Hey so I just etched my own circuit board and everything is perfect except there is one spot where the connection between two pads kinda fades away in the center. Theres no visible copper there. Can I just connect the two ends with a thin line of solder?
Heres a picture:
(http://s8.postimg.org/7348mselx/board_Problem_Help.jpg)
You know...it's kind of funny...solder will bridge across areas where you don't want it to...
and refuse to flow across breaks in traces when that is your goal.
Since I can't see what you're dealing with...the best thing to do.. is to solder a small gauge wire across the separation to bridge the gap.
A piece of component lead will work.
Edit:
Now that I see a picture...definitely use a wire.
You don't need to drill holes...just tack it on the trace side.
Make sure it's a good solder connection.
Quote from: armdnrdy on March 10, 2016, 07:10:23 PM
You know...it's kind of funny...solder will bridge across areas where you don't want it to...
and refuse to flow across breaks in traces when that is your goal.
Since I can't see what you're dealing with...the best thing to do.. is to solder a small gauge wire across the separation to bridge the gap.
A piece of component lead will work.
Edit:
Now that I see a picture...definitely use a wire.
You don't need to drill holes...just tack it on the trace side.
Make sure it's a good solder connection.
Cool. That was a thought I had as well. I'll just solder component lead the to the ends of the trace.
Make it a long piece of wire, so the whole thing doesn't move around on you. Like an inch or more.
Whatever goes into the hole closest to the break, bend that lead over and kink it to bridge the gap, flux and solder.
Quote from: Cozybuilder on March 10, 2016, 07:35:02 PM
Whatever goes into the hole closest to the break, bend that lead over and kink it to bridge the gap, flux and solder.
And the winning answer goes to Cozybuilder! ;)
You can always get one of those conductive ink pens, too.
Gabriel
My only add-on is: I would use a much-too-long scrap of wire, 6" or a foot. PCB trace and wire pre-tinned. It is easier to cut-off 5.5" of extra than to jockey short scraps.
Agree with Cozy- in this case, the part-leg at the nearest hole may be as convenient as anything. Being an over-thinker, I wonder what happens in 2036 when someone may have to replace that part and doesn't know (can't remember!) why the leg was left long. That does seem very unlikely.
Conductive ink works if you know the current is low. In pedals, that's often true. However I would have to get condy-ink shipped-in from civilization; wire-scraps I got.
I like cozy's idea. I'm not sure if this is what PRR was saying, but another option would be to not immediately snip the legs of the components soldered to the two pads on each side of the missing trace and solder a small insulated jumper wire between the two legs. The jumper wire could stretch across the board "as the crow flies" and not cause any problems because it's insulated. Be sure not to block any unsoldered pads with the jumper when you do this. Snip the legs after you attach the jumper.
(http://s8.postimg.org/7348mselx/board_Problem_Help.jpg)
in the very toppest-leftest corner, the top pad and one below it - if they are meant to be linked, they look problematic, and if they are not meant to be linked, they may well be.
[also - the outside track right next to the "S", and the same trace, bottom, bottom-right corner. both places would benefit from a bridging wire.]
The "correct" way to repair it is to take a small piece of tinned copper wire (an offcut of component lead may be sufficient) at least half the width of the trace, long enough to bridge the gap plus 3.5mm (1/8") either side. Make sure it is straight, then bend it to overlay the trace (but lay flat on the board). Solder it in place (hold it in the gap with tweezers or an icecream (popsicle) stick. This will meet most general commercial standards for a repair of this nature. Cleaning off the flux and securing the wire across the gap in the trace with epoxy will get you to 'ordinary' MIL-STD. However, as Duck says, we have 3 more traces that need repair, and I see the track immediately to the left of the broken trace also needs some lurvin' (more than 10% reduction in width). This would be a total of 5 repairs necessary and a possible cause for rejection under reputable manufacturing house standards (more than three).
However, this is a homebrew. If I was doing this for me or someone else to use, for the outright break I would take some thin solid wire and create a 270+ degree eyelet that loops around the 'isolated' pad, bend it to follow the path of the trace, create another eyelet at the next pad and solder it down along it's whole length. I'd treat the the two top left pads similarly. The other problem tracks would benefit from a nice 'tinning' with solder (or an offcut of resistor lead), and you'd be just fine!
david
Quote from: greaser_au on March 11, 2016, 09:49:04 AM
...However, as Duck says, we have 3 more traces that need repair, and I see the track immediately to the left of the broken trace also needs some lurvin' (more than 10% reduction in width). This would be a total of 5 repairs necessary and a possible cause for rejection under reputable manufacturing house standards (more than three).
