Got everything soldered onto the Fuzz Face board and I've got almost no volume and 9.9v on every leg of every transistor and at any point I test on the board itself. Not sure what went wrong but that's why I didn't tear down my breadboard build. It actually works and I didn't want to take it apart to build something and it not work and I end up with no working fuzz.
So I guess I'll be looking for a different board to use next time. Those tiny solder pads suck. :icon_evil: II tried to check them all and make sure I didn't have a short somewhere but I didn't find anything. Probably need better magnification.
Is this PCB for a standard NPN Silicon fuzz? What I have currently uses 3 caps, 4 resistors, and 2 transistors. Is that what's on this board below? Thanks.
https://reverb.com/item/40144875-iss-2-fuzz-face-pcb-replica
(https://i.ibb.co/j44WLHg/wmtpxgtv4i6fepyfbdzv.jpg) (https://ibb.co/XJJ3zVS)
Did it come with any documentation/support, or just the PCB?
It looks like it is supposed to be an exact replica of an original. I would expect you should be able to make it work for NPN as long as you reverse power and ground and electrolytic caps.
Your results seem consistent with what you might get by just putting NPNs directly onto a fuzz face board with everything else built for positive ground with PNPs.
Quote from: r080 on June 10, 2021, 03:41:32 PM
It looks like it is supposed to be an exact replica of an original. I would expect you should be able to make it work for NPN as long as you reverse power and ground and electrolytic caps.
That's what I'm considering using next. What I originally used is one of these. It came with zero documentation and only a list of component values and locations on the ad itself.
It came with 2 versions of the board. One for PNP and one for NPN. I initially tried what you just, recommended on the PNP board. I swapped the power and caps and it didn't work either.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/143181884750
(https://i.ibb.co/3pbP7S7/Screenshot-20210610-145127-e-Bay.jpg) (https://ibb.co/CbySzVz)
Quote from: ThermionicScott on June 10, 2021, 03:40:07 PM
Did it come with any documentation/support, or just the PCB?
Nope. No documentation.
Here's my post from my other thread on this. You can see pics of my actual board and soldering below.
At this point, I'm almost ready to drill 8 holes in one of these and wire the circuit up point-to-point like I've been seeing. I figured as long as I solder on the printed side and not the trace side, it should work.
Quote from: WoundUp on June 10, 2021, 12:08:28 AM
Well it's time for an update. I got my first board done finally and it doesn't work. I've got 9.9v at each leg on both transistors and I'm not worried about troubleshooting it because it was basically a practice board. Let me explain.
When I bought these boards, I got an NPN Silicon & PNP Germanium board to build. Comparing them, the only difference I could see was that they switched the positive & negative leads on the PNP board and the electrolytic caps were reversed compared to the NPN board.
So I figured if I just reversed them from how it was marked, I could build it as an NPN board since I don't have any germanium PNP transistors right now. Well after having to remove a few components and replace them, I'm worried the board is compromised. With it not producing sound and the fact that I think I lifted a soldering pad, I'm just ditching it.
I started the actual NPN Silicon board and have all of the components soldered in. All that's left is the pots, input, output, power, & footswitch. For the time being, I'm skipping the footswitch and wiring it straight to power so it's on as soon as the battery is installed/cord is plugged in. As soon as I know it all works, I'll wire the footswitch in and be done!
The first one not working sucks. I can hear the volume going up and down but there's no guitar signal, it seems. No matter. I'm working on the other one now. I'll post pics of my soldering job in just a second.
Edit: jeez. They look much better in person. Lol. And they're TINY. I've never soldered anything that small in my life. One thing I don't understand is why the holes that are empty still are so big. So you can use larger gauge wiring to wire those things in? To fit multiple leads/wires twisted together? Anybody have any idea?
Edit: 2nd board is soldered and installed. See bottom of page for details.
(https://i.ibb.co/vxFWmYk/20210609-233021.jpg) (https://ibb.co/wNkqCs4)
(https://i.ibb.co/f0kMdXR/20210609-231001.jpg) (https://ibb.co/LpxSd0w)
Update #2
I was going to post a separate reply since this one is so long because I didn't want this update to get lost or skipped over.
Turns out I had the wires on the pots in the wrong holes on the 1st board along with the transistors backwards. The pot hookups aren't 1 to 1, 2 to 2, 3 to 3. It was 1st wire to 3rd hole, 2nd to 2nd hole, and 3rd wire to 1st hole. I just assumed it was gonna be straightforward and didn't trace the circuit to make sure I was hooking it all up correctly. My mistake.(Edit: maybe not. The volume was actually working so maybe it wasn't wrong?)
