Help Design a community pedal (Shimmer - Reverb.)

[Ark Angel HFB]

I think it would be fun to get all active member in a single thread throwing around ideas for a new pedal.

Personally I'm a modulation whore so I was thinking a cool "Shimmering Reverb" might be neat and challenging for everyone.

From a quick 10 minutes of searching I think the best way to go would be to get a reverb... then split the signal and send a wet only signal to an octave.

I think the best controls for the pedal would need to be "Depth of reverb", "Length of reverb", "Loudness of Shimmer", "Pitch of Shimmer".

So first things first... what Reverb Pedal would be the best starting place guys... let throw some ideas around and have fun.

[mth5044]

Do you have any sound clips of what you have in mind?

I believe the Belton reverb brick puts out only wet signal and the dry is mixed back in. Send the output of a brick to whatever octaves (up, down, all around) and mix it back together. I think forum member deadastronaut has a nice delay that he made you could start with. Could add in external feedback around the reverb and octave, just around the reverb, just around the octave  , could add in power supply modulation too.

[artifus]

why not set up a bunch of vst plugins in a daw to experiment with different effects, order, routing and mixing?

[Ark Angel HFB]

Now that I had not considered.... like at all...

someone had there clever hat on today.

[Ark Angel HFB]

Do you have any sound clips of what you have in mind?

I believe the Belton reverb brick puts out only wet signal and the dry is mixed back in. Send the output of a brick to whatever octaves (up, down, all around) and mix it back together. I think forum member deadastronaut has a nice delay that he made you could start with. Could add in external feedback around the reverb and octave, just around the reverb, just around the octave  , could add in power supply modulation too.

A buddy of mine set me the link below... I'd never heard the effect before like that and I thought it was really nice... what I figured was as a community we could make a project that was good stand in for the shimmer effect.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=hmWBQgiqjtY

Hear that high secondary note that come in after a moment... I think it is the 100% wet reverb signal that has been bumped up 1 octave.... I know the BlueSky is a crazy complicated pedal but I really am just after the shimmer effect of that octave reverb.

I think as a community we could strip away the crazy stuff and get the basics of this effect. Hopefully we can find a more simple way to do it... as it is a very pretty sound.

[mth5044]

The BlueSky is all digital programmed stuff. It sounds a lot like a HOG in the effects loop of a reverb.

[Ark Angel HFB]

The BlueSky is all digital programmed stuff. It sounds a lot like a HOG in the effects loop of a reverb.

Then maybe we should start with picking a reverb and try running it into a HOG? Anyone for a reverb pedal they have built recently? Anyone else have the schem or vero for the HOG?

[artifus]

Then maybe we should start with picking a reverb...

this strikes me as backward. your choices are limited for simple diy reverb. brick or design your own from the pt2339 datasheet. there's your reverb. now think about the other processing involved in achieving the effect you desire.

other verbs are available but just consider it done for now. what else do you need?

Anyone else have the schem or vero for the HOG?

i think you may have missed this bit:

all digital programmed stuff

how are your smd soldering and uc programming skills?

this is not to say that a similar sounding effect could not be approximated with common diy parts and skills, of course, the range of available effects may be limited but if you were chasing a particular sweet spot sound it may be possible.

[Jdansti]

I agree with Art that the reverb part is easy.  Let's assume that we start off with Deadastronaut's reverb:

http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=101126.msg914818#msg914818



In my opinion, this would be a good reverb not only because it sounds great, but also because it was developed by forum members. We can always switch to something else if necessary.

Now let's talk about octave up. I'm really a noob about this, but my memory is that I've only seen octave effects that were part of and relied on harmonics generated by distortion to create the additional pitches. Does anyone know of an analog octave effect that doesn't involve "fuzz"?

[artifus]

Now let's talk about octave up. I'm really a noob about this, but my memory is that I've only seen octave effects that were part of and relied on harmonics generated by distortion to create the additional pitches. Does anyone know of an analog octave effect that doesn't involve "fuzz"?

not that i'm aware of - it's fuzz or cmos square waves - but with heavy filtering and the smearing of feeding it thru a verb along with the proposed modulation (vcf and/or vca?) it may not be such an issue depending on mix and desired effect. i would suggest a single pt2339 delay before the reverb and processing that signal before 'verbing it.

*edit* mark hammers woody circuit came up recently - could be worth a look re: processing the 'excited' signal instead of or with the octave?

[armdnrdy]

I wonder if this IC can be used for the "octave"

http://www.sdiy.org/colbecklabs/spec_sheets/8950.pdf

This IC shifts the pitch. We all know how glitch octave pedals can be. It has be something stable or it's going to sound like Shite!

[armdnrdy]

It's no surprise that Mooer makes a reverb pedal (Shimverb) with "shimmer" because they seem to have the pitch shift thing down and in a small package!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ZhM21M8JGE

[artifus]

stumbled upon mooer earlier - not heard of them before. these micro pedals are getting scary good and cheap! http://www.tcelectronic.com/ditto-looper/

[Keppy]

Now let's talk about octave up. I'm really a noob about this, but my memory is that I've only seen octave effects that were part of and relied on harmonics generated by distortion to create the additional pitches. Does anyone know of an analog octave effect that doesn't involve "fuzz"?

With analog octave up pedals, it's not that they rely on a fuzz, per se, but that they get the octave up by using full wave rectification, which itself creates distortion. Such effects are usually attached to fuzzes because they're not going to sound clean anyway. Plus, all the boosting reduces the gating effects of the diodes involved.

The problem with that arrangement in this context is that it's only an octave up for single notes. For chords, it's just a pitchless mess. Digital ICs can solve this through the use of sampling. I don't think analog octave up will get this project off the ground.

[artifus]

For chords, it's just a pitchless mess.

we can just sell that in the blurb as 'harmonic content'

[Keppy]

For chords, it's just a pitchless mess.

we can just sell that in the blurb as 'harmonic content'

Yeah, 'cause that sounds better than "white noise."

[armdnrdy]

I say we pool our resources, (cash) purchase a Mooer pitch shift, reverse engineer it, and implement the technology in reverb shimmer effects and octave pedals!

I don't feel like thinking right now!

[mth5044]

^.... Or just learn to program the FV-1

[artifus]

where's the fun in that? http://www.spinsemi.com/knowledge_base/demo_board.html

[Ark Angel HFB]

where's the fun in that? http://www.spinsemi.com/knowledge_base/demo_board.html

I'm not above learning some programming... $13 for a chip I'm going to learn how to program feels a bit bad but I might throw some money at it and see what sticks...

In the mean time what other way could the effect of shimmering be simulated , without using octaves, since I'm not sure everyone would want to learn the programming stuff.

Is there a way to "fake" or "Fudge" the octave effect that would be close enough for our needs of a mostly clean trailing reverb effect?