However, this is a homebrew. If I was doing this for me or someone else to use, for the outright break I would take some thin solid wire and create a 270+ degree eyelet that loops around the 'isolated' pad, bend it to follow the path of the trace, create another eyelet at the next pad and solder it down along it's whole length. I'd treat the the two top left pads similarly. The other problem tracks would benefit from a nice 'tinning' with solder (or an offcut of resistor lead), and you'd be just fine!
david
ok so I made the five corrections to the board. And I now have power at least, but still no sound. I've even resoldered every joint in the pedal three times each. No clean sound and no fx (obviously) but the led lights up. Help help help!
Here's the new state of the board from copper side with all the repairs:
(http://s18.postimg.org/m2lie14zd/20160311_130825.jpg)
more pics:
(http://s22.postimg.org/rnyxchx4h/20160311_125333.jpg)
(http://s22.postimg.org/3ms1b1ib5/20160311_125245.jpg)
(http://s30.postimg.org/bf8jlo71t/20160311_125109.jpg)
(http://s30.postimg.org/77drcx5m9/20160311_125154.jpg)
I would greatly appreciate the help. You guys greatly improve my learning curve. And I think I've become blind to the build at this point.
You should tell us what circuit this is...
post a schematic....
and possibly a picture of the component side.
There are some very talented individuals that frequent this forum but...I am not aware of anyone here that possesses the power of telepathy. ;)
Edit: Also...an image of the switch...since you are not passing any signal.
when you are testing this circuit...do you have the board's trace side laying against the metal enclosure as depicted in the images?
Quote from: armdnrdy on March 11, 2016, 04:44:51 PM
when you are testing this circuit...do you have the board's trace side laying against the metal enclosure as depicted in the images?
Yeah do you think its shorting? should i put some tape down? Nevermind. Just tried it right side up and it still doesnt work
It will short...many people use double sided foam tape to secure small PCBs.
Quote from: armdnrdy on March 11, 2016, 04:37:42 PM
You should tell us what circuit this is...
post a schematic....
and possibly a picture of the component side.
There are some very talented individuals that frequent this forum but...I am not aware of anyone here that possesses the power of telepathy. ;)
Edit: Also...an image of the switch...since you are not passing any signal.
There should be a picture of the switch up there.
its the Maestro FZ-1s from General Guitar Gadgets.
http://www.generalguitargadgets.com/effects-projects/fuzz-tones/maestro-fz-1s
and despite reading the directions in the forum, I always have trouble using my multimeter and being sure im using it correctly. Battery in or battery out etcetera.
check the purple wire on the volume pot.
I can't see the entire picture from the picture.....
It looks like the tag end of the wire might be touching the pot body. If that's the case, it would send the output to ground.
Quote from: armdnrdy on March 11, 2016, 05:18:24 PM
check the purple wire on the volume pot.
I can't see the entire picture from the picture.....
It looks like the tag end of the wire might be touching the pot body. If that's the case, it would send the output to ground.
Good to know for the future. I trimmed it. Still no sound. But at least I've learned something!
Are you sure your traces are all conducting now as they should?
Maybe you should try to tin every trace with your soldering iron - that did the trick for me twice. There could be some hairline cracks somewhere.
Just heat up one joint by shorty touching it with the soldering iron tip then retrace the trace as if you would do it with a pen.
If the traces are not taking on the tin, then they are oxidised (I always use this "Lötlack" (https://www.reichelt.de/Sprays-fuer-die-Leiterplatte/KONTAKT-228/3/index.html?ACTION=3&GROUPID=4073&ARTICLE=9486) on my boards to prevent oxidation) and I have no idea how to do it then.
However, I realised that a home-etched board with one faulty trace is very often prone to fail (because it usually is not just the one faulty trace you spotted). Sometimes this still happens to me (although I etched a lot by now) and I make it a habit to throw these boards away and etch a better one. The soldered components, the time and the nerves these boards cost are not worth it. If that feels not right for you, you should validate every single trace with your DMM before drilling an populating the board.
I've noticed that despite my batatery testing well, when I test the positive lead on the power jack it reads around 1v rather than 9. How could something be going wrong between the battery and the power jack?
> How could something be going wrong between the battery and the power jack?
Lack of power ground connection.
