could almost dial in the same tone as my Obsidian.....very cool.  Although the volume was a little on the quiet side. 

I am still a newb at this and for what its worth, I am following your work closely deadastronaut, I am a big fan!  I can't wait to see how this project evolves.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 16, 2014, 04:12:58 PM
^ hi justice, cool, i'm glad you tried it man... 8)

the 1n4148's will make it much queiter...leds louder..



@will: great you found the leds.. 8)

are you not getting enough gain, or ?...
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Will.mendil on April 16, 2014, 04:21:39 PM
Indeed no, I'll post a recording tomorrow as it is pretty late here. I am missing the juicy sound you have.

Unrelated question. Do you have a website where all your creative fruits are publicly easily available?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 16, 2014, 04:23:11 PM
no, i have a gallery here which i update now n then...not often enough though, i'm terrible at pc house keeping.. :)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Will.mendil on April 16, 2014, 04:47:24 PM
Well in the case ( I swear it was not my first intention) but I can put them on my blog. Do a specific section for you. If you wish of course.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Will.mendil on April 16, 2014, 04:49:16 PM
Although I am not sure how much stuff you've actually made :s
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 16, 2014, 06:46:30 PM
tinkering a little more with the X FUZZ.  (straight into mixer, no amp)

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/xfuzz10k-22k-onQ2C.mp3

^ this is with 10k on Q2 collector then at 0:40 i switch to 22k..adss a little more splattyness .(@will maybe try a 15k  on Q2)

and for laughs...which i really like actually too,  synthy swell sounds whoohooo.. 8) ....hmmmm options galore.. :icon_idea:

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/XFUZZ-100k-220k-Q2C.mp3




Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: kingswayguitar on April 17, 2014, 03:35:59 AM
tinkering a little more with the X FUZZ.  (straight into mixer, no amp)

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/xfuzz10k-22k-onQ2C.mp3

^ this is with 10k on Q2 collector then at 0:40 i switch to 22k..adss a little more splattyness .(@will maybe try a 15k  on Q2)

and for laughs...which i really like actually too,  synthy swell sounds whoohooo.. 8) ....hmmmm options galore.. :icon_idea:

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/XFUZZ-100k-220k-Q2C.mp3



now that's heavy!
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: DDD on April 17, 2014, 10:52:08 AM
Very beautiful sound with impressive dynamics!
But there's some kind of farting at the attack portion of signal. It seems that coupling cap between stages is too big, I guess (?)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 17, 2014, 11:04:34 AM
yes, well its still early stages with it, i need to spend a little time with headphones on and tinker really..

but i'm off for a weeks break tomorrow, ....but i'll be back on it when i get back.

experiment guys...

 8)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: duck_arse on April 17, 2014, 11:24:55 AM
I had a quick look at "this" today, just sig gen and cro, no listen. with 3 leds K to collector, the output was just about all square wave. with the K's pointing to base instead, there was some distinct and assymetric "batman-ing" appearing in the top of the output waveform. mine was unstable as hell with zero sig in, needed 100pF on Q1 and I had a 39pF across the leds, but I also had 2M2 C-B resistors.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Will.mendil on April 17, 2014, 01:50:53 PM
Did you get a similar sound to him?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: samhay on April 17, 2014, 02:07:23 PM
I had a quick look at "this" today, just sig gen and cro, no listen. with 3 leds K to collector, the output was just about all square wave. with the K's pointing to base instead, there was some distinct and assymetric "batman-ing" appearing in the top of the output waveform. mine was unstable as hell with zero sig in, needed 100pF on Q1 and I had a 39pF across the leds, but I also had 2M2 C-B resistors.

That all sounds about right.
I noticed the 'batman-ing' when I simmed it too, but haven't looked with a scope yet.

I think it has potential - especially when the gain is cranked, but until it is boxed up, it is a bit hard to know how well behaved it is likely to be.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: duck_arse on April 18, 2014, 10:41:20 AM
I have only cro-ed so far, no listening, to his or mine. soon.

@sam - were you using bi-directional leds at one stage? if yes, what did sim show?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: samhay on April 18, 2014, 04:48:44 PM
I only ran the sim with one LED in one/both directions.
With an LED cathode towards base you get batman-ing at high gain. An LED oriented in the other direction doesn't do anything.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 25, 2014, 06:25:24 PM
hi guys, i'm back from my travels...had a great break up north, went trekking around  newcastle, whitley bay, amble, alnwick, rothbury  and hadrians wall , kielder forest , northumberland national park etc..stunning scenery and fresh air..nice. 8) 8) 8)

did just under a thousand miles in my poor little skoda....man that's a long drive from up there back to london...


anyway, now i'm  back to my beloved  breadboard at last....i missed it big time.... 8)

any tinkering been going on?... ;)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Will.mendil on April 25, 2014, 06:35:49 PM
Cool trip mate. I do need a holiday.

I personally was on another project an still awaiting a couple parts to rerere....retest the xfuzz ( yep I'm still there I bother you ;) )
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 25, 2014, 07:29:42 PM
cool, bother away man.. ;D
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 27, 2014, 04:18:40 AM
another swell clip, with 182k on Q2....this time i got rid of the 1uf going to leds..

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/XFUZZSWELL..mp3

Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 27, 2014, 08:45:10 AM
ok here is the XFUZZ ...

i added a 'bias' pot for a splatty swelly synthy option

when the 250k is full on, the sound is that of the vid page 1...when anti clockwise its buzzy synthy stuff.  (the 250k coud be a 100k-500k) but i chose to split the difference. (if you just want fuzz leave the 250k pot off)

as you can see i tacked on a recovery stage to bring up the volume...

i put a 220pf across Q2 C/B to tame hi fizz 8)

i also added a 4.7k on the gain pot so the gain doesn't go all the way off (silent)

and used a 470k lin pot for gain.

(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/xfuzzdone.jpg)

put it on ya breadboard!.. ;)



Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: bluesdevil on April 28, 2014, 03:26:11 AM
Just rocked this out on the breadboard.... good job, Rob!!
May I ask what the hfe is on your 2n5088's?
Mine are really low, under 300 hfe. Gain buckets on the transistors from Tayda are a bit wacky..... the 2n3904 I got from them measure higher than the 2n5088's!
Pulled out some 2n5089's that had gains around 400 hfe and that gave it a bit more kick to make the gain knob more useable instead of just full up.
    I like the "Synth" control a lot, gives some really cool textures, but I wished they made  a 125k pot, that would be the perfect useable range, I think.
I gotta say I enjoyed playing this one enough to box up.... now on to the "SpitFire"!!!
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 28, 2014, 05:32:25 AM
nice one bluesdevil bill...

i'll check my hfe's and post up ok...

i now have the X ROCK back on breadboard..and i love it, goes great with a crybaby in front , i just cant stop rippin over it....you may want to try this before the spitty while you have it on bread..

really cool for heavy blues, rock, hendrixy stuff...great on neck single coil, and a nice bite on bridge hummer.. 8) cleans up lovely too..

clip: neck then wah....then bridge then wah..(clip at max gain, tone at 12'oclock..) recorded into mixer , no amp...need more coffee for amps..

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/XROCK.mp3

(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/XROCKSCHEMO.jpg)


btw i'm sure we can get a 250k to be a 125k by sticking a 250k resistor across its lugs..

on the x fuzz i liked the synthy option at 182k IIRC...

if i can i'll try to get both XFUZZ/XROCK into one circuit, with switching... :)


edit: my 250k trim pot is actually 270k...i stuck a 220k across its lugs, now we have 120k... ;)  so whack a 220k/250k across your pot to halve it. or to taste.

Q1 hfe 333 - Q2 hfe 327. (i actually used a 3904 for recovery stage,,)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Brymus on April 28, 2014, 11:19:49 AM
Awesome,I really like the wah in front sound better.
That does have a very cool OD sound to it,like a cranked up amp,it's on my list of stuff to BB.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 28, 2014, 11:33:44 AM
Hi Bryan, yeah man, well worth breading... 8)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: bluesdevil on April 28, 2014, 09:49:01 PM
Hey Rob, thanks for checking your hfe's..... sounds like I'm in line with those. Also will try the resistor across the pot to get my favorite range out of starve/synth pot.
Yeah, I gotta try the X Rock while the circuit's on the bready..... great idea about using some switches to flip between the two!!
I'll be tagging along on this thread for sure..... keep rocking!
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 29, 2014, 04:52:40 AM
yeah i think i'll have to switch between 2 Q2 sections to do it though...unless there is a more obvious solution that i'm overlooking...

or just make 2 pedals i guess.... :)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Will.mendil on April 29, 2014, 05:50:39 AM
These a pretty small circuits the easy way of doing it would be adding another 3pdt and put the two circuits in parallels wouldn't that work? It is indeed not the smart way but should work. If I can get the xfuzz working though :p hhoj
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 29, 2014, 07:03:15 AM
heres what i was thinking, use an spdt,

one half of the spdt switches input caps 4.7/10n'..

other half of spdt switches straight out of Q1, to the other Q2 section  at the same time...possible?..hmmmm....
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: duck_arse on April 29, 2014, 11:07:19 AM
I might be looking at the wrong things, but ....

wire the 1M and 3 leds as drawn. put the back to backs and the 220k on the collector, and the 1uF//220k junction on the switch N/O. common to the base, away you go. whether you switch the input caps or not is up to you and your switch.

if it don't work, "you ain't seen me, right?"
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 29, 2014, 11:36:33 AM
erm....i'm lost.. :)

diagram?..
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: duck_arse on April 29, 2014, 12:09:56 PM
(http://i.imgur.com/vsMeogX.png)

you'll need to squint and use your imagination for the bits not shown. everything on the switch is "lower, lesser, swamper" than the 1M and 3 leds, so should just over-ride them.

youse can only tries it.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 29, 2014, 12:22:34 PM
aha gotcha...ise will tries thems thens...
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: duck_arse on April 29, 2014, 12:27:01 PM
those "schems while youse waits" costs extra, by the way.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 29, 2014, 12:37:38 PM
 ok, how about a pot of orange sauce to go with your ducks arse?.. :D
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: bluesdevil on April 29, 2014, 04:43:27 PM
About switching to flip between versions, I think you can do it with a 3pdt toggle if you don't mind having hanging coupling caps and LED arrangements.
If having one end of a LED clipping section still connected to another is a problem, a 4pdt toggle switch would work. I luckily got both on hand, so I'll give a try and report back.
So I'm aiming to switch out the two different coupling caps and the two clipping sections (3 red LEDS in one direction and the other with a 1uf in line with back yellow LED pair + that 220k) at the same time.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: pappasmurfsharem on April 30, 2014, 01:01:34 AM
X ROCK.

pretty cool overdrive/dist...with just a tinker or 2 to the x fuzz...its pretty amazing what you can squeeze out of 2 trannies... :icon_twisted:

(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/XROCK.jpg)

quicky clip..

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/FUZZOVERDRIVE.mp3

edit: you can lose the 220k and 220pf too, and even lose 1 led, (the one with the negative to collector)..even smaller 8)


updated

(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/XROCK2.jpg)

The Always with me always with you tone here is actually really convincing. It's pretty much why I am going to build this. I assume you used a DI like your other recordings?
I really DIG that tone

1. What DI is this, or perhaps the better question is what are you doing to lose the High End sizzle when running direct?
2. So is the other red LED not needed?
3. Was that gain FULL up or was there some play in the "Pre-Gain" or guitar volume (specifically for that Satch-y tone)?
4. Why 500k Volume? That to simulate load of guitar to the next input?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on April 30, 2014, 04:30:46 AM
hi nick:

my DI is a behringer ULTRA D120.

i use that and go straight into my mixer channels XLR...

led: i suggest, like all my endlessly tinkering projects that you breadboard it up and tweak to taste, i was just seeing how little i could get away with.  ;D

gain: the gain was backed off on guitar IIRC..so theres a bit of room there.

500k: no particular reason i used that, ive tried 50k and its fine...very loud, too loud in fact compared to bypass , i'll probably end up sticking a taming resistor before the vol pot anyway..


edit: i remember now that i used 3 leds to raise the level, this was before i added the recovery stage,

edit 2: scrap the 1 led idea, it was too gatey even with the 1M in paralell....at least 2 leds were better.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: DDD on April 30, 2014, 08:17:10 AM
(http://i.imgur.com/vsMeogX.png)

you'll need to squint and use your imagination for the bits not shown. everything on the switch is "lower, lesser, swamper" than the 1M and 3 leds, so should just over-ride them.

youse can only tries it.
Switching will produce very loud pop sound.
1 Megaohm pot (as a variable resistor) instead of the switch is a good substitute I guess.
Also, you can omit 1MOhm constant resistor since Q2 will be biased via 1M pot in series with 220k resistor.
* It's necessary to use 1M pot just as a variable resistor with "upper" and "middle" pins connected together to avoid scratchy sounds while turning 1M knob.
** 1M pot can change fuzz/rock modes smoothly.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: pappasmurfsharem on April 30, 2014, 10:40:48 PM
hi nick:

my DI is a behringer ULTRA D120.

i use that and go straight into my mixer channels XLR...

led: i suggest, like all my endlessly tinkering projects that you breadboard it up and tweak to taste, i was just seeing how little i could get away with.  ;D

gain: the gain was backed off on guitar IIRC..so theres a bit of room there.

500k: no particular reason i used that, ive tried 50k and its fine...very loud, too loud in fact compared to bypass , i'll probably end up sticking a taming resistor before the vol pot anyway..


edit: i remember now that i used 3 leds to raise the level, this was before i added the recovery stage,

edit 2: scrap the 1 led idea, it was too gatey even with the 1M in paralell....at least 2 leds were better.

So was the first xrock schem the tone for that clip?

If so I THINK this is right.
(http://i.imgur.com/97REZ6g.png)
Title: X FUZZ
Post by: pappasmurfsharem on May 01, 2014, 08:42:26 PM

So was the first xrock schem the tone for that clip?

If so I THINK this is right.
(http://i.imgur.com/97REZ6g.png)

Ahh nope 1meg would need to be prior to pregain.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: nocentelli on May 02, 2014, 12:32:02 AM
Ahh nope 1meg would need to be prior to pregain.

I would have thought you could leave off the first 1 meg since the pre-gain pot is in parallel with it anyway.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: pappasmurfsharem on May 02, 2014, 01:46:05 AM
Ahh nope 1meg would need to be prior to pregain.

I would have thought you could leave off the first 1 meg since the pre-gain pot is in parallel with it anyway.

Could yeah.

Tried breading the first xrock scheme.

