Hi folks, My first post on this forum have been lurking without registering for a while now. I Own a DS-1 and I am sick of the trebly grating sound, I want to mod it myself. But every peice of info I can find on it is people offering to mod boss pedals for you. Can anyone point me in the right direction for info on any Boss DS-1 mods?
Thanks in Advance.
Quote from: nelsonHi folks, My first post on this forum have been lurking without registering for a while now. I Own a DS-1 and I am sick of the trebly grating sound, I want to mod it myself. But every peice of info I can find on it is people offering to mod boss pedals for you. Can anyone point me in the right direction for info on any Boss DS-1 mods?
Thanks in Advance.
if you use the "search" function on the forum here, i'm pretty sure you'll come up with TONS of info....
just search "DS-1 mods" ...
enjoy !
:)
btw...welcome to the forum !
I did search DS-1 mods, but couldnt find any specifics. Perhaps my searching skills are below par. and thanks for the welcome :)
Quote from: nelsonI did search DS-1 mods, but couldnt find any specifics. Perhaps my searching skills are below par. and thanks for the welcome :)
heres a thread to get you started ...lots of specific part changes...
http://www.diystompboxes.com/sboxforum/viewtopic.php?t=29714&highlight=mids+ds1
Thanks, I see alot of references to fuzz central mods at one time they were free I would be interested to know what the fuzz central mods are. can only find reference to them in previous threads though. I just realised I chose the nick Nelson, its Arons surname aswell as mine, hope it doesnt cause confusion. :? :!: :arrow: . I found a cool simple tremelo mod, gonna give that a try with a toggle dpdt switch. So far I have found changing D4 and D5 with 3mm LED's changing stock LED for a bright blue 3mm. I should add I want more of a bass response from the pedal, as I play both bass and guitar.
I was going to post the link to Phillip Bryants Fuzzcentral mods page ... but he's selling the mod sheet now. :?:
Yep, has anyone got them saved on their hard drives?
Quote from: nelsonSo far I have found changing D4 and D5 with 3mm LED's changing stock LED for a bright blue 3mm. I should add I want more of a bass response from the pedal, as I play both bass and guitar.
go re-read the thread i linked to...it has lots of advice on changing bass/mid response...
With the amount of sh1t generated recently Im staying away from that ... and my views on selling schems and mods remain personal. ;)
LOL I understand torchy. The details in that thread are sketchy and with constant reference to fuzzcentral mods. I will strive on and anyone who wants to remain incognito and mail me the mods can do so @ hempathy@hempathy.org.ukNOSPAM.
Quote from: nelsonLOL I understand torchy. The details in that thread are sketchy and with constant reference to fuzzcentral mods.
ummm....heres some of those "non-detailed, sketchy" mods listed in the thread i linked....they look pretty "specific" to me.....
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"scottosan, try this :
C3 to .068 rather than 0.1 for less bass "mud"
R14 leave as is, else there's toooo much distortion, from .....
......3mm red LED and 1N4001 for clipping diodes "
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"D4 and D5 are the clipping diode pair, on the board -->l
l<--
negative side of LED connects to >l side, its the larger bit of metal inside the LED to negative side, smaller bit of metal inside is positive.
cathode and anode
On a new LED the "longer" pin in positive, shorter pin negative.
Try a pair of 3mm LED's or my favorite 1 3mm LED and 1 1N4001 diode.
If you have those switched, it wont "distort" correctly at all ! which could explain your "nasty" sounding mod ?
R14 when reduced just increases distortion"
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c1- .001uf
c3- (2).33u in series
d5- germanium 1n34a
d6- 1n4148
r2- 620k
r14- I stayed with the 2.4k
------------------------------------------------------------------------
I just did a DS-1 mod. I went for:-
C1,C3, C5, C13 0.1uF
C2, C9 1uF
D4, D5 1N34A
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The picture of the board indicates that the two diodes responsible for the clipping action are D4 and D5, which are located exactly in the geographic middle of the board, smack between two big caps and an FET (Q7, a 2SK30, probably labelled K30).
For the least coloration possible, you probably want to not only lift the diodes to eliminate clipping, but also bypass the tone control since it introduces some coloration even when you try to make it as clean/normal-sounding as possible. The simplest fix here seems to be to cut the connection between C12 (0.1uf) and R16 (6.8k). I'll explain why.