If there were a power problem, you should still get clean sound on one of the stomp switch positions; however, if there's a ground problem, that could affect both the power and the clean signal.
You should check for continuity of all ground points with your meter. With the meter set to continuity or resistance, touch the meter's probes together and watch the display. This will tell you what to look for when you have continuity. Then place one probe on the NEGATIVE battery lead and place the other probe on each point where you should have a ground connection. Your meter should indicate continuity at each ground point. If one or more ground points does not have continuity then correct it.
Sometimes I try this quick check: Connect a temporary jumper wire between the sleeve lugs of your in/out jacks and toggle the stomp switch back and forth and see if you get sound in either position. It's not as thorough as checking every ground point with a meter, but I always have alligator leads on my bench and it's a very quick and easy check.
I traced your circuit, and have the following comments: (I used JD Sleep's 1999 schematic for component numbering)
1) The offboard wires from the component side, wires on left, top to bottom should be wired as follows:
black 1- ground
black 2- ground
yellow 1- Sustain pot lug 1
orange 1- Fuzz switch lug 1
purple 1- fuzz switch lug 3
blue 1- lower Balance pot lug 2 (board is R7 33K)
orange 2-top Balance pot lug 2 (board is R8 33K)
purple 2- Volume 3
purple 3- LED +
Red- +9V
blue 2- Sustain pot lug 3
yellow 2- top Balance pot lug 3
blue 3- 3PDT Ckt INPUT
white- Sustain pot lug 2
2) Are the two 33Ks (R7, R8) wired together at the trace leading to C4 (47nF)? They should be
3) The transistors (Q1-Q4) are set up for EBC orientation on the board (top to bottom) looking at the component side, off-board wires to the left. If you are using 2N5088 or 2N5089, these are all installed upside down.
4) Q5 and Q6 are simply wired for clipping, and assuming they are bipolar transistors, just require the middle leg to be the Base. (E and C are tied together).
I hope this is helpful.
Edit- #3 is incorrect- I had it upside down. Sorry.
So I made a THIRD circuit board yesterday. This one was perfect. absolutely no hairline fractures that I can see. I've never made such a perfect board. I wired it up and.... nothing. The pedal didn't even get power. I've resoldered every joint so many times it's baffling. Now I'm resorting to trying switchig out fresh new off board components. Starting with the 50k Linear dual gang potentiometer. Now since I'm leaving no stone unturned this time around, I've got to ask is there a trick to wiring up to straight lugs? This dual pot doesn't have round lugs with holes in them, so much as just 6 straight peices of metal to solder to.
Also, if anyone else can think of what might be wrong at this point please let me know. I've built many Maestro Fuzz clones from this exact layout and yet I can not for the life of me get this one to work.
Here's what ya do... Forget the bypass switch, power jack, LED etc.. just connect a battery +to+ and -to- on the board, wire the input and output directly to the in and out jacks and see what you get.
Quote from: Jdansti on March 11, 2016, 07:03:49 PM
If there were a power problem, you should still get clean sound on one of the stomp switch positions; however, if there's a ground problem, that could affect both the power and the clean signal.
You should check for continuity of all ground points with your meter. With the meter set to continuity or resistance, touch the meter's probes together and watch the display. This will tell you what to look for when you have continuity. Then place one probe on the NEGATIVE battery lead and place the other probe on each point where you should have a ground connection. Your meter should indicate continuity at each ground point. If one or more ground points does not have continuity then correct it.
Sometimes I try this quick check: Connect a temporary jumper wire between the sleeve lugs of your in/out jacks and toggle the stomp switch back and forth and see if you get sound in either position. It's not as thorough as checking every ground point with a meter, but I always have alligator leads on my bench and it's a very quick and easy check.
So before reading this I replaced the dual pot and the switch with brand new ones, and rewired. Then I took your advice and tested for continuity on all the ground points. Everything beeps so I assume that means they are all grounded properly. Now i get clean sound, but the LED doesn't light up and I don't get any sound when the fx is activated.
Quote from: Cozybuilder on March 12, 2016, 02:18:03 PM...
2) Are the two 33Ks (R7, R8) wired together at the trace leading to C4 (47nF)? They should be
...
What do you mean by "wired together"? the r7 and r8 are in their respective spots on the board, and if i look at the copper side their traces do connect to each other and one leg of the C4. So if thats what you mean then yes. Maybe I need to put a picture up of my latest board and wiring.