As someone pointed out before anti parallel LEDs doesn't help only 1 clips

It was definitely more fuzzy than the sound clip. Not a bad sound but it was definitely fuzz as opposed to distortion.. Which was mildly disheartening :(
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 02, 2014, 05:24:56 PM
@nick

yeah i stuck a SWTC after the clipping thats why it was fizzy...go with this.  8)

(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/XROCKDONE.jpg)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: pappasmurfsharem on May 02, 2014, 06:46:24 PM
@nick

yeah i stuck a SWTC after the clipping thats why it was fizzy...go with this.  8)

(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/XROCKDONE.jpg)

Why it WAS fizzy or WASN'T?

As in the First XROCK clip has the tone control on it?

Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 03, 2014, 04:29:54 AM
Thinking back i think it did, sorry.,....
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: pappasmurfsharem on May 03, 2014, 08:46:32 PM
Thinking back i think it did, sorry.,....

No apologies necessary sir. ;)

It wasn't so much fizzy when I breaded it. But it was definitely a "Gatey" fuzzstortion versus a distortion. I also used 2N5089s though since my bag of 88s mysteriously disappeared
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 04, 2014, 06:32:19 AM
it shouldn't be gatey at all, in fact i had a few mates over last night and they played through it (as above schematic) on breadboard

and it sounded f....... nice!, really cool heavy blues , hendrixy etc...  8)

have you got the leds the right way around ?.,. and the 1M in parallel...

the leds light as you play?..

Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: pappasmurfsharem on May 04, 2014, 12:53:20 PM
it shouldn't be gatey at all, in fact i had a few mates over last night and they played through it (as above schematic) on breadboard

and it sounded f....... nice!, really cool heavy blues , hendrixy etc...  8)

have you got the leds the right way around ?.,. and the 1M in parallel...

the leds light as you play?..

Only 1 led worked when in anti parallel in series both worked
1M definitely in parallel on the first stage maybe my 2n5089s where much higher gain.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 07, 2014, 08:31:46 AM
after messing around with the X ROCK again, ive settled with the last schemo above...its  a good all rounder. 8)

i had some interesting sounds with moving the 'starve' Q2 pot to the before the led diodes instead, and it was better volume matching wise to when full anti clockwise etc..

but really the sucky strainy synthy sounds were better where it was...so i'll stick with that.

as for switching between X ROCK /X FUZZ i think i'll just build them seperately in the end...

now i have the X ROCK sorted, i'll pop back to the XFUZZ and tweak that again....
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: pappasmurfsharem on May 12, 2014, 12:27:43 PM
after messing around with the X ROCK again, ive settled with the last schemo above...its  a good all rounder. 8)

i had some interesting sounds with moving the 'starve' Q2 pot to the before the led diodes instead, and it was better volume matching wise to when full anti clockwise etc..

but really the sucky strainy synthy sounds were better where it was...so i'll stick with that.

as for switching between X ROCK /X FUZZ i think i'll just build them seperately in the end...

now i have the X ROCK sorted, i'll pop back to the XFUZZ and tweak that again....


finally found my 2N5088s and breaded your last posted schem above minus the recovery stage after the SWTC. Definitely sounded like it should.

It sounded great through my fender combo.
Not so great through my mesa half-stack.

Through the halfstack it became fairly thin sounding, Up'd the input cap from 4N7 to 68N but it turned it into a decent sounding FUZZ. I'll need to play with it on the Breadboard some more.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 12, 2014, 12:39:19 PM
cool , glad your tinkering with it and getting better results.. :icon_cool:
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: pappasmurfsharem on May 12, 2014, 12:44:50 PM
cool , glad your tinkering with it and getting better results.. :icon_cool:

Yeah I need to try and find a happy medium to get good lowend on both my amps without the circuit getting into fuzz territory. I think it's just a result of the combo having perceivably more lowend than Mesa.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 12, 2014, 12:47:52 PM
yeah i hear ya, my marshall combo is quite fat sounding anyway...
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: pappasmurfsharem on May 12, 2014, 01:03:51 PM
yeah i hear ya, my marshall combo is quite fat sounding anyway...

I wonder if 68N is just to much I'll have to try and slap in various values.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 21, 2014, 09:50:14 AM
i decided to do a full demo of the 'X ROCK' FUZZ..its really quite versatile... 8)

tweaking the Q2 pot..

guitar-breadboard-DI box-mixer.






Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: rutabaga bob on May 21, 2014, 02:30:47 PM
Rob...amazing, as always!
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: kingswayguitar on May 22, 2014, 02:32:33 AM
yeah baby

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/4/42/Mike-Myers-Austin-Powers-1-.jpg)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Elijah-Baley on May 22, 2014, 05:01:28 AM
i decided to do a full demo of the 'X ROCK' FUZZ..its really quite versatile... 8)

Forgive me my dear friend  :icon_neutral: .

What is the schematic you used in this video? (xfuzzdone or xrockdone)?

Thanks  8)

There's nothing to say... It sounds really good!

 :icon_smile:
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 22, 2014, 05:25:23 AM


(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/XROCKDONE.jpg)

hi elijah, yep, this one... 8)

cheers guys, \m/   :icon_twisted:  \m/

stick it on ya breadboard, its screaming out for a nice tone stack really, but i found the SWTC is nice anyway... 8)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: bool on May 22, 2014, 06:15:09 AM
If you are looking to get more tonal control, you can quickly mod your swtc with additon of two caps.. in place of the C5, solder a 10n cap. The removed 4n7 cap should be soldered across the lugs 1-3 of the pot, and add a 1n cap (or something smaller for more treble) between lug3 and ground. Easily added "mid-shift" control with pot-position extremes similar to a standard swtc.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 22, 2014, 06:23:11 AM
cheers bool, i'll give that a go...

i'm still on breadboard.  8)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: axemurderforhire on May 22, 2014, 10:04:18 AM
i decided to do a full demo of the 'X ROCK' FUZZ..its really quite versatile... 8)

tweaking the Q2 pot..

guitar-breadboard-DI box-mixer.








Where do you get such wonderful toys, this sounds amazing
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 22, 2014, 11:04:32 AM
From the wonders of the breadboard... :icon_wink:

 8)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: seedlings on May 22, 2014, 11:49:29 AM
[X] Like
[_] Dislike

The 'half wah' honk/bite is lovely - play it for days.

CHAD
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 22, 2014, 02:19:51 PM
yeah it really rips with a crybaby in front of it... :icon_twisted:

 8)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Jdansti on May 22, 2014, 06:30:14 PM
Pretty dang awesome!   8)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: vigilante397 on May 22, 2014, 06:41:32 PM
This may very well become my new go-to fuzz.

'Quick Robin, to the breadboard!'
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Tony Forestiere on May 22, 2014, 07:14:45 PM
Pretty dang awesome!   8)

Naw. It's just the magic in Rob's fingers!  :o
Really does sound very nice. Thanks DA.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: blackieNYC on May 22, 2014, 07:53:15 PM
With your only gain control at the input, how is the white noise when you clean it up by attenuating at the 480k pot?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on May 22, 2014, 09:09:02 PM
I have this thing on breadboard right now and it's very quiet. I'm loving it so far.  I also built the x fuzz and x rock clipper sections and put them on a switch it works fine and have not noticed any popping.  It switches nicely. If you want try it put everything on the collector side from both clipper sections and leave the cap across collector to base.  Now switch the legs from the clipper sections to base using a spdt.
 I am also playing around with different final stages. I have an srpp after the clipper and the original bjt stage. I am switching between them. So far I like both. The original has nice fizzy texture and the srpp is a more rounded sound but slightly fuller tone.  I have some scope shots if anyone cares.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 23, 2014, 03:18:52 AM
^ cool.  glad your trying/experimenting with it man.. 8)

and incorporated both sections too..nice.

soundclips are better..(no scope here)  ;)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: seedlings on May 23, 2014, 08:49:53 AM

soundclips are better..(no scope here)  ;)

Because then you have two things do dial in.  Sound and wave form...  :icon_rolleyes:  And I've done this.  The scope also has me chase problems that aren't there.  But, in it's defense, it has tracked down noise very well.

CHAD
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: duck_arse on May 23, 2014, 09:07:34 AM
whiskey mighta come up with the "crossfire fuzz"?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on May 23, 2014, 09:23:06 AM
I am a total newbie with the scope.  I have made it a point to scope the effects while I'm building so I can see what is happening with th changes.  I just like the pretty lines  8).  What I see is the bjt amp at the end is basically carbon copy of the sound it was feed.  The srpp actually it's a mu-valve is doing some neat sandpapering / compression of the all the spiky bits.  It's not better it's just different. I will post a schematic when I get home from work of any body cares to play with it.  I'm still fiddling with a tone stack in Duncan tone stack. I didn't say it before but thanks for the stuff you guys do.  I've been a lurker for 6 months and finally decided to join.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 23, 2014, 09:29:59 AM
welcome whiskey...

always cool to have others join in man.. 8)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on May 23, 2014, 10:00:40 AM
Forgot to mention that I played with voltage sag and it will run happily all the way down to 3v. It actually doesn't just stop working it just gets quieter as you crank it down.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: bool on May 23, 2014, 10:30:03 AM
If you just want slightly more "round" but still a bit nasty, easiest mod would be to change the output stage to a mosfet - with only a slight rebias needed. I.e. change the R6 to something like 240-270k (or use a trimpot), R8 to 4k7 and R9 to 1k5 - which should be generally valid for the likes of BS170 or 2N7000.

Note that I didn't test that in this particular fuzz, but I see no reason why it wouldn't work ... I used such a generic mosfet stage elsewhere and it's pretty trivial to get it to work.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: karbomusic on May 23, 2014, 01:37:27 PM
Kudos!

 Just threw this on the breadboard (X ROCK) and it sounds just like DA's video except... it has horrible white noise that is very loud. If I remove the bias pot and send it a separate ref voltage instead, it fixes that but I lose all that killer synthy gain sound as per the video. It sounds great but more like a regular distortion instead of the killer sound I like about this circuit. Just wondering what I might have mucked up or if have a mis-valued resistor somewhere.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on May 23, 2014, 07:17:03 PM
It is very quiet on my breadboard.  I was surprised because this thing and some gain.  Take it all off your board and move over a few rows and rebuild it.  the process of moving and reconnecting sometimes you can see your error or correct a loose connection on your board that was impossible to find. 
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: DDD on May 24, 2014, 02:20:09 AM
Kudos!

 Just threw this on the breadboard (X ROCK) and it sounds just like DA's video except... it has horrible white noise that is very loud. If I remove the bias pot and send it a separate ref voltage instead, it fixes that but I lose all that killer synthy gain sound as per the video. It sounds great but more like a regular distortion instead of the killer sound I like about this circuit. Just wondering what I might have mucked up or if have a mis-valued resistor somewhere.
Maybe the pot is "noisy" because of the poor or worn sliding contact.
Connecting "middle" and "lower" pot terminals together can fix the problem at all or partially. If the problem remains, just take another pot and don't forget to connect "middle" and "lower" terminals.
Also, the RF oscillations can cause the same audible effect. Just shunt the pot terminals with 20-50-100 pF capacitor and listen for the noise change.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Elijah-Baley on May 24, 2014, 07:34:21 AM
Reading this topic maybe I could need of a breadboard.
It's just this: http://www.taydaelectronics.com/830-point-solder-less-plug-in-breadboard.html (http://www.taydaelectronics.com/830-point-solder-less-plug-in-breadboard.html)? Or I need somthing else?
Seems pretty tiny... There's risk pay further taxes for shipping?

For a few electronic components (capacitor, resistor, connector, knobs... and no enclosure) I pay no taxes. 9,17 $ including shipping.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: karbomusic on May 24, 2014, 08:43:59 AM

Maybe the pot is "noisy" because of the poor or worn sliding contact.
Connecting "middle" and "lower" pot terminals together can fix the problem at all or partially. If the problem remains, just take another pot and don't forget to connect "middle" and "lower" terminals.
Also, the RF oscillations can cause the same audible effect. Just shunt the pot terminals with 20-50-100 pF capacitor and listen for the noise change.


I tried a couple pots, it seems to be resistance related like the noise you would get with too much resistance. However, I'll be looking at it again in the next couple hours. Hopefully, I'll find the problem because the moment I do, I'm going to create a layout and this puppy is going a box then onto the pedal board.  :icon_lol:
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: pappasmurfsharem on May 24, 2014, 11:07:06 AM
Reading this topic maybe I could need of a breadboard.
It's just this: http://www.taydaelectronics.com/830-point-solder-less-plug-in-breadboard.html (http://www.taydaelectronics.com/830-point-solder-less-plug-in-breadboard.html)? Or I need somthing else?
Seems pretty tiny... There's risk pay further taxes for shipping?

For a few electronic components (capacitor, resistor, connector, knobs... and no enclosure) I pay no taxes. 9,17 $ including shipping.

I think this is the breadboard I first bought. That or the one from mammoth electronics. It was near impossible to put wire leads in he holes and they always bent.

I'd say spend a little extra and get one of the WISH brand boards from small bear. The boards look the same but it's much easier to place jumpers in all the ones that didn't work on my cheaper board slide right in and stay where I want them.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 24, 2014, 11:47:04 AM
+1 cheap breadboards are nasty...

invest in a good one, you won't regret it.  ;)

and make it true bypass. ;)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: duck_arse on May 24, 2014, 11:49:27 AM
Reading this topic maybe I could need of a breadboard.

can I vote this for "understatement of the week"? elijah, you needs to gets yourself a breadboard, for ANY thread. even a cheap crappy one like tayda (with the mid-long rail splits) will open up a whole new world of possibillities. and if you can afford to get a couple, well, there will be no stopping you.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Elijah-Baley on May 24, 2014, 12:02:50 PM
I'm from Italy. There's risk further delivery taxes. About smallbear I don't know how much will cost a buying of a breadboard to get in Italy.

On musikding there's a different model.  :-\ http://www.musikding.de/Breadboard-640 (http://www.musikding.de/Breadboard-640).

So, maybe this? Pretty similar to tayda's one: http://www.banzaimusic.com/Breadboard-EXB-830.html (http://www.banzaimusic.com/Breadboard-EXB-830.html). But more expensive.
Else I have to spend more and more and more  :) : http://www.banzaimusic.com/Breadboard-EXB-1380.html (http://www.banzaimusic.com/Breadboard-EXB-1380.html).

Of course there are some expensive and better models. I have understand how work everyone of that.