The tone control is set up very much like the Big Muff Pi tone control. In the BMP, the signal is split before the tone control so it goes through a simple highpass and simple lowpass filter. The tone control then pans between the outputs of each section to produce combinations of lowpass and highpass output. Lifting the connection between C12 and R16 (while leaving R16 intact) would mean that when your tone control is turned all the way towards the bass end, it would take all the output of what used to be the lowpass filter (and which is now full bandwidth) and pass that on to the volume control. There is still a path for the highpass section via the other side of the tone pot, but for a variety of reasons, what has to pass through there will end up contributing very little to your tone when the tone pot is fully bass-wise. On the other hand, as you start to turn your tone control towards the treble side, you will keep your low end and especially your lower mids, and simply add in more high end for a bit more bite.
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That'll be $8 please :wink:
LOL torchy.
Dragonfly, by sketchy I meant they dont describe it well enough for a novice like me, I have a little experience but not enough to know the effect individual component replacements will have on the sound. I guess I will just have to try and see.
Thanks for your time. I will experiment with some of them, see (hear) what happens.
Quote from: nelsonThanks for your time. I will experiment with some of them, see (hear) what happens.
Ker-ching we have a winner - we need more of that attitude :lol:
Quote from: nelsonLOL torchy.
:D
Quote
Thanks for your time. I will experiment with some of them, see (hear) what happens.
there ya go....
Quote from: TorchyWith the amount of sh1t generated recently Im staying away from that ... and my views on selling schems and mods remain personal. ;)
I guess you kinda just insinuated them publicly. On one hand I can understand where you're coming from, but look at the other side.
These mods weren't completely original, granted. They were the sum of ideas from here, some Keeley stuff, and some of Phillips own work. The schematics he drew up that have every component numbered corresponding to the original pedal are great. And a lot of work. He freely aknowledged were it all came from, and shared it on his site. Anyone who can solder can do the mods. His other mods and schematics have been a help to many on this forum. He helped people save money by doing their own mods.
Then you start to see people making money off your mods, selling modded DS-1's and SD-1's on Ebay and such. And worse, they are now "guru's" that came up with these mods themselves. I'm talking about people on this forum, not lurkers or boutique builders. Some of the same ones who pm'd you for help on the mods. Maybe some of these pm's should get pasted up. I don't think people get upset when they are not credited, they get upset when someone else leaches their ideas and takes the credit.
So maybe Phillip thinks that if people are going to profit from his work, he might as well get his. And the guy who just wants to mod his DS-1 and save some money still doesn't lose out. This forum isn't as small and friendly anymore.
I surprised you feel this way. You recently were harassed and threatened by someone who had no leg to stand on legally, and you did a mass deletion and pulled your vero layouts down. At least Phillip hasn't done that. He pulled two mods down. He did it quietly without drama, or insults. You both have a lot in common. You both have contributed a lot to the DIY scene with layouts and mods for mostly other's designs. He's been doing it longer, and probably got jaded. RG's advice of "don't post it if you don't want it stolen" seems to always rear it's ugly head. Then you decide if it matters to you or not.
How are you going to feel when you find one of your vero layouts on Ebay by the latest guru? Andy is probably going to go through this too, maybe with the Sparkleboost.
Your layouts are a great help to a lot of people, but maybe you shouldn't be so quick on the gun with others. :)
I'm not trying to start a flame thread, just offering my .02.
Pete
WOW, never knew I was opening such a pandoras box. Plagerism is an issue with any intellectual property. I just want my DS-1 to sound better. Don't want to stand on any toes in the process. I will contend though, once information is released to the public domain by the author it becomes free and charging for that information after it has been released into the public domain is fairly pointless as it is then freely available.
my 2 PENNIES. :x
Quote from: Fret WireThis forum isn't as small and friendly anymore.
It doesnt even feel like a forum anymore.
You're right, sometimes it feels like a competition or an ego booster. Sometimes it feels like doing R & D for someone you don't even know. The newcomers who need help tend to bring it all back in focus. :)
Nelson.... relax, no big deal, just a little discussion. You'll probably refine that view a little after a while.
QuoteI just did a DS-1 mod. I went for:-
C1,C3, C5, C13 0.1uF
C2, C9 1uF
D4, D5 1N34A
Oi, that's mine Dragonfly! I demand you pay me $1 million! :wink:
Nah, do what you like with it. Increasing the coupling caps like that gives better bass response and I much prefer the sound of the germanium diodes. I'd also recommend changing the value of R11 to around 20K or so from 100K. That'll give you much more range on the distortion control and compensate for the fact that the 1N34As actually clip harder and so there's more distortion available. You'll lose a little bit of volume, but who ever runs their DS-1 at full bore?