There is one spot now on the switch that should be grounded and wont beep on the continuity. I've resoldered it multiple times and I can't get a continuity reading. And this is on the brand new foot switch with a brand new wire.
also. If im supposed to be able to get a continuity reading when touching the red probe to resistors that connect to ground on the pcb I am not getting any.
This is madness. I've aged 5 years in the last two days.
Don't let it get to you! This will get easier as you do more.
Regarding the ground on the switch, the only lug that should be grounded is one of the middle lugs that connects to the negative side of the LED when the switch is toggled "on".
Regarding grounds on your board, are you testing with one probe on a known ground such as the negative lug on your power jack and each location on the board where there is a connection to ground without going through a component?
Quote from: J0K3RX on March 12, 2016, 03:33:13 PM
Here's what ya do... Forget the bypass switch, power jack, LED etc.. just connect a battery +to+ and -to- on the board, wire the input and output directly to the in and out jacks and see what you get.
DO THIS^ BEFORE YOU ADD SWITCH /LED ETC...
connect grounds (-) to your jacks too..this is to test it works before you add everything else,
this will tell you if your circuit is working first...e.g. less to troubleshoot. good luck, you'll get there,..
Quote from: Jdansti on March 12, 2016, 07:01:30 PM
Don't let it get to you! This will get easier as you do more.
Regarding the ground on the switch, the only lug that should be grounded is one of the middle lugs that connects to the negative side of the LED when the switch is toggled "on".
Regarding grounds on your board, are you testing with one probe on a known ground such as the negative lug on your power jack and each location on the board where there is a connection to ground without going through a component?
Thats the thing I've built like 30 pedals and still have issues like this constantly.
correction: all the spots on the board that go to ground are fine.
current status: @#$%ed if I know.
Quote from: J0K3RX on March 12, 2016, 03:33:13 PM
Here's what ya do... Forget the bypass switch, power jack, LED etc.. just connect a battery +to+ and -to- on the board, wire the input and output directly to the in and out jacks and see what you get.
can you explain this in more detail. I want to be sure I'm doing this right and I'm self taught so I don't 'always have the lingo right.
The leg of the resistor that's connected to ground should "beep."
Depending on the amount of resistance....the other side of the resistor to ground should show a resistance value, (depending on your meter) but won't "beep."
explanation.
here ya go...a picture paints a thousand words etc...
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/tester.jpg)
now test, if it isnt working as it should you will know 100% that there is an issue with your pcb only..
sorry if this question has been asked already, but do you have a breadboard? It can speed up the troubleshooting or avoid problems altogether, after I solder up a board I run some wires into the breadboard and give it a quick test before I install it in an enclosure.
Deadastronaught has a good pic for you there, that is basically my breadboard test. Don't forget though, depending on what pedal you make, some might require the pots to be soldered in as well.
Quote from: deadastronaut on March 13, 2016, 01:29:39 PM
explanation.
here ya go...a picture paints a thousand words etc...
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/tester.jpg)
now test, if it isnt working as it should you will know 100% that there is an issue with your pcb only..
I'm doing my best to learn this but again as a self taught person still learning a great deal let me see if I understand this photo in practical use as applied to this particular pcb:
I should wire the positive lead from the battery snap directly to the first hole on the top left of my pcb, and wire the negative lead to the last hole on the right (the ground), remove the wires from all other pcb holes,and wire the input and output where? To help me actually understand whats happening in this photo it would be really great if you could give me instructions that apply practically to this layout:
(http://s22.postimg.org/z8st4caj5/20160313_123524.jpg)
BBP-
Using a breadboard for testing your circuit is easy enough- you can mount pots, jacks, switches etc with their wires on a piece of angle, and just plug in all the connections on the breadboard. If you want to test against clean signal or another pedal, just use an AB/bypass box. Heres my thousand words for the card I just finished wiring:
(http://i1362.photobucket.com/albums/r688/russrutledge/Wylie%20Moonrock/DSCN3186_zps6khwmmkj.jpg)
here...
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/11178619/Other/here.jpg)
Here are updated photos..
anyone see anything bad?
(http://s22.postimg.org/7x6ab43m9/20160313_102337.jpg)
(http://s22.postimg.org/esqiu7y35/20160313_102449_1.jpg)
(http://s22.postimg.org/b5aro5pw1/20160313_102402.jpg)
(http://s22.postimg.org/5m886xsup/20160313_102536.jpg)
Joker, ya beat me to it by seconds!