PS Someone, perhaps, had suggested me to buy a breadboard (in another topic). But this is my first time I ask about breadboard.
 ;)

Thanks!
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 24, 2014, 12:20:19 PM
armando is in italy ''arma61''

he may be able to direct you to get one from italy...pm him, he's a cool guy.   ;D ;)

http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?action=profile;u=8859

hope you don't mind armando.. ;)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on May 25, 2014, 09:54:20 AM
Rob have you worked on a tone control?  I was playing around with this last night and have something that works but I noticed that bias knob will affect the tone settings.  I'm not an expert so please correct me if I'm wrong. It seems that the common emitter clipping stage is medium impedance and that impedance will vary with the bias setting.  So if you set it and then dial in a tone any changes to the bias will shift your filter points.  I'm using a big muff pi style filter but with a different profile.  In the BMP the clipping stage that feeds it stays at the same bias point so the impedance is more or less fixed.  I could put an emitter follower after the clipping stage or move the tone to the very end right before the volume or I could leave it as is  ;)  I'm liking it so far just wished I could dial the bias around without having to readjust the tone.  Does this occur with the SWTC? 
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: simplefx on May 25, 2014, 09:41:54 PM
I love the way you play a guitar DA. Nice really nice. And your EFX are very cool also. i have built your latest fuzz fx and wow is all i can say at the moment.

ttyl
Gday
Vince  ;)

i decided to do a full demo of the 'X ROCK' FUZZ..its really quite versatile... 8)

tweaking the Q2 pot..

guitar-breadboard-DI box-mixer.







Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on May 26, 2014, 07:08:06 AM
Using an emitter follower before the tone control does remove the interaction of the bias knob. It works as expected now with the noted exception that the splatty synthy kinda sounds aren't as noticeable now when dialed back.  :icon_cry: Ill post a schematic in a few days when I get some free time. 
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 27, 2014, 03:08:28 AM
I'm liking it so far just wished I could dial the bias around without having to readjust the tone.  Does this occur with the SWTC? 

the SWTC has enough top end when using the synthy side of it, thats why i kept it simple and stuck with it really,

it caters well for both synthy and rocky too..

also as you bias to synthy it does go quieter, but there is plenty enough vol on this thing to adjust for that too...

i have a really bad cold/cough at the mo, its really pissing me off as i can't sleep or get on with stuff without going hot/cold and sneezing/coughing,
just got to ride it out...i @#$%ing hate feeling ill. :icon_evil:


Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on May 27, 2014, 04:00:56 AM
I'll go back and try it out see what happens. I am also fighting a cold.  Stay strong and get well soon.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: bluebunny on May 27, 2014, 04:04:53 AM
i @#$%ing hate feeling ill. :icon_evil:

You need medication, mate.

(http://www.scottishwhiskystore.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/Famous-Grouse-Bar-Bottle.jpg)       (Medical advice c/o Dr. Bunny)

Edit: both of you!
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 27, 2014, 06:15:32 AM
^ tried that...usually works, but this is a biggun.. :(
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Jdansti on May 27, 2014, 07:10:53 AM
Sorry for going OT on ya, but in the best interest of the X Fuzz...  ;D

I keep these in my medicine cabinet to reduce symptoms while getting over a cold. I take the individual drugs rather than the shotgun approach to tailor the remedy to the actual symptoms.

Diphenhydramine (Benadryl) for runny nose. (Don't take if you have glaucoma).  :icon_cool:
Pseudo ephedrine (Sudafed) for nasal congestion. (Don't take if you have trouble peeing).  :o
Guaifenesin (Mucinex) for chest congestion. (Drink lots of water with this).
Dextromethorphan (Delsym) to reduce cough.

All of the above can be taken simultaneously. Read the precautions before taking.

To help sleep, take NyQuil, but watch out for duplicate drugs contained in other meds and avoid alcohol. This one has potent sedatives and hypnotics.  :icon_twisted:  I haven't ever taken this but just mention it because you have trouble sleeping.

You probably have your own remedies, but just thought I'd mention what works for me. Remember, I'm not a doctor, I just play one on TV. ;)

Oh, while you're at it, stop smoking!  (Easier said than done. :( ).

Ok, enough mommy talk. I tend to ramble when I'm not completely awake yet.  ;D
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: bluebunny on May 27, 2014, 07:33:27 AM
@John: where in your treatment regime does the Grouse fit?   :icon_twisted:
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on May 27, 2014, 08:14:20 AM
Rob I think we have the same crud.  Cough , congestion, sore throat, nasal problems , fever , chills,etc.  luckily I have to work a twelve hour shift so it's all good  :-[  I am gonna lay down with a bottle of whiskey and see if I can scare it away.  The OTC stuff didn't phase it.
Now back to the fuzz.  I played around some and actually wired some switches so I could play and test.  It's fairly decent.  I will post schematic in a few minutes if I can figure out how to do it. I'm sure there are some horrible problems with this just waiting for someone to point out ;)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on May 27, 2014, 08:35:31 AM
(http://i.imgur.com/fbh4JeX.png)

So what i have here is both the x-rock and x-fuzz clipper sections combined and they are selectable. followed by the emitter folower to buffer the tone control so it doesn't get loaded by the clipper stage. The tone control is an AMZ style BMP with the values I got from playing around in Duncan Tonestack Calculator. Following the tone control is two different output sections that are selectable. It would probably be good practice to tie those input high or low when the switch is flipped using a 3pdt. I haven't done that yet. Seems to work fine as it is.  I don't have sound clips right now but you are welcome to breadboard it and test if you want to. This will fit on a small breadboard. I am going to take a long rest before work so i will respond to any questions later tonight.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 27, 2014, 12:55:26 PM
@ Dr john: man are you a chemist?... i just got some dequitin tablets and they seem to have stopped my hacking sleepless coughing...for now

and the parecetamol seems to have slowed down the chills and sweats too...hopefully i'll feel better tomorrow.. ::)

cheers man,


@whiskey: man that's a lot more bits..

just a few notes:

i'm using a 4.7n at input, (xrock)...

love the clipping switching..nice n easy addition. 8) i'll have to experiment with that too.

on the XFUZZ i had a 470n from Q1 collector IIRC, then the clipping stage...


Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Jdansti on May 27, 2014, 01:22:10 PM
>@ Dr john: man are you a chemist?... i just got some dequitin tablets and they seem to have stopped my hacking sleepless coughing...for now.

If you mean what we in the US call a pharmacist, no. I've just studied which OTCs relieve which symptoms and only take what I need for the symptoms rather than taking shotgun drugs that contain several ingredients, some if which I might not need.

I couldn't find dequitin on the web, so I don't know what's in it. Paracetamol is what we call acetaminophen. You have to be careful to not take more than the listed dosage and avoid alcohol while taking it. :(  Mixing the two increases your chance of kidney disease.

Glad you've got some relief.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on May 27, 2014, 06:58:03 PM
Yes it is more bits.  Pick any parts you want or none.  ;) I was just sharing what I had tweaked out on the breadboard.  The caps are different but I I like those better on my rig.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 27, 2014, 07:10:13 PM
cool,  its all good man... 8)

i'm messing with a tremmy filter thing at the mo too (as a seperate effect)  but goes nice with it too.. 8)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on May 27, 2014, 08:11:37 PM
I tried an experiment while I was playing around with this.  Take a ldr and strap it across the collector and base in parallel with the 1 meg on the first stage.  Now pulse you a light on it.   I was getting a vox repeater type effect.  I'm sure with the right lfo and everything setup right it could be a nice effect. 
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 27, 2014, 08:15:44 PM
ha ha thats what i like to see, experimentalness...

i'm currently working on this too...too many projects at the same time to keep track.. ::)

http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=107197.new#new
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on May 27, 2014, 08:39:15 PM
Oh lord another project to suck me in.  I am building your abductor delay right now.  That is the effect that forced me to join here. I watch your videos on YouTube and was following that project for last few months.  I just need that damn 2meg pot and I'm ready.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: PRR on May 27, 2014, 10:06:03 PM
> I couldn't find dequitin on the web

I'm suspecting he mis-typed "Dequadin":
http://www.nhs.uk/medicine-guides/pages/MedicineOverview.aspx?medicine=Dequadin

Antiseptic lozenges.

Dequalinium, a topical bacteriostat:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dequalinium
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/d3/Dequalinium_chloride.png/200px-Dequalinium_chloride.png)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Jdansti on May 28, 2014, 02:49:50 AM
Aha! That's a new one for me. Thanks.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 28, 2014, 05:14:11 AM
@PRR:

yep dats da wud... ;D


Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Darksid on May 28, 2014, 07:13:09 AM
Collected from the first skhemy.Sound satisfied/MyTest  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oleBFVCqE5M
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 28, 2014, 07:22:27 AM
ahhhh thats you...i wondered who that was on my youtube ..hi darksid ;D

cool, sounds quite chunky ,

i was twiddling with my mixer settings and the Xrock and found it can get in the realms of heavy chunky riff stuff with the right eq...

my mixer has a nice mid section, 2 controls, mid and sweep...i'd like to nail that as an eq in a pedal for sure... :icon_twisted:

but for now i think i'll keep the xrock as is...i'm pretty happy with it. it must be, its been on the bread for months now... ::)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Darksid on May 28, 2014, 07:42:53 AM
Deadastronaut Hi, Yes I have just added a TON there prvda differently http://vk.com/vas67?z=photo176059711_326061425%2Fphotos176059711
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on May 28, 2014, 10:46:56 AM
Alright Rob I replaced the 1uf Between the stages and put in the 470nf and I get synthy notes again when I dial the bias back. Hey! Cool.  Ok I'm still not completely satisfied with it but it's getting better.  Seems like there is less separation between the clipping types now.  Maybe I'm just fuzz blind after a/b testing for an hour.  I'm calling it quits for now and will fiddle more with fresh ears later.  If you get a chance try that second output stage I posted and see what you think.  It's is not the same and has its own character. Your mileage may vary ;)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: haveyouseenhim on May 29, 2014, 09:01:50 PM
Would someone look this layout over and see if I made any mistakes?  Nevermind the component numbers vs the schematic. Just the values.
The gain is bottom left, tone is bottom right, the volume is top right, and the bias is the two pads just left of Q3

(http://i1267.photobucket.com/albums/jj545/haveyouseenhim/UnverifiedX-FUZZlayout_zpsb7d20c42.gif) (http://s1267.photobucket.com/user/haveyouseenhim/media/UnverifiedX-FUZZlayout_zpsb7d20c42.gif.html)

(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/XROCKDONE.jpg)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 29, 2014, 09:13:14 PM
no 470k R6. ;)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: haveyouseenhim on May 29, 2014, 09:20:38 PM
no 470k R6. ;)

Awesome. Is that all?  I was able to add a semi standing resistor to the layout. I can't update the post at the moment but I got it in there.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 29, 2014, 09:33:08 PM
yep looks ok apart from that.. 8)

you might want to use  250k pot for bias.. ;) thats what i have on the vid. (my mistake.  ::))
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Darksid on May 30, 2014, 05:40:42 AM
haveiouseenhim and what happened transistor D3,?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on May 30, 2014, 06:13:37 AM
Transistors are marked as Q and diodes are marked as D.  This is the new schematic it only has 2 diodes not 3 like the original.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 30, 2014, 06:25:14 AM
yep, 3 leds were there just to  lift it, before i addded the recovery stage...
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 30, 2014, 07:56:39 AM
@mike: where is Q2's 10k?...R5..
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: haveyouseenhim on May 30, 2014, 08:09:23 AM
@mike: where is Q2's 10k?...R5..

R4 on my layout.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 30, 2014, 08:16:28 AM
ahh gotcha....need more coffee.  ;)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Darksid on May 30, 2014, 08:38:05 AM
Mike I have my layout I have done differently.
http://files.mail.ru/2ACDFD5C23484C7DBADDFC40CDBACE7E
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: vigilante397 on May 30, 2014, 11:25:29 AM
Mike I have my layout I have done differently.
http://files.mail.ru/2ACDFD5C23484C7DBADDFC40CDBACE7E

спасибо :) она хорошо выглядит!

Do you have one with just the transfer?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on May 30, 2014, 11:28:39 AM
Darksid that looks nice. Good job.  Post one without the components.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Mario44 on May 30, 2014, 12:13:47 PM
Hey guys
I'm using 2n3904 transistors in xfuzz, but I can't obtain that cool synthy sound. Is it possible that it's transistors fault or I took wrong schem?
Took the blue one from page 6.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: pappasmurfsharem on May 30, 2014, 02:52:25 PM
Hey guys
I'm using 2n3904 transistors in xfuzz, but I can't obtain that cool synthy sound. Is it possible that it's transistors fault or I took wrong schem?
Took the blue one from page 6.


WHen I first breadboarded I tried 2n5089s instead of 5088s and it was really fuzzy so transistors might matter a bit. HfE values and all that jazz
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Darksid on May 31, 2014, 04:16:01 AM
Instead try 2n5088 transistors KT3102Em with them works well too Tolko need them to turn 180 degrees to the other-pinout. http://my.mail.ru/inbox/20vasiliy/photo/_myphoto/151.html
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Mario44 on May 31, 2014, 11:43:46 AM
What should be minimum hfe for this circuit?
The easiest transistors to get for me would be BC.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: seedlings on May 31, 2014, 11:49:16 AM
What keeps the noise floor down on these XFuzz circuits?  With all that gain, they're dang quiet.

CHAD
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 31, 2014, 11:58:19 AM
^ no idea on that...but yeah pretty damn good for hi gainers...massive volume out too... 8)

@mario: mine are both around 300 hfe..5088's
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: duck_arse on May 31, 2014, 12:37:48 PM
mario - the bc548B or the bc549B will be just about right for hfe of 300. the bc54xC will be more like the 2n5089.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 31, 2014, 01:49:29 PM
to those that have built (boxed ) this



whats it like 'pop' on/off  wise?...just curious . i haven't built it myself yet  ::)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Mario44 on May 31, 2014, 02:09:41 PM
Just found 3 old BC109. Two of them have 300 and one has 350 hfe. Just put them in, they seem to be more noisy than 3904's, but still there is no synthy sound. Bias pot does its job and nothing else, no magic.
DA: To clarify the matter, which schematic did you use when you were recording demo?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 31, 2014, 02:16:27 PM

(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/XROCKDONE.jpg)

@mario this one...

try to get some 5088's they are always handy anyway,  your 3904 will be fine for Q3 though..
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on May 31, 2014, 03:27:47 PM
I have not boxed it yet but my test rig doesn't pop at all when I hit the stomp. I have a Beavis board kinda thing.  I'll let you know when I get it all finish if there are issues. 