The new board is done and the pedal is ready to be tested. Cross your fingers.
Update #3 - Fail. I've got barely any volume and 9.9 volts on every leg of eveey transistor. Guess I'll try a different board next time. Those tiny solder pads suck.
Are you talking about drilling holes into the red board to wire point to point? You could end up with some issues, as it appears there is a ground plane.
Quote from: r080 on June 10, 2021, 05:27:10 PM
Are you talking about drilling holes into the red board to wire point to point? You could end up with some issues, as it appears there is a ground plane.
Thank you. I won't do that. That's why I posted that instead of just trying it. I wasn't sure it would work. I appreciate it.
Edit: if I can isolate the legs with heat shrink tubing, could it work? Just curious. I'm not going to try it. The proper stuff is only a few bucks, I'm sure.
How would the heat shrink help with the ground plane?
Quote from: FiveseveN on June 11, 2021, 01:28:24 AM
How would the heat shrink help with the ground plane?
I think he means drill each hole bigger, then put heat shrink around every leg of every component to make sure they never contact the copper.
That would be a lot of work. You would probably be better off using dead bug prototyping if you don't want to buy perfboard.
http://www.geofex.com/Article_Folders/deadbug/deadbug.htm
Quote from: r080 on June 11, 2021, 09:47:51 AM
Quote from: FiveseveN on June 11, 2021, 01:28:24 AM
How would the heat shrink help with the ground plane?
I think he means drill each hole bigger, then put heat shrink around every leg of every component to make sure they never contact the copper.
That would be a lot of work. You would probably be better off using dead bug prototyping if you don't want to buy perfboard.
http://www.geofex.com/Article_Folders/deadbug/deadbug.htm
I've got perfboard on the way. :icon_mrgreen: what's better? Single or double plated? Any cons to buying double plated? That's what I got. Or this stuff, anyway.
(https://i.ibb.co/ssGRHvG/Screenshot-20210611-100915-Amazon-Shopping.jpg) (https://ibb.co/F8M3VbM)
As I said, I was just curious.
Here's the finished board for anyone curious. The red & black leads on the left side were reversed and are incorrect and I know that. Edit: I think I may have gotten those connections screwed up more than I thought. I need to take a look at them again.
(https://i.postimg.cc/Tpx0P9pB/20210611-095413.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/Tpx0P9pB)
(https://i.postimg.cc/BjYBMfMG/20210611-095428.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/BjYBMfMG)
The input header has 3 pins for the usual stereo jack that switches battery power on when you plug in. If I'm reading it correctly, the way you wired it (mono jack and 3rd pin left open) the circuit will never be powered.
Quote from: FiveseveN on June 11, 2021, 11:38:29 AM
The input header has 3 pins for the usual stereo jack that switches battery power on when you plug in. If I'm reading it correctly, the way you wired it (mono jack and 3rd pin left open) the circuit will never be powered.
I don't have a stereo jack so I wired in 2 mono jacks. Will that not work?
I have those 2 red boards. They work. There might have been documents on a website, let me clear some cobwebs.
Quote from: mozz on June 11, 2021, 09:48:20 PM
I have those 2 red boards. They work. There might have been documents on a website, let me clear some cobwebs.
And I was just beginning to think they were trash. I scratched a few places on the board and that plate that's underneath the red layer is carrying 9.9v over the entire surface area. That's about the only reason I can come up with for every leg of both transistors and every other place I check to show 9.9v As soon as I hook up battery voltage, it charges that, plate to 9.9v, including all of the visible solder pads.
They're showing battery voltage that's running through that entire plate under the surface and so that's why I'm reading it at every solder point. I have no other logical explanation because my soldering isn't that bad.
I think the boards are jacked. It may have even been something I did. I won't dent that. But something doesn't seem right.
I also order some of these 2" x 2.8" single-sided boards in case those green ones aren't what I want.
(https://i.postimg.cc/N9JLtycF/Screenshot-20210611-211902-Amazon-Shopping.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/N9JLtycF)
I think your soldering could use some work. I see a few joints (mainly those where you're connecting a wire that extends off the board) where the pad isn't completely filled with solder. And I see lots of places where the end of the wire looks to be making contact outside of the pad, possibly touching the ground plane. That's probably why you're seeing 9V where you're not supposed to.
Does your soldering iron have a big blunt tip or a sharp one? The latter would be preferable for those little pads. I would flow a little more solder into those bigger joints and clip off the excess, checking every joint for any accidental "jumpers." Good luck!