(http://i1160.photobucket.com/albums/q485/jdansti/A26415A4-2E89-41D4-AE76-42EF9C046394.jpg)
Quote from: J0K3RX on March 13, 2016, 04:36:15 PM
here...
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/11178619/Other/here.jpg)
awesome. I'm going to try this immediately. Thankyou for helping me understand.
The only problem with the battery connection shown is the battery will drain. The battery negative lead should be going to the ring of the input jack, not the sleeve of the output jack if you want the battery to be disconnected when you remove the input plug.
Quote from: Jdansti on March 13, 2016, 04:38:16 PM
Joker, ya beat me to it by seconds!
(http://i1160.photobucket.com/albums/q485/jdansti/A26415A4-2E89-41D4-AE76-42EF9C046394.jpg)
ok so now that i've wired it up like this, I plugged it in and no sound. What does this mean?
what transistors are you using?
What's your battery voltage when connected to the circuit? It may run on low voltage, but it would be good to check it.
Quote from: Jdansti on March 13, 2016, 05:35:49 PM
What's your battery voltage when connected to the circuit? It may run on low voltage, but it would be good to check it.
9.2
Great.
I've traced the wiring and it all appears to be routed properly. I can't see many of the lugs where the wires are connected in close detail, so you'll need to check to make sure you don't have a stray strand of wire shorting between adjacent lugs. Also, I can't see the lugs on the spdt switch, so check that the wires are connected to the correct lugs.
Are you plugging into the input and output jacks as I have them labeled on the photo below?
If all else looks good, check the polarity/direction of the two electrolytic caps and transistors.
(http://i1160.photobucket.com/albums/q485/jdansti/5939FEA5-C50F-4576-9CCB-9F399A5484B2.jpg)
Yeah everything looks good as far as I can see.
I should mention I did farm the transistors out of my previous board (which didnt work either). Is it possible I just need to use fresh transistors?
2n5089s aren't super sensitive, but I guess it's possible that you could have fried one or more of them between the two boards.
Well. I'm dumbfounded. I'm hesitant to make a fourth circuit board and end up with the same problem. I'm getting a clean signal now, but no LED light or sound when fx is active. What would you do?
Sockets for transistors and chips save a lot of head aches! Have you tried using an audio probe?
I have eyeball checked all of the resistors and they all appear to be the correct values. Same with the caps and they all appear to be ok and the two electros are correct with the polarity... doesn't leave much besides Q1-Q6 which I am suspicious of :icon_confused: where did you get the transistors from? If you have others I would try them... You could use an audio probe as peterg suggested
^I agree, but the LED is still a mystery. It's either blown or in backwards. Maybe the two issues (LED and no effect) are separate.
Try connecting a resistor of any value between 1k and 10k to either leg of the resistor and then connect a 9v battery to the two components minding the correct polarity. If you connect it correctly and it doesn't light up, the LED is bad. BTW -use alligator clips if you've got them.
Might check all of the caps in the signal path, I have had a few bad ones from time to time and they can be frustrating..
Quote from: J0K3RX on March 13, 2016, 08:33:17 PM
I have eyeball checked all of the resistors and they all appear to be the correct values. Same with the caps and they all appear to be ok and the two electros are correct with the polarity... doesn't leave much besides Q1-Q6 which I am suspicious of :icon_confused: where did you get the transistors from? If you have others I would try them... You could use an audio probe as peterg suggested
I do have others. I've had those old transistors for awhile. dont remember where from. but i am replacing them now with some from small bear.
I will also check the caps. I've all ready replaced one for good measure.
also, i have no idea what an audio probe is
Here's my latest thought:
Originally when I began debuggin this project, i was working with a board that hadn't been etched properly. It had been over-etched and had weird smears of copper on it. But before realizing that, someone here suggested that the circuit transfer I was using shouldn't have the thin line trace that was going all the way around the outside because it could cause shorts. So for the two most recent boards, I cut the thin line trace out of the transfer before etching the boards. Couldn't it be possible that the first board was just badly etched, and that the problem had nothing to do with the thin outer hair trace in the layout, and that I've actually been shooting myself in the foot ever since by cutting the line out for the second and third circuit boards. Perhaps all that is wrong with this current circuit is that there is a trace missing.
I would post a link to the original transfer layout, but general guitar gadgets website is closed on Sundays.