Quick question does the x rock use red LEDs and the x fuzz use yellow?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 31, 2014, 03:43:24 PM
cheers whiskey,  thats good to know, my breadboard (truebypassed)  pops, hmmm...

yep red leds for xrock..
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on May 31, 2014, 04:05:05 PM
Rob I went back and changed the LEDs and noticed that it does have a pop. I apologize for the misinformation. I had my amp down low and didn't hear it. It's isn't a loop pop but it is there.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Mario44 on May 31, 2014, 04:17:01 PM
DA: thanks!
I'm gonna test it soon  ;)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 31, 2014, 04:53:00 PM
@whiskey:

hmmmm... whenever ive used 'tonepad wiring 5' for the 3pdt  ive never had a pop, ...

i take all grounds to input jack...


could you clip a 1M across your input jack just to test it... :icon_idea:

Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on May 31, 2014, 05:06:26 PM
I will do as soon as I get back home.  I left right after I posted. 
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on May 31, 2014, 05:21:23 PM
okey dokey... 8)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on May 31, 2014, 09:29:34 PM
Ok so I went in and added the resistor and it did not help. When I took it out again I noticed no pop again. I had moved a few wires around changing the LEDs before and then again when I fiddled with the resistor.  I cranked the amp up to ear bleed levels and clicked it over and over. You can hear a faint pop, but at that level it still nothing serious.  So i had not noticed pop, changed led and them did notice it , added resistor and it got worse, took it out and it is back to not noticeable.  What I think is happening is just layout related.  I will be boxing it this weekend and will report back any troubles. 
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Mario44 on June 04, 2014, 04:14:59 AM
Just recived a bunch of 2N5088's from postman. HFE is about 435, pluged them into breadboard and the result is still the same, no synth.
Any ideas?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on June 04, 2014, 04:36:38 AM
you have the 10k from 9v going tp a 250k pot lug 3, then lug 2 to collector?..

leds light up?

Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Mario44 on June 04, 2014, 04:54:45 AM
I have 470k trim pot there with 10k resistor, LED light nicely
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on June 04, 2014, 04:58:22 AM
hmmm... 4.7nf - 10nf from pregain lug 2?..
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Mario44 on June 04, 2014, 05:06:08 AM
4,7nf
on both 4,7 and 10 had the same
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on June 04, 2014, 05:14:46 AM
so the bias pot changes nothing at all??..weird. ???
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Mario44 on June 04, 2014, 05:17:14 AM
It makes the sound choke and leds stop lighting when I play but nothing else
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on June 04, 2014, 05:26:17 AM
try adjusting the value of the 10k that goes to the 470k pot..

i just tried a 100k as an extreme  and it definately gets synthy....
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Mario44 on June 04, 2014, 05:44:16 AM
100k resistor makes more difference but it's still not the same as on the video, no synth
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Mario44 on June 05, 2014, 01:25:18 AM
Couldn't sleep and just had a thought. What type of capacitors did you use in your xfuzz?
Maybe I can't get no synthy because I'm using ceramic ones
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Mario44 on June 06, 2014, 04:31:08 AM
All right
Got checked the voltages and there was a faulty wire comming from Q2 emitter to ground.
Now this fuzz seems to have more synth than before. Thanks for helping.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on June 06, 2014, 04:33:28 AM
brilliant...glad you got it going.  8)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: haveyouseenhim on June 06, 2014, 04:58:49 AM
Good to hear, Mario. I'm populating my PCB now. Hopefully it will fire up first go. *fingers crossed and satanic prayers chanted* :icon_twisted: :icon_mrgreen:
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on June 06, 2014, 05:10:12 AM
nice one mike, let us know if it pops.. :)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: axemurderforhire on June 07, 2014, 05:05:11 PM
Just built the X ROCK today and holy crap its loud. :icon_biggrin:

I used the schematic on page to but had to replace the first pot (1m) with a 500k cause it was all i have  and used mpsa18's in Q1 and Q2. I just need to swap out the L.E.D as the one i put in to it was damaged and i had to jimmy a connection to another one and if that wasn't bad enough my battery was going down ,Just scrapping 7volts of power but even at that it sounds like a beast.

I have to say Rob you make some of the most fun and easy builds here. Which is good for me cause i end up nearly burning the house down and the wife keeps saying she'll send you guys the bill for a new kitchen table cause i keep leaving the iron on it HA HA. But this is my second working build after the beginner project and your very own "Spitfire" that i have been able to get work. So im chuffed as chips and think a pint or two is in order  :icon_wink: And while im on the high stool ill drink to your health and your next project ha ha
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on June 07, 2014, 06:01:24 PM
Cool, ill have a beer tioo...

yep it is loud, could do with a resistor before the vol pot to keep it tamed....or not... :icon_cool:
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: haveyouseenhim on June 07, 2014, 09:33:07 PM
I finally got the pcb built. So far it's a nice fuzz. Just no synthy sounds. I tried changing the bias pot to 1M and it doesnt help. I may just try some different transistors or just deal with no synth. The fuzz alone is great.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on June 08, 2014, 04:49:50 AM
Hmmm that's a shame, my hfe are around 300 on Q1/Q2...if that. Helps, hows the switch pop btw?

@mario, could you post. My. Voltages for mike that i pm,d you....im not at home today...cheers.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Mario44 on June 08, 2014, 08:31:33 AM
I have cleaned up my message box  :icon_redface:
Got it a paper sheet, but I tore it up aswell when I was cleaning my room :D
Look like the measurings are more or less, @da you can confirm if this is right
Q1
C 2,05
B 0,62
E 0

Q2(not sure about C and B)
C 1,9 with 10k coming from v+
B 0,62
E 0

Q3
C 6,05
B 1,48
E 0,91

My problem was I got no synthy because Q2 didn't have good conection from emitter to ground and voltages appeared to be close to 9V
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on June 08, 2014, 10:12:05 AM
I've noticed I get good synth sounds through my headphones and an amp on very low with almost no sound when clean. When it's cranked it is less obvious. Have you cranked this up on a hot amp Rob?  Did you hear a difference?  I have built this three times on breadboard with and without mods.  I also used components from different suppliers.  Either way it still an awesome fuzz. 
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Mario44 on June 08, 2014, 10:34:08 AM
Btw
I've checked this fuzz on 9V battery and already another 7V battery.
Synth became more synthy with lower voltage, but more stutter aswell.
IDK how about 12V and more
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: haveyouseenhim on June 08, 2014, 10:58:09 PM
Hmmm that's a shame, my hfe are around 300 on Q1/Q2...if that. Helps, hows the switch pop btw?

@mario, could you post. My. Voltages for mike that i pm,d you....im not at home today...cheers.

I don't know about pop yet because I have the in and out jacks directly wired.  I'll throw a 3pdt on it later and check. I added a spot on my layout for a pulldown resistor just in case.

I tested my hfe and they are both right at 308.

I'll check voltages later.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: haveyouseenhim on June 09, 2014, 11:03:29 PM
Battery 9.47

Q1
C 2.77
B 0.61
E 0

Q2                             
C 2.78      With 250k bias pot     0.67
B 0.61      With 250k bias pot     0.537
E 0

Q3
C 8.3
B 0.78
E 227 mV
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: karbomusic on June 12, 2014, 11:19:20 PM
Kudos!

 Just threw this on the breadboard (X ROCK) and it sounds just like DA's video except... it has horrible white noise that is very loud...

OK, C8 (220pF) is the source of all the noise. What does that little fella do in this circuit (be gentle).  :icon_biggrin:
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Lurco on June 13, 2014, 01:34:45 AM
C8 creates a pulsating DC ripple voltage, because the LEDs between collector and base are orientated only oneway, like in a power supply rectification, as opposed to a bilateral diode configuration as usual in those kind of fuzz stages?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on June 13, 2014, 07:11:05 AM
UPDATE: made a few last minute tweaks before i finally build mine,

added a 1M pulldown just for good measure, ::) (but i'm sure with the 'tonepad wiring 5' scheme it'l be fine anyway)..

i now have a 22k from gain pot lug 1 to ground...this gives a warmer/thicker tone at minimum gain.  (much better imo)

put a 220k before the last 100nf,  and used a 100k vol pot to tme excessive output,.... it works out about right for max vol, and still enough there to make the vol up on synthy settings..

going to stick a 4.7n/10nf switch from gain pot 2 ..10n gives a nice fat but creamy sustain...4.7n gives a nice bite.. 8)

as for hiss, while i'm still on BB ive been messing with sticking a cap to ground fom the Q2C...1n/2.2n...cuts off the very top hiss, but doesn't affect the tone hardly...

been playing through my marshall (clean channel) and sounds very cool....especially drop D etc... :icon_twisted:

open to opinions on hiss taming?..tried bigger caps on the C/B's but loses the magic somewhat...

anyway................

i did notice a big difference in less noise with using the leds bilateraly (as usual) but the clean up on guitar wasn't as responsive....hmmmmm

Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: bluebunny on June 13, 2014, 07:54:30 AM
open to opinions on hiss taming?

Yeah, stick one of these in each ear.   :icon_twisted:

(http://www.comfortablyhungry.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/Sausage-on-a-Fork-300x271.jpg)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on June 13, 2014, 08:05:18 AM
i tried that, but i keep getting crows attacking my head,,, :'(


been trying the bilateral leds with a 680k across them, pretty good, cleans up nicely too and the synthy is still very much there too....

so i may actually go with this myself...all other parts the same as my last post.. ;)

seems quieter anyway... 8)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: karbomusic on June 13, 2014, 08:22:38 AM
i tried that, but i keep getting crows attacking my head,,, :'(


been trying the bilateral leds with a 680k across them, pretty good, cleans up nicely too and the synthy is still very much there too....

so i may actually go with this myself...all other parts the same as my last post.. ;)

seems quieter anyway... 8)

Might try that. The hiss I mentioned is coming from that part of the circuit and that is the cap (the one by the LEDs) I removed as a test that drastically reduced it.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on June 13, 2014, 08:36:31 AM
weird...it should reduce it.. ???
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: karbomusic on June 13, 2014, 09:04:03 AM
weird...it should reduce it.. ???

Yea, I tried several cap types last night, same issue. To be clear, I'd expect a good amount of hiss for this much gain but its unbearable and beyond what I'd expect and more than I could stand for a live gig so I have to do something to calm it. I didn't notice a huge sonic difference by removing that cap (other than the hiss being much reduced) other than when I used larger and larger values it started shaving off high end. Not knowing it's true purpose I'm assuming it needs to be there (oh wait you said should reduce it)? Without that cap, the hiss that remains is exactly what I would expect with that type circuit.

Just to add, this unexpected hiss gets worse as either the gain or guitar pot hits zero. It's bad already but once it goes to zero, there is that little extra few dB of hiss that I noticed. I may record it if anyone is interested. I want to build this baby, but need to make sure I understand this piece first.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on June 13, 2014, 09:56:00 AM
Rob I have built my PCB layout to verify it and I here is what I have noticed. The synth is much more pronounced now.  The bias knob goes from splat to synth to overdrive.  The clipper switch I posted really makes a very subtle change.  It isn't as dramatic as I wanted.  I went back and started playing with the caps and decided the major sound changes between the xrock and XFuzz is in the caps at the input and after the first stage.  I have worked out a switching arrangement so the caps and the diodes can be switched with a 3pdt. I will post an update when I get off work.  I mention this because you stated you wanted to switch your caps.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on June 15, 2014, 01:18:54 AM
(http://i.imgur.com/8gvSoyo.png)

You can use three individual switches or just one 3pdt to switch between the XROCK and XFUZZ settings. Separate switches will give you more variety. You can safely ignore the rest of the schematic if you don't want to build the extra buffer, tone stack and dual output section.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: monksanto on June 15, 2014, 05:10:15 AM
Wow thanks WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt! This is a really gnarly fuzz!
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on June 15, 2014, 05:14:35 AM
Nice one whiskey, hows the noise/hiss?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: karbomusic on June 15, 2014, 09:52:09 AM
Nice one whiskey, hows the noise/hiss?

I wanted to follow up. On hunch and following the most logical idea that made the most sense, I assumed the hiss must be a product of the breadboarding etc. So... I did a quick 20x12 vero layout yesterday and formally soldered it up. Hiss gone and this thing sounds absolutely fabulous.  ;D She's going in a 1590B in the next few hours!

(http://wallsonic.com/public/posts/spacefuzz.png)

There may be a tiny mod there or so such as a 2n3904 for Q1 but otherwise it should be pretty much the exact same circuit. I'm going to make here a 4 knobber.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on June 15, 2014, 11:40:04 AM
Cool, great news....
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on June 15, 2014, 01:31:38 PM
I have very little hiss on mine.  I am finalizing my PCB layout now with wider traces.  The first version I built is quiet for such a high gain pedal. I still haven't boxed it up.  It's too much fun  ;D.  I love this thing when fed into a nice chorus. Wow it sounds great.
With the schematic I posted you have a huge tonal palette to choose from. Lite fuzz , thick gating ,synthy grit,  smooth distortion , dark gritty fuzz... Dial the tone to the high end and cut presence to the bottom and it sounds like it's playing from an old am radio in the distance.  But a power chord and crank the presence up and it's in your face.  When I get some time off I will post a demo. Working way to many hours lately.   Btw Happy Fathers Day guys !!!!
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on June 15, 2014, 01:44:52 PM

(http://i.imgur.com/dMdneRj.jpg)
Just a quick shot to show you what I have been talking about.  This is my layout for the schematic above. That is a 1590b for size reference.  Excuse the mess  :D
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on June 15, 2014, 02:29:35 PM
https://soundcloud.com/whiskey-mademedoit/xfuzz-with-chorus-quick-and-dirty-loop/s-1W8BX

Ok I knocked out a very quick demo of the xfuzz through a chorus. its not great playing but that is as good as it gets with my time constraint... and the fact I suck at guitar  ;D.  No EQ or edits just a quick drum I made with Figure on my phone and looped over it with two guitar parts. Later I will post some sound samples of the Xfuzz/Rock with all the crazy sounds you can get from this thing. BTW I'm calling my pedal the CrossFire Fuzz. Thanks Duck_Arse for the great name. Thanks Rob for the awesome design. 
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on June 15, 2014, 02:45:34 PM
looking good guys..

clear leds?...ive been using standard diffused red/yellow's...


looks like i'll just have to bite the bullet and knock up a quickie build to test properly... 8)

won't be till tuesday though, i'm off to see the queen tomorrow,..long story..  :icon_rolleyes:
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on June 15, 2014, 02:56:52 PM
You can't say something like "I'm off to see the Queen" and not elaborate ;)

The LEDs where from a bulk buy.  I went to Texas to visit family and we built it with the parts he had (which were opaque ) and there wasn't much difference.  Like I have said before without the cap changes I get very similar sounds from the LEDs.  It is very subtle difference of symmetric vs asymmetric clipping.  With the right amp and tone it's noticeable but not always.  If you go with a dual setup add the cap switch.  Now tell us about this queen visit.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: haveyouseenhim on June 15, 2014, 03:55:08 PM
You can't say something like "I'm off to see the Queen" and not elaborate ;)

He's going to be knighted for the amazing work he has accomplished in the stompbox world.   