Nice to see the forum retains its sense of humour :)
I was gunna post a link to the Keeley mods page, but apparently he took them off too. He used to have the exact specs for his DS-1 mods right on the web page. :-\
Nelson,
I purchased all the Indy mods //www.guitartone.net. Go to the website and check out the sound clips for the DS-1 mods. PM me with the one's you are interested in and I'll share them with you.
Benny
ok I will PM you
Buying Boss pedals isn't free, and neither is the amount of time that it took to trace out those hideously complicated things. I bought two each of the SD-1 and DS-1 to generate 100% correct schematics. Most of the SD-1 and DS-1 schematics on the internet contain errors...I haven't even seen a DS-1 schematic for the version with the BA728N and M5223AL ICs...there's only one part difference between those two models. The BA728 model doesn't have R40, the 1K resistor that goes between +9V and pin 7 of the IC.
So let's do the math so far:
-2 Boss SD-1, $40 each, total $80
-2 Boss DS-1, $50 each, total $100
-Total $180
Then I took the pedals apart, scanned the solder side of the circuit board, made a component overlay of each and every component on the board, added part numbers and added part values. Then I began tracing the pedals out from scratch, without relying on any existing schematic. You can imagine how long it took to trace out the FET switching section alone, especially in the DS-1, which is more complicated than the SD-1.
Tracing out these pedals and drawing the schematics out first on paper took about 5 to 6 hours each, and then another couple of hours for each pedal to draw up very nice, numbered schematics in a professional schematic drawing program.
Some more math:
-Generating and drawing/editing 100% correct DS-1 schematic, about 8 hours
-Generating and drawing/editing 100% correct SD01 schematic, about 6 hours
-Total 14 hours (how much would a professional schematic drawer get paid for that much time?)
In these mods packs you're mostly paying for these schematics, which don't exist anywhere else, and also for the actual pedals themselves which were decidedly not free. Anyone could come up with good mods for these pedals, but having numbered schematics that match the numbers on the circuit boards make life a whole lot easier. Not only that, but I also include another schematic that shows the pedal after modifications, with the modified parts highlighted. Most modification sheets don't include schematics, period.
I understand that getting something for nothing is always a priority, but unfortunately making these schematics was far from free. But continue to enjoy all the other content at Fuzz Central, which is 100% free of charge, and for 4 years at that.
Phillip
Quote from: TheBigManQuoteI just did a DS-1 mod. I went for:-
C1,C3, C5, C13 0.1uF
C2, C9 1uF
D4, D5 1N34A
Oi, that's mine Dragonfly! I demand you pay me $1 million! :wink:
...feel free to take it out of the money you owe me ! .... :D...... just quotin' the thread, bro :)
Nah, do what you like with it. Increasing the coupling caps like that gives better bass response and I much prefer the sound of the germanium diodes. I'd also recommend changing the value of R11 to around 20K or so from 100K. That'll give you much more range on the distortion control and compensate for the fact that the 1N34As actually clip harder and so there's more distortion available. You'll lose a little bit of volume, but who ever runs their DS-1 at full bore?
Quote from: phillipBuying Boss pedals isn't free, and neither is the amount of time that it took to trace out those hideously complicated things. I bought two each of the SD-1 and DS-1 to generate 100% correct schematics. Most of the SD-1 and DS-1 schematics on the internet contain errors...I haven't even seen a DS-1 schematic for the version with the BA728N and M5223AL ICs...there's only one part difference between those two models. The BA728 model doesn't have R40, the 1K resistor that goes between +9V and pin 7 of the IC.
So let's do the math so far:
-2 Boss SD-1, $40 each, total $80
-2 Boss DS-1, $50 each, total $100
-Total $180
Then I took the pedals apart, scanned the solder side of the circuit board, made a component overlay of each and every component on the board, added part numbers and added part values. Then I began tracing the pedals out from scratch, without relying on any existing schematic. You can imagine how long it took to trace out the FET switching section alone, especially in the DS-1, which is more complicated than the SD-1.
Tracing out these pedals and drawing the schematics out first on paper took about 5 to 6 hours each, and then another couple of hours for each pedal to draw up very nice, numbered schematics in a professional schematic drawing program.