Quote from: WoundUp on June 11, 2021, 06:43:25 PM
Quote from: FiveseveN on June 11, 2021, 11:38:29 AM
The input header has 3 pins for the usual stereo jack that switches battery power on when you plug in. If I'm reading it correctly, the way you wired it (mono jack and 3rd pin left open) the circuit will never be powered.
I don't have a stereo jack so I wired in 2 mono jacks. Will that not work?
That's not the purpose of the stereo jack. It's not to carry a stereo signal, it's to switch off the power when you remove the jack.
If you read one supply voltage on everything that usually means there is only one supply terminal connected. Not obvious to a newbie is that a voltmeter can sense voltage even if no current is flowing in the circuit. The missing supply here is the power negative.
As already said, the negative power gets switched in when a mono TS plug is inserted into a "stereo" TRS jack socket. The middle ring contact in the socket carrying the supply negative will connect via the plug sleeve to the circuit negative supply input.
Socket switching is a standard stompbox thing. If you don't use a battery, you don't need it switched and can just solder a wire link from the middle ring contact hole to the sleeve contact hole and carry on with the mono TS jack socket.
Quote from: anotherjim on June 12, 2021, 09:26:31 AM
If you read one supply voltage on everything that usually means there is only one supply terminal connected. Not obvious to a newbie is that a voltmeter can sense voltage even if no current is flowing in the circuit. The missing supply here is the power negative.
As already said, the negative power gets switched in when a mono TS plug is inserted into a "stereo" TRS jack socket. The middle ring contact in the socket carrying the supply negative will connect via the plug sleeve to the circuit negative supply input.
Socket switching is a standard stompbox thing. If you don't use a battery, you don't need it switched and can just solder a wire link from the middle ring contact hole to the sleeve contact hole and carry on with the mono TS jack socket.
Thank you. I had considered doing that but I wasn't sure if it was a valid solution.
Got the green perfboard in today. I don't know why I didn't just order this to begin with. Is that perfboard? I just want to be sure I'm using correct terminology so everybody understands what I'm saying. Thanks!
Edit: I GOT FUZZ! IT WORKS! WOOHOOO! THANK YOU VERY Much! Thank you all for all of your help and recommendations. They really are appreciated!
Quote from: bluebunny on June 12, 2021, 06:10:39 AM
Quote from: WoundUp on June 11, 2021, 06:43:25 PM
Quote from: FiveseveN on June 11, 2021, 11:38:29 AM
The input header has 3 pins for the usual stereo jack that switches battery power on when you plug in. If I'm reading it correctly, the way you wired it (mono jack and 3rd pin left open) the circuit will never be powered.
I don't have a stereo jack so I wired in 2 mono jacks. Will that not work?
That's not the purpose of the stereo jack. It's not to carry a stereo signal, it's to switch off the power when you remove the jack.
I know that. What I didn't know is that you couldn't just use a mono jack. You also have to jumper two of the terminals. Thanks to the help from you all, it now works!
So.... What to build with all this perfboard I have now? Lol. I'm stoked! Ready to build something else lol.
Congrats.
I'm curious on what you've done to make it work.
Green is perfboard.
Red is Printed Circuit Board, it has the fuzz printed on it. Because the circuit is printed there's not much you can modify or alter, like paralleling resistors, etc. On the perfoard you may do whatever circuit you want. Maybe you can split a board in to if its large enough, and use small circuits like this fuzz or Electra, LPB etc
Quote from: Guerrilha Music on June 12, 2021, 09:11:39 PM
Congrats.
I'm curious on what you've done to make it work.
Green is perfboard.
Red is Printed Circuit Board, it has the fuzz printed on it. Because the circuit is printed there's not much you can modify or alter, like paralleling resistors, etc. On the perfoard you may do whatever circuit you want. Maybe you can split a board in to if its large enough, and use small circuits like this fuzz or Electra, LPB etc
A jumper from the ground socket to the 3rd socket on the 'Audio In' as anotherjim suggested.
I've got different sizes of the double plated green perf. I've also got some brown single plated perf on the way, as well. I think I posted a pic above?
Edit: pic added below
(https://i.ibb.co/gSb2q2P/Screenshot-20210611-211902-Amazon-Shopping.jpg) (https://ibb.co/D9PJcJ8)
Hey there, just wondering if you have any pics of your finished build? Ive got the same board from hyper-ms on ebay and running into similair issues.
Did you skip the battery connection and do the 9VDC in and ground to battery connections? and then jumper from a mono jack the sleeve to pin 3 on the board input?
much appreciated, cheers!