Or he has a plan to kill the queen and use her blood in capacitors to obtain that certain sound he's been looking for.  Hmm, I wonder If the NSA cares about the queen.... :icon_eek:
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on June 15, 2014, 04:12:29 PM
sir rob.. ;)

hmmmm kinda has a ring to it.. ;D
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: karbomusic on June 15, 2014, 05:01:07 PM
And another big thank you. This is strictly for my pedal board (hope it was ok to munge the name a little - was supposed to read space rock xfuzz but its a box in a day so...) and your moniker is on the bottom plate with full credit. I hope to go back and get it on the front but was in a hurry today because it's going with me to rehearsal in a couple hours. Anyway, thought I'd post the semi-final right as I was testing it:

(http://www.wallsonic.com/public/posts/xfuzz.jpg)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on June 15, 2014, 05:08:17 PM
cheers, looks great man... 8)

should settle on my box design soon..ish..  i need bredaboard space for other mad stuff.. ::)

Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: karbomusic on June 15, 2014, 05:21:43 PM
i need bredaboard space for other mad stuff.. ::)



That's exactly how the above got built. Liked it too much to bag the parts, it was working and needed the breadboard room. Solution, box that thang! With any luck my band mates should look like this just after I turn it on:

(http://pndblog.typepad.com/.a/6a00e0099631d08833017d3f7e90eb970c-200wi)

Thanks!
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on June 15, 2014, 05:35:59 PM
That's quick work! Looks good. Maybe in the next week ill get around to finishing my layout and box this puppy. I have some ideas on a new finish i am going to try. If  it turns out good  I'll post the results and if it doesn't I'll act like it never happened. :icon_biggrin:
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: bluebunny on June 16, 2014, 03:33:55 AM
You can't say something like "I'm off to see the Queen" and not elaborate ;)

+1!!!

(http://www.cardcrushgreetings.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/spill-the-beans-blog.jpg)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: duck_arse on June 16, 2014, 10:48:24 AM
sir rob.. ;)
hmmmm kinda has a ring to it.. ;D

why set your sights so low, Lord Robert of Sausage?

so the next one will be the "munge fuzz"?

(hope it was ok to munge .... a little ...)

or maybe a "munge ok" knob?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: rutabaga bob on June 16, 2014, 02:58:10 PM
The Earl of Links?  Smashing!
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on June 16, 2014, 05:25:45 PM
Ok, beans spilling...

mrs astro is the personal secretary to black rod in the house of lords, ivwent to the state opening of parliament which mrs astro organizes, and black rod invited us both as guests for the garter ceremony at windsor castle today, and met the entire royal family, it was pretty nerve racking, but pretty cool too...mrs astro loved it as she is a big history buff....had a great day, very surreal, but one to remember for sure...
i never imagined ever being within 3 foot of the queen and future king n queen, pretty bizarre....anyway, i didnt get knighted, but hey therrs always next year eh.......right, back to making noise :icon_twisted:

ill probably be killed by MI5 now... :)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: puretube on June 16, 2014, 05:40:50 PM
all black sausery to me...
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Jdansti on June 16, 2014, 05:53:01 PM
Ok, beans spilling...

mrs astro is the personal secretary to black rod in the house of lords, ivwent to the state opening of parliament which mrs astro organizes, and black rod invited us both as guests for the garter ceremony at windsor castle today, and met the entire royal family, it was pretty nerve racking, but pretty cool too...mrs astro loved it as she is a big history buff....had a great day, very surreal, but one to remember for sure...
i never imagined ever being within 3 foot of the queen and future king n queen, pretty bizarre....anyway, i didnt get knighted, but hey therrs always next year eh.......right, back to making noise :icon_twisted:

ill probably be killed by MI5 now... :)

Had to look that one up - Cool!   8)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: PRR on June 17, 2014, 12:19:14 AM
> personal secretary to black rod in the house of lords,

In 'merican.....

A person carrying a black rod is in charge of maintaining the buildings and security of the place where congress-critters meet (Palace of Westminster, the meeting place of Parliament). If the King/Queen is in the house, he hangs protectively.

Every year he fetches the house of Commons to attend the opening of Parlament. They slam the door in his face, because the Commons does not take orders from King/Queen (think of Tea Party Reps welcoming Obama's summons) and he has to bang on the door three times with his staff.

Also this guy guards the door at meetings of the Order of the Garter, a very select group of the King/Queen and about 2 dozen hand-picked "companions", broadly similar to old Arthur's Round-Table Knights. (And like Arthur's place, apparently a LOT of other people get invites to sit against the walls, including many Kings/Queens still employed in Europe and Japan, military pensioners, and others.)

While Black Rod is supposed to organize opening of Parlament, it seems he delegates much of that to Mrs Astro then struts around like he did-it-all. To make-up for taking the public limelight, Rod let Mrs Astro bring her current boyfriend over to Windsor for the Garter party.

While the Garter folk are all super-important people, myself I'd rather slip out back and run the Corgis/Dorgis.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: bluebunny on June 17, 2014, 03:26:15 AM
This has turned into the funniest thread ever.  Well, this week anyway...

Paul: is there anything you don't know??   :D   Righto, Captain Sausage - which one are you?

(http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/75570000/jpg/_75570968_75570967.jpg)

If I'd known you were there, I would have stopped by and cheered (I live a bit up the road from Liz'n'Phil).  I would have been the one waving a Big Muff and being hauled off by Her Maj's constabulary...   ;D
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on June 17, 2014, 05:19:08 AM
^ i'd have set the guards on ya!.. :icon_twisted:  ;)  (but yeah, you should've turned up..could've had a beer or two...3...4....5....)

(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/windsor.jpg)

arrived after going to pub , went for a much needed wee...

came back from wee, and went in chapel

left chapel

mingled

back to pub across the road

dude playing a tuba

@PRR: that's about the jist of it ...

and yes kate is a stunner..i wouldn't kick her out of bed for a fiver or a tenner, one of the queens ladies in waiting made me laugh, she looked like an egyptian mummy with protruding teeth,

she could nibble sweetcorn through a fence for sure.. :D....so all in all an entertaining day.. 8)
...

now i'm back in audio orbit  8)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: bluebunny on June 17, 2014, 08:19:45 AM
. . . you should've turned up..could've had a beer or two...3...4....5....

It's a deal.  Next year's Garter Gig is in the diary!

Quote
she could nibble sweetcorn through a fence for sure.. :D

LOL!   :D
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: duck_arse on June 17, 2014, 10:42:11 AM
well, I didn't vote for him.

This has turned into the funniest thread ever.  Well, this week anyway...

Paul: is there anything you don't know??   :D   Righto, Captain Sausage - which one are you?

(http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/75570000/jpg/_75570968_75570967.jpg)

he's the one with the (clean) sausages on his head, being attacked by the quins own crows.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: seedlings on June 17, 2014, 10:40:11 PM
(http://i.imgur.com/fbh4JeX.png)

So what i have here is both the x-rock and x-fuzz clipper sections combined and they are selectable. followed by the emitter folower to buffer the tone control so it doesn't get loaded by the clipper stage. The tone control is an AMZ style BMP with the values I got from playing around in Duncan Tonestack Calculator. Following the tone control is two different output sections that are selectable. It would probably be good practice to tie those input high or low when the switch is flipped using a 3pdt. I haven't done that yet. Seems to work fine as it is.  I don't have sound clips right now but you are welcome to breadboard it and test if you want to. This will fit on a small breadboard. I am going to take a long rest before work so i will respond to any questions later tonight.

Do you mean to have a 10k/10k divider on the base of q3?  Maybe 470k/100k like DA's schem?

CHAD
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on June 17, 2014, 10:56:58 PM
Yes I did. Look to the right q4 it's the same as DA final stage. The q3 is an emitter follower I used to follow the clipping section to buffer the tone control from the variable impedance from the clipper section.  When the bias is tweaked up and down it was yanking my tone stack around.  So I buffered it.  You can skip that if you want to and just plug your tone stack after the q2 clipper. The selectable output is entirely optional also. One of the output sections is Rob's and the other is a horrible mangling of TCA's mu-valve.  Just use Rob's if you want. I just like options and wanted something I could dial in lots of sounds.  I don't guarantee it's good design ;)  be sure to look at the new version I posted later in this thread.  The diode selection alone doesn't really change the sound drastically. You need the caps switches to really hear the difference. 
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: monksanto on June 18, 2014, 08:31:38 AM
Is it rude & arrogant to ask someone to make a vero of WhiskeyMade MeDoIt's enhanced X-Fuzz/Rock circuit?  :P I really just wanna solder this baby up & start tharshin'!  ;D
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on June 18, 2014, 08:41:16 AM
I'm still tweaking it a bit. When I finish I will post a simplified version. I will also try to knock out the vero for both versions. It will be awhile I'm working 60 hours weeks for a while.  I also have a PCB version of this almost finished. If anyone wants to beat me to it they are welcome to go for it.  :)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: seedlings on June 18, 2014, 08:48:11 AM
Yes I did. Look to the right q4 it's the same as DA final stage. The q3 is an emitter follower I used to follow the clipping section to buffer the tone control from the variable impedance from the clipper section.  When the bias is tweaked up and down it was yanking my tone stack around.  So I buffered it.  You can skip that if you want to and just plug your tone stack after the q2 clipper. The selectable output is entirely optional also. One of the output sections is Rob's and the other is a horrible mangling of TCA's mu-valve.  Just use Rob's if you want. I just like options and wanted something I could dial in lots of sounds.  I don't guarantee it's good design ;)  be sure to look at the new version I posted later in this thread.  The diode selection alone doesn't really change the sound drastically. You need the caps switches to really hear the difference. 

Yes, yes, I see now.  I printed off your schematic before heading down to the studio for breadboarding.  When I realized that, I made the executive decision to build the first 3 stages, figuring that was pretty much DA's circuit.  With the 10k/10k divider, the output was very quiet, as if 10k wasn't enough resistance to ground.  When I printed off DA's circuit, I switched to the 470/100k and then she worked.  Many thanks!

On a second issue, and perhaps this has been addressed already, but should there be some setting on the bias pot that gives a non-gated release for the note?  I can't find one.  The synthy swell is great though!  At zero on the knob (10k), I get no sound at all except for very, very hard chord strums.

CHAD
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on June 18, 2014, 09:04:36 AM
I'm out and about coming back from work when I get home ill post a simplified version with the combined XFuzz/ rock and only Robs output.
The low end of the dial of the bias knob should be an aggressive fuzz with no gating. That thing should sing.  Do you have the clipper section feeding a tone and then feeding your output section?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on June 18, 2014, 09:30:37 AM
Untested but this should be a simpler version to build without the BMP tonestack or dual output sections.
You can use a 3pdt for the switched parts and have a single switch to change between them or make them three individual switches and get more variations.
(http://i.imgur.com/GkdO574.png)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: seedlings on June 18, 2014, 10:10:38 AM
I'm out and about coming back from work when I get home ill post a simplified version with the combined XFuzz/ rock and only Robs output.
The low end of the dial of the bias knob should be an aggressive fuzz with no gating. That thing should sing.  Do you have the clipper section feeding a tone and then feeding your output section?

(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/XROCKDONE.jpg)

This is what is on my breadboard, except Q3 is a 3904 with a 3k emitter.  I've got something wrong because the aggressive fuzz is missing, and there is one more problem.  With a partial turn of either guitar volume or the pre-gain knob, the signal goes to nothing... I'll be back at the breadboard tonight.  If I can't find the problem, I'll post pics.

CHAD
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: karbomusic on June 18, 2014, 11:35:21 AM



This is what is on my breadboard, except Q3 is a 3904 with a 3k emitter.  I've got something wrong because the aggressive fuzz is missing, and there is one more problem.  With a partial turn of either guitar volume or the pre-gain knob, the signal goes to nothing... I'll be back at the breadboard tonight.  If I can't find the problem, I'll post pics.

CHAD

I had the exact same issue in my layout/physical build. I found that in addition to sending Q3's emitter through the 3.3K to ground, I had also inadvertently sent it directly to ground. I cut the trace that provided the direct ground path and fixed the issue. My build is basically the same except, I subbed Q1 with a 3904 instead of Q3 as an FYI and didn't lose the aggression in gain.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: seedlings on June 18, 2014, 11:48:15 AM



This is what is on my breadboard, except Q3 is a 3904 with a 3k emitter.  I've got something wrong because the aggressive fuzz is missing, and there is one more problem.  With a partial turn of either guitar volume or the pre-gain knob, the signal goes to nothing... I'll be back at the breadboard tonight.  If I can't find the problem, I'll post pics.

CHAD

I had the exact same issue in my layout/physical build. I found that in addition to sending Q3's emitter through the 3.3K to ground, I had also inadvertently sent it directly to ground. I cut the trace that provided the direct ground path and fixed the issue. My build is basically the same except, I subbed Q1 with a 3904 instead of Q3 as an FYI and didn't lose the aggression in gain.

If you (or anyone) has a working circuit, and would be willing to post clips, it would be very helpful to hear a chord strum once each:
1) pre-gain full, bias at 7:00 (~500k) max
2) pre-gain full, bias at 12:00 (~220k) middle
3) pre-gain full, bais at 5:00 (10k) minimum
4) pre-gain at 3:00, bias at 5:00
5) pre-gain at 9:00, bias at 5:00

Thanks!

CHAD
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: karbomusic on June 18, 2014, 12:17:42 PM
It's in my pedal board, in my car being carted "to and fro" for rehearsal. Translation: Might be a few days before it's back in the house where I can play around with it. :) I do remember however, that there is such a thing as the bias being "too low". I was simply going to either not set it too low or do some type of compensation on the pot. It's just for me so not sure I'll tweak it too much more.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on June 18, 2014, 02:00:49 PM
CHAD.

here is the xrock on breadboard still ...clips as you wanted, if it helps ya..    Q1-2 5088's, Q3 3904.  250k bias trim

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/XROCKTEST.mp3
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: seedlings on June 18, 2014, 04:25:55 PM
CHAD.

here is the xrock on breadboard still ...clips as you wanted, if it helps ya..    Q1-2 5088's, Q3 3904.  250k bias trim

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/XROCKTEST.mp3

Helps tons  ;D .  Means something is critically wrong with mine  ??? with heavy gating and synthyness all around.  My breadboard has 'the tone' of yours, but not the attack and decay.