I often eliminate the thin border trace. I think it is just a line that is intended to show the outline of the board on paper and has no use as part of the etch. Maybe someone who knows more than I can comment on this.
It's probably time for the ol' voltage measurements according to read this thread: http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=29816.0, follow the instructions, and give us your answers. You've pretty much answered questions 1-6 except it would be good if you could post the schematic or a link to it. Other than the schematic, start at #7 after you read the instructions.
Re: Audio Probe-An audio probe is a home made device that lets you trace the audio signal through the signal path on your board. It consists of a guitar cable and a capacitor. You plug your guitar or a noise generator into the input of the board and trace the signal starting at the input until you find where it stops. This will be a point where you might have a bad solder joint, a break in a PCB trace, or a bad or backward component. We'll need the schematic to guide us. If you use your guitar for the signal source, you'll need to strum it often. It might be best to wear it with a strap or set it very close to where you're working. See this thread on how to make one: http://www.diystompboxes.com/pedals/debug.html. This is a good video by Chromosphere: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jWvIfDSxbIk
I recommend you make the voltage measurements first according to the debugging thread and then do the audio probe if necessary.
ok so Maestro Fz-1s by General Guitar Gadgets
schematic: http://www.generalguitargadgets.com/pdf/ggg_fz1s_sc.pdf
voltage tests:
Battery: 9. v
Voltage at the circuit board end of the red battery lead = .0
Voltage at the circuit board end of the black battery lead = .0
(also when i test the opposite end of the battery clip wire that is soldered to the power jack, i get red: .0 black: 0.0 ) That seems really wrong. Could it be the battery clip or the power jack its self?
Q1:
1. .0
2. .0
3. .0
Q2:
1. 0.0
2. 0.0
3. 0.0
Q3:
1. .0
2. .0
3. .0
Q4:
1. .0
2. .0
3. .0
Q5:
1. 0.0
2. .0
3. .0
Q6:
1. .0
2. 0.0
3. 0.0
C1: .0
C2: .0
C3: .0
C4: .0
C5: .01
C6: .0
C7: .0
C8: .0
C9: .0
C10: 0.0
C11: 0.0
C12: .0
so... power issues? the power jack?
Yes, it really looks like a power issue. Has anything changed since you posted the last photos?
...or it could be how you're using the meter. Is your meter set to DC volts and your black lead on one of the grounds and your red lead at the measurement points?
I take that last comment back. You got 9v at the battery, correct?
For starters, fill in the voltage measurements below:
Black Lead Red Lead Volts
Batt Neg Term Batt Pos Term
Batt Neg Term. Red Batt Wire @ PCB
Black Batt Wire @ PCB Batt Pos Term
Depending on the meter that you have...
The AC voltage range may be a symbol like this: ~
DC would be like this ___
......
Quote from: Jdansti on March 14, 2016, 02:51:14 AM
I often eliminate the thin border trace. I think it is just a line that is intended to show the outline of the board on paper and has no use as part of the etch. Maybe someone who knows more than I can comment on this.
...
I recommend you make the voltage measurements first according to the debugging thread and then do the audio probe if necessary.
Just posted my voltage readings. Which is pretty much zero everywhere but the actual battery. I replaced the power jack just in case... no change. Something is definitely causing the power to short out pretty much immediately. I don't even get a power reading at the power jack.
Quote from: Jdansti on March 14, 2016, 01:05:53 PM
For starters, fill in the voltage measurements below:
Black Lead Red Lead Volts
Batt Neg Term Batt Pos Term
Batt Neg Term. Red Batt Wire @ PCB
Black Batt Wire @ PCB Batt Pos Term
Yes i'm on DC. looks like this: V __
----
heres my reading
Black Lead Red Lead Volts[/u]
Batt Neg Term Batt Pos Term .8 (when plugged into the battery snap)
Batt Neg Term. Red Batt Wire @ PCB .01/.08
Black Batt Wire @ PCB Batt Pos Term .12
weird readings. As for changes, yes. I replaced all the transistors with fresh ones from small bear. And I replaced one capacitor with a fresh one. one of the .022s - C8 I believe. I've also replaced the power jack to no avail.
Remove the battery from the snap, set your meter to the lowest resistance (ohms) setting, and place the meter's leads on the battery snaps. We're looking to see if you have a very low resistance across the power leads.
^ Don't connect power to the power jack when you do this.
Quote from: Jdansti on March 14, 2016, 06:44:34 PM
Remove the battery from the snap, set your meter to the lowest resistance (ohms) setting, and place the meter's leads on the battery snaps. We're looking to see if you have a very low resistance across the power leads.