Some more math:
-Generating and drawing/editing 100% correct DS-1 schematic, about 8 hours
-Generating and drawing/editing 100% correct SD01 schematic, about 6 hours
-Total 14 hours (how much would a professional schematic drawer get paid for that much time?)
In these mods packs you're mostly paying for these schematics, which don't exist anywhere else, and also for the actual pedals themselves which were decidedly not free. Anyone could come up with good mods for these pedals, but having numbered schematics that match the numbers on the circuit boards make life a whole lot easier. Not only that, but I also include another schematic that shows the pedal after modifications, with the modified parts highlighted. Most modification sheets don't include schematics, period.
I understand that getting something for nothing is always a priority, but unfortunately making these schematics was far from free. But continue to enjoy all the other content at Fuzz Central, which is 100% free of charge, and for 4 years at that.
Phillip
i dont feel like you need to justify yourself Phillip...youve done
more[/b] than your fair share for the DIY community.....
Andy
Phillip, having read through alot of your previous posts I have to agree with Dragonfly. however being a poor student myself, I cant really justify spending 8 bucks on something I can possibly get for free. I had no idea my post would open up such a can of worms. Thank you all for your help I will update you guys on my success/failure of doing the mods. Plus I am starting the Rebote 2 delay project on tonepad after being successful with their rat project as my first build. This is damn addictive.
Quote...feel free to take it out of the money you owe me ! .... ...... just quotin' the thread, bro
Fair enough. PM me your address and the outstanding balance of 1 kit-kat chunky will be on it's way forthwith. :lol:
Quote from: TheBigManQuote...feel free to take it out of the money you owe me ! .... ...... just quotin' the thread, bro
Fair enough. PM me your address and the outstanding balance of 1 kit-kat chunky will be on it's way forthwith. :lol:
WOO HOO !!!! I LOVE ME SOME KIT KAT !!! :D
I like the mod that = 13.5 ...ha the rest of the equation...lol... :lol:
I picked up the 'ol DS-1 clone board from being de-boxed a little while ago, and stuck a Diode Compression Opamp in it.
Now there's a nice 'mod'...
But I paid Phillip the $8 that he asks....and paid the Indyguitarist for his too...both on the Boss DS-1.
I guess I look at it this way...... the mods above.......actually....weren't even for my unit. But....they were close enought that........ with a hot bath and a couple of "Dos Equis" I was able to study their info..... trace the board on mine... and make the mods apply....which actually wasn't too far off.
I have to say I learned a lot.... and the learning that I did was in large part due to the ready info provided by Phillip and Indy....
So..... strictly my own opinion.... it was worth the money..... NOT just for the mod.... but for the education.
This is what I'd like to know: what parts of the SD-1 and DS-1 (am I the only one who gets them confused? :? ) shouldn't be modified? If that can be established, then everything else is an open playground, and everyone with a breadboard can experiment to his or her heart's content.
Right now I'm using the "keeley advised" 1 Si, one LED. I like it.
What do you think of Ge's in there? Maybe I'll switch? Is it a significant differance?
Quote from: HalRight now I'm using the "keeley advised" 1 Si, one LED. I like it.
What do you think of Ge's in there? Maybe I'll switch? Is it a significant differance?
Huge difference. The GEs clip much harder, so you get more distortion and less volume, but the distortion is much sweeter and more tube like. It's tighter and less nasal than SIs, and less crunchy than LEDs.
Quote from: bryantbrNelson,
I purchased all the Indy mods //www.guitartone.net. Go to the website and check out the sound clips for the DS-1 mods. PM me with the one's you are interested in and I'll share them with you.
Benny
PLEASE DO NOT SHARE MY MODS WITH ANYONE, UNLESS PERMISSION IS GIVEN BY ME.
I expect the same courtesy offered to Zvex, AM, etc, and I have and still do gladly post free mods on here from time to time, as well as pm members with free mods or help.
Thanks,
Brian
http://www.guitartone.net/
Quote from: nelsonI had no idea my post would open up such a can of worms.
It just did :evil:
Quote from: nelsonI cant really justify spending 8 bucks on something I can possibly get for free.
Quote from: nelson also wroteThanks, I see alot of references to fuzz central mods at one time they were free I would be interested to know what the fuzz central mods are.
Yep, has anyone got them saved on their hard drives?