CHAD
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on June 18, 2014, 06:22:38 PM
Are you sure your LEDs are in the right direction? 
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: seedlings on June 18, 2014, 10:20:17 PM
 :icon_redface:

5088s were in backwards...  I had the 5088 handwritten wrong for reference  :icon_rolleyes:

And now she's just like the clips!  I don't feel the need for the recovery stage- even keeping the tone control, so this just may be a 1590A build.

Thank you so much DA Rob!

CHAD
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on June 19, 2014, 04:40:06 AM
 aha...cool, glad you got it going man.  8)


Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Mario44 on June 19, 2014, 08:11:25 AM
Ok
Thats version of xfuzz/rock that I have on my BB. Gonna make the PCB soon myself.
If someone fancy doing it, here you go. Everything should be good, but it needs verification.
Format A4, PCB and traces, then both mirrored, rdy to print.
edit: it's my first layout  :icon_mrgreen:
(http://s28.postimg.org/u348nho3x/xfuzz_layout_pcb.png)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: seedlings on June 19, 2014, 08:39:33 AM
Ok
Thats version of xfuzz/rock that I have on my BB. Gonna make the PCB soon myself.
If someone fancy doing it, here you go. Everything should be good, but it needs verification.
Format A4, PCB and traces, then both mirrored, rdy to print.
edit: it's my first layout  :icon_mrgreen:
(http://s28.postimg.org/u348nho3x/xfuzz_layout_pcb.png)

Mario, that looks great.  Were you thinking 1590A?

CHAD
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Mario44 on June 19, 2014, 09:32:42 AM
(Un)fortunately I didn't think of that tiny hammond. I never had opportunity to work with these housings. Just made this board optimum size, no jumpers.
Its more or less 4x4cm. PCB is adapted for using goldpins for pots. Just decided to go more pro and use some connectors.
It will look more aesthetic for me. Power pad will be like that: http://static1.tme.eu/katalog_pics/2/e/7/2e751263292af19fabe21c765db8a459/tb-3.5-p-2p_bl.jpg (http://static1.tme.eu/katalog_pics/2/e/7/2e751263292af19fabe21c765db8a459/tb-3.5-p-2p_bl.jpg)

If somebody wants it more packed up for hammonds - no problem, just let me know  ;D
I never tried to thermotransfer any PCB, so I have not much experience with creating good layouts for it.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: monksanto on June 19, 2014, 03:30:49 PM
Quote
1) pre-gain full, bias at 7:00 (~500k) max

Man this sounds lush. How simple would the circuit be just to achieve this lol.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: seedlings on June 19, 2014, 03:53:04 PM
Quote
1) pre-gain full, bias at 7:00 (~500k) max

Man this sounds lush. How simple would the circuit be just to achieve this lol.

I think 1) and 3) might be the other way around in the clip... all depends on how the knob is wired.  I'm pretty sure DA's sound sample first chord is with just the 10K collector resistor.  In my mind the 'max' setting on the knob would be most voltage drop (highest resistance), but could easily be the other way around (highest collector voltage).

So, to answer your question:

(http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb54/seedlings/XROCKlightversion_zps50ad01eb.jpg) (http://s206.photobucket.com/user/seedlings/media/XROCKlightversion_zps50ad01eb.jpg.html)

CHAD

**edit: deadastronaught, at your command I shall remove this image!!!
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on June 27, 2014, 02:10:33 AM
I knew I was going to screw up that switch layout ;) I built it as posted and discovered my mistake. I had the switches backward for the rock and fuzz caps...here is revised schematic. If you built it and used one 3pdt for the rock/fuzz switch just flip the clipper leads and relabel.
(http://i.imgur.com/qmhWTF7.png)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Jdansti on July 01, 2014, 11:01:45 PM
Help!  I'm building a version using the scheme above and I haven't gotten my head around the FET switching yet. Could someone please point out to me where the LED and current limiting resistor connect?

(http://i1160.photobucket.com/albums/q485/jdansti/6688CEC7-31A3-47FC-BC60-A59C0F0C19FB.jpg)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on July 01, 2014, 11:51:00 PM
That section of the circuit you have marked is just the output amp selector. There are two possible output stages one is the bjt and the other is a bastardized mu-valve.  You wire the input and outputs to your standard 3pdt foot switch and use your favorite wiring method for that.  On that foot switch you usually wire your led and resistor. If you need more help ill post a schematic with off board wiring.  

Edit: are you wanting to use an led as indicator for the amp selection?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Jdansti on July 02, 2014, 01:30:39 AM
Thanks, Whiskey- that makes sense.  I thought it looked like another stage (two stages), but also thought it might be DA's FET switching.  I built that section as shown and I hard wired the rock/fuzz options for fuzz.

I tested it without a stomp switch, just wiring the input and output to my breadboard setup, and I didn't get any sound. This actually doesn't surprise me since I built it on perf without drawing it out first. I probably miswired something. I'll draw up a layout and try again after my brain reboots. It's tough trying to remember which transistor is which just by looking at the board without a layout to follow. I spent a lot of time and effort retracing my steps as I went. I've had success dong this before, but on smaller circuits.

Thanks for your help!
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Cozybuilder on July 02, 2014, 02:15:27 AM
I breadboarded this today (Crossfire schemo)- all sections work great! This is one Kick-A** design, incredible sustain, the tone circuit gives a lot of variation. I had to sub a couple of items- no 8.2nF caps in hand so I used 6.8 (maybe a little more treble, easily adjusted). Lacked a 1.5M so used a 680K/1M voltage divider (1.5:1 ratio, gives same bias voltage to gate of top 2N5457), and I used J201 FETs. Can't wait to stick this in a box- a huge 1590B- thanks to Whiskey for a PC card to make this an easy build. Will post pics when its ready.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on July 02, 2014, 02:55:23 AM
Awesome report Russ. John when you get back to the circuit change the 40k on the jfet to a 22k. It makes both stages about the same volume level.  I had switched it around and goofed on the schematic.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Jdansti on July 02, 2014, 02:57:27 AM
^Will do-Thanks!
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Jdansti on July 06, 2014, 03:52:40 AM
Worked up a perf layout and it works great (after fixing my stupid mistakes).  The only strange thing is that the presence pot causes the volume to go down to nothing when rotated fully clockwise.  I've got pin 3 of the presence pot connected to pin 3 of the tone pot as shown in the last schematic and pin 2 of the presence pot connected to a 1K resistor which is connected to ground as shown.  Any thoughts?

I'll post the layout once I get the presence issue worked out.  BTW - I just made the straight X Fuzz without the rock/fuzz switch or the final amp stage switch. 
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on July 06, 2014, 05:55:13 AM
John glad you got it working ! I can't add much until I see what you have actually built, but if built as I posted it should have volume on all parts of the presence setting. There will will be a shift in volume as the presence changes. That is what it does.
51K
(http://i.imgur.com/sumZK4E.jpg)
1K
(http://i.imgur.com/ObqZoFh.jpg)
The final stage will make up enough for it to be heard. On 1k it will sound distant and if you move the tone to the treble side it will have an AM radio effect.  The presence shifts the tone control around so be sure and experiment.

EDIT: I should not post a response this late at night after drinking ;)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Jdansti on July 06, 2014, 01:26:13 PM
Thanks WhiskeyMike. ;)  I'll take another look at it, and if I can't figure it out, I'll post some photos.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on July 06, 2014, 01:48:22 PM
The emitter follower I used before the tone stack helps this. That's why I put it there. If you don't have it in place you will hear the tone stack change when you dial around the bias too. It was too interactive for my taste so I buffered the clipper stage.  I think I ripped it from the tubescreamer.  Can't remember now.   :icon_biggrin: if you get it worked out please post what you did.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Jdansti on July 06, 2014, 04:13:48 PM
Thanks. I think I've got it worked out now. The 8.2n cap (I used 10n) labeled C9 on my layout had been nicked a little when I had sanded the board to make it a little thinner to fit in an "A" size enclosure (an idea which I've abandoned because there's no room for jacks- long story for a small problem).  There was some metal showing through the plastic.  Anyway, the volume doesn't disappear now when I turn the presence pot clockwise, but I do have to bump the volume control up a bit. I'm getting the range of sounds you described.

Here's my layout.  I didn't have yellow LEDs, so I used red (5mm diffused) on my build. I'd appreciate any comments from anyone.

(http://i1160.photobucket.com/albums/q485/jdansti/F177C46C-2CB1-4B49-80E3-ACA6B855B85D.png)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on July 06, 2014, 05:52:12 PM
Awesome John! Nice looking layout. Looks like you did go for that final stage after all. I will have a better look at it later when I'm off work.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Cozybuilder on July 07, 2014, 09:42:55 AM
Great looking layout John. For coupling cap C4 you have 1 uF, the schematic on p.16 reply #314 shows 470nF in the Fuzz position. I doubt you'd year a difference though. Everything else looks good.
Russ
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Jdansti on July 07, 2014, 12:21:34 PM
Thanks, Russ.  I might give the 470n a try.   :)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Jdansti on July 08, 2014, 12:52:48 AM
Here's my X Fuzz. I kept the coupling cap at 1μF. It sounds great!

As you can see I used a larger box than was necessary because the knobs are big. I had these great knobs that were scavenged from my Dad's 70's Pioneer tuner that stopped working ages ago. My brother had them stashed for 20 years or so. Since the knobs are shiny aluminum, I just clear coated the enclosure to keep the shiny look. The lettering was done with stamps and permanent ink.


(http://i1160.photobucket.com/albums/q485/jdansti/39E315E7-B871-44A6-91B4-66BE63514C36.jpg)

(http://i1160.photobucket.com/albums/q485/jdansti/6C2E3047-48E2-4362-9AAC-D5591B210AB2.jpg)

I'll post a copy of the layout that says "Verified" now that I know it works.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on July 08, 2014, 01:07:36 AM
Looks good John. Love those knobs. If you decide you want more of a scooped tone double c9. Somewhere between 15n and 22n will make it scooped at all the presence settings. As it is now it will be flat at 51k and more scooped as you dial it down to 1k. 
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on July 08, 2014, 01:15:51 AM
Here is mine. I had fits with the paint. It seems like everything I tried worked out wrong on this one. That is what I get for experimenting...experience and heartache.  ;D I finally just gave up and went with it. I'll mark it up as lessons learned for the next one.

(http://i.imgur.com/U8G3o5l.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/DvxH9E1.jpg)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: bluebunny on July 08, 2014, 03:08:02 AM
Great build, John.  Nothing wrong with big knobs.   ;D   Yours too, Michael - the colours look great.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Jdansti on July 08, 2014, 03:18:22 AM
Thanks Michael and Mark.

I might try that mid scoop, Michael, if I can talk myself into opening it up again and fussing with it. ;). Your X-Fire looks great!  I have no idea how you did it, but I give it a 10 out of 10!  :)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on July 08, 2014, 03:36:12 AM
Thanks BlueBunny and John.
John your too kind this is not my best work it was put together after much frustration. I posted the etch technique in another thread . This was a dry film photoresist etch. I am sure someones done it before but I haven' seen it. I have always etched using toner transfer. This was a first and while it did work it was my first attempt with this dry film ever so i had some edge bleeding so it was a light etch.
Next I had problems with the paint!!!  I used testor model paint and did the colored parts first and it looked great with a smooth gradient. After it dried i used liquid frisket over it and painted the body a sparkle black. I let that dry overnight and when i peeled off the frisket it was carnage. colored paint was ruined and had gummed up. I tried to touch it up but then I noticed splotches of the frisket had touched the body color and the paint was still gummy and it stuck to it. Tried to sand that back but it ruined the black top coat. I used painters tape and recovered the colors and carefully cut it with a razor and resprayed the black. After it was dry I peeled off the tape and sanded it down flat to get the edges to show.... and now my damn background was higher than the edges after the recoating so it was now scuffed in random spots..........ARGHHHHHHH! :icon_evil:. @#$% it! I wiped it with alcohol and lacquered that box. I'm done lesson learned. Never use testors paint. i will be using good old acrylic artist paint from now own. Sorry for the rant it was pent up frustration  :icon_razz:   
On the plus side the board worked perfect first time and I had zero problems when it fired up.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on July 08, 2014, 03:39:54 AM
great builds guys...@john, i'm always on the lookout for old stereo knobs too , nice. 8)

@whiskey: looks great man, came out cool even after your troubles..well worth the extra grief i'd say... 8)

and the offboard is just like mine..lots of it. ;D ;) 8)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: bluebunny on July 08, 2014, 03:42:51 AM
and the offboard is just like mine..lots of it. ;D ;) 8)

Yeah, more "off" than "board".   :icon_eek:  :icon_eek:  :icon_eek:
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on July 08, 2014, 03:45:31 AM
Rob you're my role model. I learned from the best  ;D
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on July 08, 2014, 03:47:34 AM
you guys...  ;D yeah i should be italian with all that pasta flying about... :D
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: italianguy63 on July 08, 2014, 03:57:39 AM
you guys...  ;D yeah i should be italian with all that pasta flying about... :D

Did somebody say pasta?!  *perk*

MC
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on July 08, 2014, 04:00:05 AM
you don't want to see the sauce believe me..its usually red (but not tomatoes) with lots of screaming involved.. ;D
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: duck_arse on July 08, 2014, 07:36:55 AM
@ jd - it looks to me as though the arse-end of R4 is not connected.

@ whiskey - I wish I could wreck a pedal that badly.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Jdansti on July 08, 2014, 03:24:12 PM
^You're right. Thanks for catching that. I'll repost.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Jdansti on July 08, 2014, 04:15:31 PM
Here's my corrected layout:

(http://i1160.photobucket.com/albums/q485/jdansti/C3370C12-0C37-4D22-A5B7-A5E036BF6B9E.png)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Mystica on July 09, 2014, 02:04:57 PM
I tried different LED's. I personally think that BLUE LED's sound the best.  :icon_biggrin: (I used the vero version from http://tagboardeffects.blogspot.com)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: seedlings on July 09, 2014, 04:01:54 PM
I tried different LED's. I personally think that BLUE LED's sound the best.  :icon_biggrin: (I used the vero version from http://tagboardeffects.blogspot.com)

I am using ONE clear blue LED (in place of the two reds in xrock) and it sounds fantastic... but added a bass knob to a parallel input cap, and a tone section from the -->Pharaoh fuzz<-- (http://www.bigmuffpage.com/images/schematics/Pharaoh%20Big%20Muff%20Clone%20Schematic.jpg).  So, mine is a cobbled-together mishmash.  Waiting on some 9mm pots, then, if it turns out at least mediocre, I'll post pics.