I don't seem to get a reading. It just stays on 1.
That means there's no short. I'm baffled but thinking...
Quote from: bifbangpow on March 14, 2016, 06:50:51 PM
Quote from: Jdansti on March 14, 2016, 06:44:34 PM
Remove the battery from the snap, set your meter to the lowest resistance (ohms) setting, and place the meter's leads on the battery snaps. We're looking to see if you have a very low resistance across the power leads.
I don't seem to get a reading. It just stays on 1.
Just make sure, try this again, but this time also touch your probes together before or after checking the battery snap to make sure the reading changes from "1" to a very low ohms reading. You always want to do this when measuring resistance/continuity to make sure the meter is functioning properly, the probes don't have a broken wire, and you have the meter set correctly.
If you're not using an autoranging meter, try reading resistance on the next higher resistance range, step up ranges until (if) you get a reading. In other words, you might have a short with a resistance higher than your meter's lowest range.
If you do have an autoranging meter, ignore what I just said! But your results definitely sound like a short, somewhere very close to the battery.
Tried it again (and tried the next step up on the meter) still the same reading. (when i touch the probes together it flashes numbers roughly around the 25 range.
Keep going up in range and see if you get a reading ever. Report back.
Quote from: thermionix on March 14, 2016, 07:17:03 PM
Keep going up in range and see if you get a reading ever. Report back.
Nope nothing.
(I did at one point accidentally touch the negative lead of the meter to the enclosure metal and then touched the postive lead of the meter to the battery snap... then i got a reading. I don't know if that means anything though)
Which battery snap? Positive or negative?
Quote from: Jdansti on March 14, 2016, 07:44:40 PM
Which battery snap? Positive or negative?
negative. the big one.
I also just removed th ebattery snap for a moment and plugged into the wall for power. Still no power though.
So the short is either in the power jack, or I dont know...
I still wonder about that thin trace I cut out. I know it shouldn't matter, but I've made this pedal successfully once before and I left that trace in that time. Thats the only significant difference between the successful build and this one that I am certain of.
I am starting get a bit of a "cat -n- mouse" vibe here...? ::) Ok, when you put the leads of your meter directly on the battery do you get +9v? If yes, let's go to step 2. If no, go get a good battery cause this one done bit the big one and died. This is too simple, you have 2 wires that connect a battery to 2 pads on a board... If you test the battery and get 9v and then test at the board and get ZERO then there is something seriously F#@ked up with that battery snap or one of the wires has come loose inside the snap or one of the wires is broken... either way, eliminate that snap and just attach 2 plain old wires to the board, put a couple gator clips on the ends and clip them directly on the damn battery. If you are now getting 9v at the battery and zero at the board then you are in a parallel universe and you must find a wormhole back to this universe or your pedals will never work, ever... :icon_wink:
Quote from: J0K3RX on March 14, 2016, 07:59:05 PM
I am starting get a bit of a "cat -n- mouse" vibe here...? ::) Ok, when you put the leads of your meter directly on the battery do you get +9v? If yes, let's go to step 2. If no, go get a good battery cause this one done bit the big one and died. This is too simple, you have 2 wires that connect a battery to 2 pads on a board... If you test the battery and get 9v and then test at the board and get ZERO then there is something seriously F#@ked up with that battery snap or one of the wires has come loose inside the snap or one of the wires is broken... either way, eliminate that snap and just attach 2 plain old wires to the board, put a couple gator clips on the ends and clip them directly on the damn battery. If you are now getting 9v at the battery and zero at the board then you are in a parallel universe and you must find a wormhole back to this universe or your pedals will never work, ever... :icon_wink:
Yes I've done this and it doesn't work. I will try replacing the snap, but I'm pretty sure I'm lost in the ether.
Before you solder the new snap in, check the continuity between each snap termina
and the end of each wire to make sure the snap is ok.
Not sure if it's been mentioned before but it looks like your power jack may be wired backwards. Not sure exactly which type you are using but if it only has 2 terminals I would think ground should go to the terminal closest to the centre.
^Good point. Any chance we can see a shot of the DC jack straight on from the terminal side?
Quote from: Jdansti on March 14, 2016, 08:27:26 PM
^Good point. Any chance we can see a shot of the DC jack straight on from the terminal side?