I will strive on and anyone who wants to remain incognito and mail me the mods can do so @
I will contend though, once information is released to the public domain by the author it becomes free and charging for that information after it has been released into the public domain is fairly pointless as it is then freely available.
11 posts and you've pretty well defined what you're about: being a parasitic little leach with the "welfare mentality" that expects everything handed to him for free. Save the "poor student" crap, money's tight for everyone, it's not an excuse to steal or be unethical.
Btw, those Indy Guitarist mods you're trying to get free are from another formite here. Do you want to tell him you can't justify paying for his mods when you can steal them cheaper? Who else's stuff would you like handed to you for free: Puretube's, Mikeb's, Troubledtom's, Erik Miller's, Paul Perry's? All contributing regular's here who make a living from their hard work and inspiration .Quote from: nelsonPhillip, having read through alot of your previous posts I have to agree with Dragonfly
Bullshit!!You either don't have a clue, or could care less what Phillip Bryant or anyone else has contributed. Free is obviously all you care about. And don't play coy word games with grown adults, you won't like how it ends. You claim to have lurked awhile first before registering. Did you miss the sense of community, helping, sharing of ideas, and decency that the large majority of the members have? All you apparently saw was free.... free.... free.... free. This forum has rules, and whether you argee with them or not, it's the way it is. If you think I'm being unfairly heavy, too bad. You just joined the forum, and are openly looking to steal other's work without an ounce of shame.Quote from: nelsonI just realised I chose the nick Nelson, its Arons surname aswell as mine, hope it doesnt cause confusion.
Not in a million years :roll:
Wow, Fret Wire, that was really uncool.
These mods are freely available here. Put in 20 minutes on the internet and figure them out.
For what Phillip is selling, you are getting your money's worth. If you really want to learn though, do the research, trace your own pedal out, and maybe learn something. Or be dumb and happy and send off your 8$ to someone like Phillip, and in a few minutes have a great sounding pedal with the kinks worked out for you ahead of time. What exactly is the problem here? Isn't there room here for all of us?
I've been here a while, but I get tired of reading guys who've been on the board for a little while slamming new folks. It comes across as pretty harsh and unwelcoming.
Also, there is so much melodrama on this board most days. You guys need to start taking your hormone replacement therapy or something. ;)
Quote from: javacody
I've been here a while, but I get tired of reading guys who've been on the board for a little while slamming new folks.
Really? You just accused Wampcat1 of threatening Torchy in another thread.Without an ounce of proof. And speaking of hormones, you did it in a rather bitch kinda way. You defend Phillip, but not Brian. So if it's about your dislike of Wampcat...fine. Be a man and say what you think about him.
QuoteThese mods are freely available here. Put in 20 minutes on the internet and figure them out.
Exactly, if you were thinking, and not trying to play out your dislike of Wampcat, you'd see that was my problem with the newcomer who'd rather just leach.
And if you're trying to insuate something about what I can and can't do ckt wise, pull out your tampon and just say it. I won't take my ball and go home.
Whoa! Let’s calm. What’s really bothering you? Brian PM'd me. I apologized (before I knew he also posted it here) but I'll apologize publicly here as well. I didn’t consider the possible repercussions. I never even considered posting the mods I purchased from Brian. I didn't mean any harm. I just wanted to help the guy out. I think everyone is forgiven now let’s move on. Again, I’m sorry.
bryantbr: nothing aimed at you here. Everybody is human and forgets about things like that. I'm not the forum police either, not a moderator, not my forum. There does exist some double standard with what is posted, but there are rules, like em' or not.
And we can't see each other's faces or expressions, so sometimes things (words) are mistaken.
There have been some events recently on the forum that havent been pleasant. Torchy being threatened by "someone" is one such event. Then the "myclone amp" thread. Like Doug Hammond said, things are starting to get wierd around here. No kidding! This forum is 95% awesome..... a pearl island in a sea of shit. We look at it like a great place to learn about a fun hobby. Others look at it more as easy money to be made of others work.
When lurkers or newcomers see someone do such things so freely, it invites more to follow in their footsteps. You forgot, and publicly offered mod sheets to someone for free. Some of the wrong type of people might take that as normal business around here. Experienced formites like RG and Aron know that if doesn't take much to slide a good forum to the darkside.
I guess that I'm greatfull and protective (too much, maybe) of a great forum.
I already apologized to Aron and Peter. They run this forum just fine by themselves.
OK you guys..... take a deeeeeeep puff.
I think we're done with this thread. :|