CHAD
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: spyglass on July 11, 2014, 11:56:29 PM
i ended up tinkering with Gus's ASDF  a bit, and went for a more heavy type groove :icon_twisted:.......

cleans up nice too 8)

i used a pregain as i just prefer the control of that...

cheers for the inspiration gus....lots of tweaking fun to be had.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kaBkdysrX_A&feature=youtu.be


I couldn't help but hear these video's are recorded direct into a computer as opposed to an amp being miked,and this D.I. method seems common these days.You lose the organic sound of any pedal being demoed and I can't hear what this pedal really sounds like under this circumstance.It reminds when I used to record in the early eighties direct into my tape recorder.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: seedlings on July 12, 2014, 01:39:21 AM
I couldn't help but hear these video's are recorded direct into a computer as opposed to an amp being miked,and this D.I. method seems common these days.You lose the organic sound of any pedal being demoed and I can't hear what this pedal really sounds like under this circumstance.It reminds when I used to record in the early eighties direct into my tape recorder.

Sounds killer through a guitar amp.  I'm close to finishing an actual pedal, and will try to post a clip.

Through a valve amp.

CHAD
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on July 12, 2014, 05:03:51 AM


''I couldn't help but hear these video's are recorded direct into a computer as opposed to an amp being miked,and this D.I. method seems common these days.You lose the organic sound of any pedal being demoed and I can't hear what this pedal really sounds like under this circumstance.It reminds when I used to record in the early eighties direct into my tape recorder.''


its small enough to breadboard in 5 minutes, try it... ;)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on July 12, 2014, 10:43:00 AM
DA I agree this is one hell of a fun circuit. It's extremely tweakable and as you can see from all the responses it's well liked. I have now built it ten different ways and have played it on MANY amps and guitars. I took my final pedal to Guitar Center and those guys where swarming like sharks to play it. It sounds good on single coils and humbuckers. It sounds good through solid state and tube amps. One guy took it and cranked it up full bias and was doing Jack White style solos and i had to pry it out of his hands. I have only found one time it sounded bad... through a line 6 modeling amp, but only on some amp model settings. I may make a revision to mine and change the red leds to blue or pink. There is not enough difference between the two clipping sections. Seems like others have come to that conclusion too.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: seedlings on July 13, 2014, 11:48:39 PM
This build has different eq:

(http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb54/seedlings/20140713_215534_zpsbwo8zzwp.jpg)

(http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb54/seedlings/20140713_214925_zpsgi1bp2kg.jpg)

Post clips maybe tomorrow.

CHAD
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Jdansti on July 14, 2014, 02:10:44 AM
Related to the question of pedal to direct box vs pedal to amp, here's some info on how a pedal behaves:

http://www.premierguitar.com/articles/What_Does_a_Pedal_Sound_Like

The take away for me is that every make of amp is going sound different with a given pedal.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: seedlings on July 14, 2014, 08:14:49 AM
Through a tube amp, but at a low volume   :icon_rolleyes:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKq2KTOf0J4

CHAD
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: karbomusic on July 14, 2014, 12:01:30 PM
Used my X-Fuzz at my gig Saturday night FYI. Worked just wonderfully. :)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: rutabaga bob on July 17, 2014, 03:59:46 PM
Nice demo!  Thanks!
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: lightcycle on July 25, 2014, 07:04:39 AM
I'm looking to build Whiskeymademedoit's modified circuit on page 16 of the thread (http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=106498.msg980055#msg980055)
However, having two switchable output sections seems a bit overkill to my untrained eye. What would the principal difference between the sections be, and would the difference be enough to warrant building both in?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Cozybuilder on July 26, 2014, 08:54:21 AM
The JFET output stage gives a little warmer sound, its nice to have the option. Both sound incredible- breadboard it up, see what you prefer. This is a very versatile circuit, well worth the effort to build it.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: lightcycle on July 29, 2014, 04:01:05 PM
Thanks Cozybuilder, I feel as though I'm running out of front panel estate so I hoped to save a little space by omitting the switch. I actually haven't tried the circuit on breadboard yet, upon hearing the samples I immediately started laying out a vero layout. I think I'll maybe have to breadboard first and try it and see which output I prefer.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: bluesdevil on July 29, 2014, 04:48:33 PM
I ended up ditching the dual x fuzz/x rock thing because I didn't like the abrupt note decay I was getting with the x Rock on the breadboard.... I decided to just concentrate on the X Fuzz instead.
When I was playing around with X Fuzz I found I liked it without the 220k that's around the second transistor.... I don't know technically why, but it sounds louder and more dynamic to my ears. Also I increased the output cap to .56uf to thicken it up.
I really love it, thanks D.A.!!
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: seedlings on July 29, 2014, 04:54:34 PM
I ended up ditching the dual x fuzz/x rock thing because I didn't like the abrupt note decay I was getting with the x Rock on the breadboard.... I decided to just concentrate on the X Fuzz instead.
When I was playing around with X Fuzz I found I liked it without the 220k that's around the second transistor.... I don't know technically why, but it sounds louder and more dynamic to my ears. Also I increased the output cap to .56uf to thicken it up.
I really love it, thanks D.A.!!

I was getting abrupt note decay on the breadboard until I turned the 5088s around properly.  The decay will be great when wired properly.  I'm good at not wiring properly though.

CHAD
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: bluesdevil on July 29, 2014, 05:03:24 PM
I'm pretty sure I got the transistors in correctly, but I'll double check.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: WhiskeyMadeMeDoIt on July 29, 2014, 05:26:29 PM
Bluesdevil if you want to reduce some of the circuitry I would just make the xfuzz clipper section and skip the dual clipper setup. It doesn't add much but it does make the circuit lots more complicated. Be sure to try the dual output though it gives you a lot of sonic possibility.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: bluesdevil on July 29, 2014, 05:55:46 PM
Thanks Whiskey, I haven't tried the dual output stages yet..... will give it a whirl.
Just noticed you have the 3rd stage biased differently than the original I'm working from. Do I need to change it to work with new 4th stage?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Cozybuilder on August 22, 2014, 09:17:20 PM
Heres my X-Fire 1590A build. This one has both fuzz stages, the X-rock side is modified to use 2 pink LEDs with 470K resistor and 470nF cap, wired similar to the x-Fuzz clipper. The input caps are the same, both clipper sections use the same 1 uF coupling cap after Q1. EF Q3 isolates the tone circuit, instead of the presence pot a fixed 51K is connected to ground, the rest of the tone circuit is the same- it works very well. Only the first output stage is used- not enough room to put in both in this box- although I might try again with ⅛ Watt resistors.. It sounds great, a superb design.

(http://i1362.photobucket.com/albums/r688/russrutledge/DSCN2062_zps158c590c.jpg)

(http://i1362.photobucket.com/albums/r688/russrutledge/DSCN2064_zpse01886a8.jpg)

(http://i1362.photobucket.com/albums/r688/russrutledge/DSCN2052_zps75fc9beb.jpg)

(http://i1362.photobucket.com/albums/r688/russrutledge/DSCN2053_zps30e14d4e.jpg)

(http://i1362.photobucket.com/albums/r688/russrutledge/DSCN2054_zpscbdffe3b.jpg)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: akc1973 on October 18, 2014, 03:47:17 AM
i ended up tinkering with Gus's ASDF  a bit, and went for a more heavy type groove :icon_twisted:.......

cleans up nice too 8)

i used a pregain as i just prefer the control of that...

cheers for the inspiration gus....lots of tweaking fun to be had.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kaBkdysrX_A&feature=youtu.be


(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/xfuzz.jpg)


well worth breadboarding..if only to annoy your neighbours.  :icon_twisted:

edit:

vero layout...something for the weekend.. ;)

(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/xfuzz%20vero.jpg)

oops left off the 100uf cap...like i say breadboard it first... ;)

Hey DA,

I just put together your x-fuzz using the layout at http://tagboardeffects.blogspot.com.au/2014/05/x-fuzz-by-deadastronaut.html (http://tagboardeffects.blogspot.com.au/2014/05/x-fuzz-by-deadastronaut.html) and I bloody love it...so much fuzzy goodness...sounds great with my Rick copy...just gotta box it up now.

Thanks for your great work and keep it.... :D

akc1973
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: akc1973 on October 18, 2014, 03:48:36 AM
...and, by the way, I used BC549s and they work great!

akc1973
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on October 19, 2014, 03:26:46 PM
cool... 8)

i still haven't boxed mine yet....been busy.. ::)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on September 30, 2015, 09:48:57 AM
a friend sent me this link...

at least he put my name/s on the box..  ;)

http://tw.taobao.com/item/42737542984.htm
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: nick d on September 30, 2015, 09:56:59 AM
        Cost 399.00 meaningless squiggles - what's that in English ?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on September 30, 2015, 09:58:30 AM
728,000,000... ;D
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: vigilante397 on September 30, 2015, 11:15:00 AM
        Cost 399.00 meaningless squiggles - what's that in English ?

I think that's only about $63 US. A bit insulting for a DeadAstronaut design in my opinion! :P
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on September 30, 2015, 11:17:43 AM
 ;) 8)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: duck_arse on September 30, 2015, 11:34:55 AM
that's 3.30$ per page. what's the going rate?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on September 30, 2015, 11:38:57 AM
$3.30 a page aint too bad for me really.....

Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Elijah-Baley on December 07, 2015, 04:57:31 AM
Nice one whiskey, hows the noise/hiss?

I wanted to follow up. On hunch and following the most logical idea that made the most sense, I assumed the hiss must be a product of the breadboarding etc. So... I did a quick 20x12 vero layout yesterday and formally soldered it up. Hiss gone and this thing sounds absolutely fabulous.  ;D She's going in a 1590B in the next few hours!

(http://wallsonic.com/public/posts/spacefuzz.png)

There may be a tiny mod there or so such as a 2n3904 for Q1 but otherwise it should be pretty much the exact same circuit. I'm going to make here a 4 knobber.

And another big thank you. This is strictly for my pedal board (hope it was ok to munge the name a little - was supposed to read space rock xfuzz but its a box in a day so...) and your moniker is on the bottom plate with full credit. I hope to go back and get it on the front but was in a hurry today because it's going with me to rehearsal in a couple hours. Anyway, thought I'd post the semi-final right as I was testing it:

(http://www.wallsonic.com/public/posts/xfuzz.jpg)

Good job!

I would like build this effect, but the vero layouts I found is the 2 knobs version.
Can you share with us your vero layout?
I need the 4 knobs version (Pre-Gain, Volume, Tone, Bias).

Thanks! ;)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: kzl666 on July 14, 2016, 10:54:14 AM
Is anyone here? :icon_biggrin:
Can I introduce a standard big muff tone stack between last two stages without modifying any other components? Will it work properly? I'm not very good with schematics.
And what can be done with this "white noise" thing? The schematic is kinda "bigmuffy", and in big muff there's a little of that kind of noise, but somehow in this fuzz it's more apparent despite having less gain stages. Tried a 220pF (and even 470pF) cap on clipping diodes, it helped, but not a lot.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: antonis on July 15, 2016, 06:51:37 AM
Can I introduce a standard big muff tone stack between last two stages without modifying any other components?
This should be the easiest try.. :icon_wink:

Although that BMΠ tonestack needs a 13dB gain "recovery" which I'm not sure if can be obtained by Q2 clipping amp...
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Elijah-Baley on July 15, 2016, 09:28:23 AM
Here's my corrected layout:

(http://i1160.photobucket.com/albums/q485/jdansti/C3370C12-0C37-4D22-A5B7-A5E036BF6B9E.png)

I'm gonna use the Jdansti's layout ;). Waiting for Tayda's pack. ::)
First time for me with this kind of board, I usually use stripboard.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: kzl666 on July 15, 2016, 09:37:14 AM
For the last two stages I meant between Q2 and Q3. As I can see Q3 is basically the same recovery stage which can be found in big muff right after the tone stack. I've tried it already and something went wrong, it doesn't sound right (like in my big muff). Also, now that I have introduced that recovery stage (before there wasn't, just a plain simple schematic from the first page of this thread) "white noise" thing is just crazy and the sound is kinda gated. I've used KT3102E as Q3, maybe that's why. I need to rebuild it properly and use something like 2n5088 (somehow it's hard to find any decent transistors here, can't even buy something like BC546/547C).
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: DK1 on November 20, 2016, 09:46:38 PM
 Built one with the tagboardeffects.blogspot.com vero layout. Sounds killer. I used a 57nf input cap.

Thank you.

(http://i.imgur.com/Nkv8XAB.jpg)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Elijah-Baley on March 16, 2017, 10:12:35 AM
[...]
(http://i.imgur.com/qmhWTF7.png)
Here's my corrected layout:

(http://i1160.photobucket.com/albums/q485/jdansti/C3370C12-0C37-4D22-A5B7-A5E036BF6B9E.png)

Finally I'm building this.
I have some question. I probably gonna use a 125B box, so none switches.
But, for an eventually next time I would to know what those switch do.
I got this:
- First switch to choose the input cap 4.7nF or 10nF;
- Second switch to choose the coupling cap 470nF or 1uF;
- Third switch to choose the clipping sections, Yellow Led or Red Led;
- Fourth Switch to choose the output stage. To do what? ???

Thank you! :)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: anotherjim on March 16, 2017, 10:57:14 AM
One of the output options adds an alternative buffer circuit after the tone control. The 2N5088 is the original type (like the last stage of a Big Muff), the JFET one is a Mu-amp type. The original would be the "clearest" sounding I would think, while the Mu-amp should add some of it's own thing.
The board layout you have doesn't have the Mu-amp option, so you don't have a use for that last switch anyway. The layout should hard-wire the original buffer in for you.


Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Elijah-Baley on March 16, 2017, 11:39:14 AM
Thank you, anotherjim!
The original layout is ok. :P
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Elijah-Baley on March 17, 2017, 01:38:37 PM
Finished the X-Fuzz on protoboard layout. Now I have to start the debugging. :P
I got very low volume and just a compressed sound with a bad slight distortion.
The leds don't light up. Hard to say if the pots work well, maybe yes. And the transistors voltages are weird:

Q1
C: 2.42
B: 0.62
E: 0.00

Q2
C: 0.01
B: 0.56
E: 0.00

Q3
C: 8.19
B: 4.06
E: 3.48

Q4
C: 5.67
B: 1.25-0.90 (oscillating)
E: 0.30-0.70 (oscillating)

First time on protoboard. It is a bit difficult! :o
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: anotherjim on March 18, 2017, 03:20:02 PM
Q2 connector might not be connecting where it should.
Output oscillating might be feedback from Q4 to Q3 because Q2 isn't connection.
On proto boards, make sure the bus strips for power & ground are actually connected. They are often in isolated sections.  They needed linking if you need more than one section.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Elijah-Baley on March 18, 2017, 05:05:21 PM
Thanks a lot, anotherjim. ;)
I checked the circuit a a couple of times, and today I found a missing connection between R4 and C6. I gonna fix it tomorrow. Wish me good luck.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Elijah-Baley on March 19, 2017, 10:36:10 AM
Done. Not it works! I was expecting a bit of more gain. I'm going to search the old demo in this topic.
Does someone have some demo of this 5-pot version, or at least one close enough to that proto board layout? Thanks.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Elijah-Baley on March 20, 2017, 04:39:53 AM
I loved the deadastronaut's videos and finally I built the X-Fuzz, that one with 5 pots, but I don't get that gainy, doomy, extreme and sinthy fuzz of the videos. It is versatile, but it is a pretty regular fuzz. ???

The cap between first and second stage is 1uF (C4 in the proto board layout), should I change it with a 470nf to get that sick synthy sounds? Is really that cap the key?

Thanks! :)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Chrisfromiowa on February 22, 2018, 01:03:22 PM
[...]
(http://i.imgur.com/qmhWTF7.png)
Here's my corrected layout:

(http://i1160.photobucket.com/albums/q485/jdansti/C3370C12-0C37-4D22-A5B7-A5E036BF6B9E.png)

Finally I'm building this.
I have some question. I probably gonna use a 125B box, so none switches.
But, for an eventually next time I would to know what those switch do.
I got this:
- First switch to choose the input cap 4.7nF or 10nF;
- Second switch to choose the coupling cap 470nF or 1uF;
- Third switch to choose the clipping sections, Yellow Led or Red Led;
- Fourth Switch to choose the output stage. To do what? ???

Thank you! :)

Something very strange is happening with the image host, I see the proper image of the perfboard and the schematic, but I've tried to download the image of the perfboard and get a 3rd party hosting image, but what I see is the perfboard image. Very strange so I want to make sure that in the near future that people can see the perfboard. Regards Chris


(https://s17.postimg.org/slr02scwb/3rdpartyhosting.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)

(https://s17.postimg.org/es2ndqzqj/Screen_Shot_2018-02-22_at_11.56.51_AM.jpg) (https://postimg.org/image/es2ndqzqj/)

(https://s17.postimg.org/458u8bjvf/Xfuzzsmall.jpg) (https://postimg.org/image/458u8bjvf/)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Esppse on February 09, 2019, 05:14:12 PM
Hello, I've just built the Vero on tagboardeffects. Unfortunately it sounds nothing like the demo, it sounds like an overdrive, no fuzz texture. I've been reading this thread, above there is a 4 transistor version, are they supposed to be totally different sounding? I'm trying to chase the tone from the video demo.

Thanks
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Domin on August 22, 2020, 06:47:31 AM
I made one from this layout and all i have is just some clean sound, dontknow what could be wrong...
(https://i.postimg.cc/WFnk60S7/11-31-21-Dead-Astronaut-X-Fuzz.png) (https://postimg.cc/WFnk60S7)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on August 22, 2020, 07:14:24 AM
thats not my layout....check you leds are in opposite directions..

the 1uf should be a non polar........not electro.

Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Domin on August 22, 2020, 12:05:03 PM
Hmmm but even if its not your layout, it should work I think...and can you send schematic to first verzion of X Fuzz?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on August 22, 2020, 12:29:00 PM
yeah was just saying its not my layout, so im not held responsible for it not working..... ;)

here you go.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ybl9lvdz7ljcque/xfuzz.jpg?dl=0
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Domin on August 22, 2020, 12:35:49 PM
Thanks! Im comparing layout and schematic and they look same...I put same resistors and I have 9,4V battery and on both collectors I have 9,2V and no sound comming from it
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on August 22, 2020, 12:38:47 PM
are your leds lighting up?...when playing?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Domin on August 22, 2020, 12:56:53 PM
No, they arent, if you want I can send you photo of PCB
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: bluebunny on August 22, 2020, 12:57:45 PM
If both your collectors are pretty much the same as your power rail, then there's nowhere for your signal to "wiggle".  So I'm surprised you hear anything at all!  Can you show us some pictures of what you've built?

Edit: simul-post!  Pictures: yes please.  Both sides.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on August 22, 2020, 12:58:58 PM
^ yup.... pics please... 8)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Domin on August 22, 2020, 01:04:18 PM

(https://i.postimg.cc/s10vkLs4/IMG-20200822-114254.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/s10vkLs4)

(https://i.postimg.cc/8j2s5rFF/IMG-20200822-114258.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/8j2s5rFF)

(https://i.postimg.cc/1gHzJCv6/11-31-21-Dead-Astronaut-X-Fuzz.png) (https://postimg.cc/1gHzJCv6)

Maybe I really made mistake somewhere, I dont know :( But same problem I had with SMD version of DAM Meathead, I had 9V on Q2 collector too, but when I made THT version it was ok...
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on August 22, 2020, 01:30:49 PM
heres how it should be wired....

https://www.dropbox.com/s/8h0d78pfr8ge2ze/XFUZZY.png?dl=0
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Domin on August 22, 2020, 02:25:29 PM
I put that pcb in breadboard, input of PCB i connected to one jack, output to 500k pot and output of pot to anothe jack and firstly I had clean signal, I measured collector voltage and it was above 9V and then I unplugged in and out, measured voltage and it was around 3V so I change resistor in second transistor from 10K to 5,1K and it went to around 6V, then I plugged in and out and it was back above 9V...
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on August 22, 2020, 02:40:49 PM
have you got any stripboard?

if so, here is my original layout.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/oe7d6misxqa7qxt/xfuzz%20vero.jpg?dl=0
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Domin on August 22, 2020, 02:57:47 PM
I dont have stripboard, just protoboard but I made layout by your schematic, maybe this will work better than layout before...

(https://i.postimg.cc/QVtyNfWM/Screenshot-2020-08-22-20-56-49-429-com-theophrast-droidpcb.png) (https://postimg.cc/QVtyNfWM)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on August 22, 2020, 03:00:07 PM
cool...... 8) 8) 8)

let us know how you get on...
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Domin on August 22, 2020, 03:10:37 PM
Does it look ok? Ok, maybe tommorov I,ll try it, I hope :/ But thanks a lot :)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on August 22, 2020, 03:13:53 PM
connect the other 10k to 9v.... and add a ground on the bottomn of the diode...
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Domin on August 22, 2020, 03:15:25 PM
Ah sorry, I was moving with resistors so I forget to make line to second resistor...
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Domin on August 22, 2020, 03:25:54 PM
And one more question, you said that 1uF cap should be nonpolaryzed, what will happen if I use electrolyt?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: antonis on August 22, 2020, 04:42:45 PM
what will happen if I use electrolyt?

Great uncertainity concering its leggings.. :icon_wink:

P.S.
Electrolytic capacitors aren't necessarily polarized..
(at least, for a couple of μF values..)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Domin on August 23, 2020, 03:04:32 AM
Ok I made it and its just amplifying, I used blue LEDs instead of yellow
(https://i.postimg.cc/S2041zXb/1598166347063.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/S2041zXb)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Domin on August 23, 2020, 03:13:28 AM
I put yellow ones and no change, when Im no playing I have only some hum in really low pitch
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on August 23, 2020, 03:47:32 AM
Show us a close up of your breaboard....
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Domin on August 23, 2020, 03:57:08 AM
Sorry but I dissasembled it...but I checked it twice with my father and it was ok...I tried simple bass fuzz but it had same problem, just amplifying and not distorting...
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on August 23, 2020, 04:15:22 AM
Hmmmmm wierd that its happening with 2 different circuits....

If i get a mo i will draw up a breadboard with the xfuzz on ok.
And we will go from there.....we WILL get this bugger going ok.  ;)



Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Domin on August 23, 2020, 04:20:35 AM
Ok, thanks, but I dont understand it, I would understand if transistors were bad, but they are conductive from base to collector and from base to emitter and voltage is around 800mV, one side has more mV than other, but maybe only 20vM more, I tried 2N5088, BC549C, BC547C and same...Collector voltage is only 25mV lower when I put 100K resistor instead of 10K, something is making problems and I dont know what...
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on August 23, 2020, 04:29:29 AM
Indeed, very strange......
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: 11-90-an on August 23, 2020, 04:37:29 AM
if that bazz fuzz failed....

can we have pictures of your in/out jacks that you connect to your breadboard?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Domin on August 23, 2020, 05:24:24 AM
Bazz Fuzz I once made with 2N5088 on breadboard and it was working, so I made it on PCB and its great, then I started to have problems with effects...
(https://i.postimg.cc/Xrz26pR2/IMG-20200823-111938.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/Xrz26pR2)

Probably i found what was making problems

Edit: I used 100nF cap in clipping section but its working!!! Noe i need to find why my pcb isnt...
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on August 23, 2020, 06:01:26 AM
well at least you have something working yay........ 8) 8) 8)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Domin on August 23, 2020, 06:23:29 AM
Somehow PCB is working and sound is sweet, but bias is homehow weird but ill let it be how it is :) Its pity I cant send audio
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on August 23, 2020, 06:24:37 AM
excellent'e.... 8)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Domin on August 23, 2020, 06:30:17 AM
Thanks a lot :)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on August 23, 2020, 06:35:12 AM
your welcome, enjoy.... 8)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: 11-90-an on August 23, 2020, 06:44:00 AM
you *can* send audio by recording it and putting it in youtube, soundcloud or other sites, then type in the link here... :icon_wink:
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on August 23, 2020, 06:47:18 AM
^ yup this... 8)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Domin on August 23, 2020, 07:17:23 AM
Ok, if I record something decent (I dont have amp right now, so I recorded just thru Vox Amplug and putting headphones next to mic of my phone), I'll send it :)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on August 23, 2020, 07:25:25 AM
if you need a good little amp that takes pedals well , search ''punch amp'' or ''chime amp''

your next build...  ;)


http://guitar-fx-layouts.42897.x6.nabble.com/Chime-Amp-Punch-Amp-v-2-td8493.html

Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Domin on August 23, 2020, 08:05:32 AM
I have amp, but 20W Ampeg :D And now I dont have it nearby, and I have bass, so Punch amp or Chime amp wont work so well I think :) Only if I plug 10" speaker into it :D But thanks for a tip :)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadastronaut on August 23, 2020, 08:07:33 AM
ahh gotya..thought you didnt have an amp at all... ;)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Domin on August 23, 2020, 08:26:30 AM
Its good that Ampeg and I have that Vox Amplug Bass 2, but I'm thinking about some tube preamp running on 9V...
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Domin on August 24, 2020, 11:51:26 AM
Its boxed, just in plastic box, but should be ok :) And I didnt use true bypass but this style of switching, but with DPDT switch and Im switching battery with it too...

(https://i.postimg.cc/mzxXVk5F/IMG-20200824-174557.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/mzxXVk5F)


(https://i.postimg.cc/vxh0QzHW/IMG-20200824-174939.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/vxh0QzHW)

(https://i.postimg.cc/gnkW3tRb/Screenshot-2020-08-24-17-50-31-233-com-facebook-orca.png) (https://postimg.cc/gnkW3tRb)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Domin on August 24, 2020, 01:31:35 PM
Is normal that diodes are glowing when I turn it on?
(https://i.postimg.cc/bsN2mFv9/1598290363346.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/bsN2mFv9)

Theres schematic how its connected...

(https://i.postimg.cc/phrKpGnZ/IMG-20200824-194303.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/phrKpGnZ)

It happens only when I turn pot to one side
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: bluebunny on August 24, 2020, 02:16:43 PM
A couple of things...

1. I wouldn't really expect to see much light from the LEDs - certainly not as bright as your picture shows.  For them both to be lit at the same time suggests one is round the wrong way.
2. Switching power with the bypass stomp-switch is not a good idea.  Particularly in the middle of a song.
3. A plastic box means you'll pick up radio stations, microwaves and WiFi.
4. Your switching scheme means the circuit is constantly sucking at your guitar signal.

If you can't get hold of a 3PDT switch, check out R.G.'s Millennium switching system (at the GeoFEX link above).  And use one of the common schemes for wiring jacks and batteries so that power is switched on when you insert your guitar lead.  I use the ones at Tonepad (http://www.tonepad.com/default.asp) all the time.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Domin on August 24, 2020, 02:23:20 PM
And if I just use DPDT as a true bypass and separate switch for battery?
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Domin on August 24, 2020, 03:30:17 PM
I made it with 2 switches and same problem, but I dont know if LEDs are lightning up when I turn up wolume or turn down
(https://i.postimg.cc/t7FD8zxM/21-35-07-TB-basic.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/t7FD8zxM)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: bluebunny on August 24, 2020, 05:21:43 PM
Use a stereo input jack and wire the black battery lead to the ring lug.  With no guitar lead inserted, it's not connected to anything and the battery doesn't drain.  Put the (mono) guitar lead in, and the ring and sleeve lugs are shorted by the plug, thereby connecting the battery -ve to ground and completing the circuit.
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Domin on August 25, 2020, 01:55:39 AM
I dont have stereo jack :( Isnt using switch same thing? Look at this video and you'll see what is problem
https://youtu.be/Ql0u2E7ZG2A
When I turn battery on, its ok, when I touch pot with finger they light up, but when I touch battery they dont light...
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: deadmandance on September 02, 2020, 12:27:13 PM
Does anyone have a vero layout for this version? Wanted to give it a try, but I only got stripboard with me

Here's my corrected layout:

(http://i1160.photobucket.com/albums/q485/jdansti/C3370C12-0C37-4D22-A5B7-A5E036BF6B9E.png)
Title: Re: X FUZZ
Post by: Domin on October 10, 2020, 08:37:58 AM
Can somebody tell me opinion to this? I want to put it as a onboard effect...Its like boost/fuzz, with switch I can sellect between first stage or second stage of 2 transistor XFuzz...

(https://i.postimg.cc/hzVBXLp7/Screenshot-20201010-143307-01.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/hzVBXLp7)