(http://s12.postimg.org/c0fgjb8e5/20160314_180950.jpg)
(http://s12.postimg.org/kjyuh2gql/20160314_181005.jpg)
Looks right. Did you have a plug in the input jack when you took the readings? Sorry if I'm repeating what may have been asked before.
This is really strange. Let us know how the battery snap replacement goes.
With the battery installed, and a plug in the input, do you read 9V DC (relative to ground) at both points of the power jack that have red wires attached? If so, follow the red wire that goes to the board. Does it still read 9V where it's connected to the board?
There's a spot on the board where pos and neg come close together. It's difficult to see in the picture if there's a bridge. Check the indicated pads on your board for a solder bridge that would short out your power.
(http://i1160.photobucket.com/albums/q485/jdansti/3B397421-072A-4025-AAA4-EAD2B9563143.jpg)
Quote from: Jdansti on March 15, 2016, 12:43:59 AM
There's a spot on the board where pos and neg come close together. It's difficult to see in the picture if there's a bridge. Check the indicated pads on your board for a solder bridge that would short out your power.
(http://i1160.photobucket.com/albums/q485/jdansti/3B397421-072A-4025-AAA4-EAD2B9563143.jpg)
There is most definitely a bridge there. Should I remove it then?
Yes. Just take your soldering iron tip and gently move it back and forth across the bridge until there is no more solder between the pads.
Quote from: Jdansti on March 15, 2016, 01:12:04 AM
Yes. Just take your soldering iron tip and gently move it back and forth across the bridge until there is no more solder between the pads.
well before i saw your post, I used desoldering wick and accidentally ripped the copper pads of both pads. Am i screwed?
Don't panic! Use the skills you learned when you had to bridge the incomplete trace in the beginning. You might want to carefully remove the two components involved and when you replace them, and then use the legs to bridge over to good spots on the traces.
Hang tight for a minute and let me whip up a quick drawing.
Quote from: Jdansti on March 15, 2016, 01:24:08 AM
Don't panic! Use the skills you learned when you had to bridge the incomplete trace in the beginning. You might want to carefully remove the two components involved and when you replace them, and then use the legs to bridge over to good spots on the traces.
Hang tight for a minute and let me whip up a quick drawing.
I just used some component wire to fix it. and guess what?
IT WORKS!!!
Thank you all so much, but especially jdansti! I have learned more in the past three days through this thread than I have in the past year teaching myself. Wow. Really.
Whoo hoo! I'm so glad you didn't give up! This kind of adventure helps me too because I figure that if I can help solve problems across the Internet, I can more easily solve my own problems with the board sitting right in front of me. It also helps the 1100+ people who've read this thread. Looking forward to seeing the finished product!
BTW- you need to write a new song for your group now called "The DIY Stompbox Blues"!
Quote from: Jdansti on March 15, 2016, 01:34:53 AM
Whoo hoo! I'm so glad you didn't give up! This kind of adventure helps me too because I figure that if I can help solve problems across the Internet, I can more easily solve my own problems with the board sitting right in front of me. It also helps the 1100+ people who've read this thread. Looking forward to seeing the finished product!
BTW- you need to write a new song for your group now called "The DIY Stompbox Blues"!
It's just a 20 minute jam fest with me shouting obscenities over dead air.
GODDAMNIT IF I'M NOT PROUD OF YA BOYO. 5 pages of glory. You made it.
Glad you got it! Had to be something simple.
Who's your group?
yay..... 8)
phew! nice work.
how does it sound?
Quote from: bifbangpow on March 15, 2016, 01:26:19 AM
Quote from: Jdansti on March 15, 2016, 01:24:08 AM
Don't panic! Use the skills you learned when you had to bridge the incomplete trace in the beginning. You might want to carefully remove the two components involved and when you replace them, and then use the legs to bridge over to good spots on the traces.
Hang tight for a minute and let me whip up a quick drawing.
I just used some component wire to fix it. and guess what?
IT WORKS!!!
Thank you all so much, but especially jdansti! I have learned more in the past three days through this thread than I have in the past year teaching myself. Wow. Really.
And we've learned something too, as well as about you:
1- You can follow directions
2- Your soldering skills are good
3- You are persistent
4- You don't take comments the wrong way
5- Good photographer
Thanks for this ride, and I'm very happy that you fixed the problem- it was not obvious by any means.
Tip: when you have finished soldering hold the board up against a light with the copper side towards you. Look at the board with a magnifying glass and any bridges will jump out at you.