Author Topic: DNR Ross Compression kit, "Gaining" electrical knowledge  (Read 6551 times)

Timanator

DNR Ross Compression kit, "Gaining" electrical knowledge
« on: April 30, 2017, 02:05:49 PM »
I never thought the day would come, where I would be watching soldering instructions and amp repair videos on line. With all this "knowledge", I ordered and received the DNR ross compression pedal kit from General Guitar Gadgets. But I think I am way over my head after looking at the instructions on their site.

A few reasons this project will prob be a huge failure.

1. My barely used Hakko fx888d died this week. So I will be using a $20 Home Depot Weller, it sucks!
2. There is no step by step instructions, so I will be using google alot.

So here is plan B. I am going to use the pictures on their site and match components by visual cues. Too bad you cant attach pictures in this forums, anyways, here we go.

Day 1. I matched the wiring diagram with the picture of the built board on their site, and I am going to do one group of similar components at a time. First up is 1uf capacitors, there are 6 of them, and I learned just now from google Capacitors have a positive and negative.





(Also I learned a transistor has 3 leads, had to answer that in order to post this)
« Last Edit: April 30, 2017, 04:36:20 PM by Timanator »

Timanator

Re: DNR Ross Compression kit, zero electrical knowledge
« Reply #1 on: April 30, 2017, 02:26:02 PM »
So here is how I'm going to attack this, first I aligned the picture on their website together so the board is in the same orientation. Then I singled out 1 common component, the 1uf capacitor. Here they are high light in yellow.


Cozybuilder

Re: DNR Ross Compression kit, zero electrical knowledge
« Reply #2 on: April 30, 2017, 02:59:52 PM »
Timanator- Congratulations on taking that first big step into our addictive hobby, and welcome to the forum.

In populating a PCB, its generally easiest to start by soldering the shortest components first- the diodes and resistors, then others by their size, largest last. A lot of the folks here use sockets for the chips and components they wish to experiment with (different values etc).

Too bad about the Hakko, but a lot of us use inexpensive soldering irons, its a matter of technique, and the best way to learn that is by practice, then watch another video, practice some more, and you'll be surprised at how much better your solder joints will look after a few iterations.

Some people drink from the fountain of knowledge, others just gargle.

EBK

Re: DNR Ross Compression kit, zero electrical knowledge
« Reply #3 on: April 30, 2017, 04:26:45 PM »

I learned just now from google Capacitors have a positive and negative.
....
(Also I learned a transistor has 3 leads, had to answer that in order to post this)
You can probably change "zero" in your thread title to "gaining"  :icon_wink:. Stick with it.  Ask us tons of questions if you want to. 
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"There is a pestilence upon this land. Nothing is sacred. Even those who arrange and design shrubberies are under considerable economic stress in this period in history." --Roger the Shrubber

Timanator

Re: DNR Ross Compression kit, zero electrical knowledge
« Reply #4 on: April 30, 2017, 04:32:50 PM »
Thanks for the encouragement guys, but day 1 is done for me, I am at a point of frustration and it's time to open a cold beverage and come back to this another day. Here is where I am, all the cap's are in, Learned Silicone Disk caps also dont have negative or positive. The IC socket is in as well. The problem is these damned color coded resistors. I have excellent vision, and not colorblind. Yet trying to sort these or measure them with a voltmeter is proving futile. Even with finding a site where I can enter the resistance value, there is still no way for me to tell these apart.

Anyways, the site I used to find color code is:

http://www.hobby-hour.com/electronics/resistorcalculator.php

This is where I am stuck, no clue as to what color is what resistance, and how to measure it, or which direction they go. How do old people even see this(And i'm not that young anymore)??? R13-16 are not soldered in yet, they are simply mocked in place based on the best guess.



And here is where the board is right now with the cheapo soldering iron using the fine tip. It heats up too quick so I have to work very fast or the solder splashes instead of flowing evenly.  And I think this is an extra part? Cant figure out where that thing is supposed to go.

[/URL]





« Last Edit: April 30, 2017, 04:47:11 PM by Timanator »

Timanator

Re: DNR Ross Compression kit, "Gaining" electrical knowledge
« Reply #5 on: April 30, 2017, 06:47:33 PM »
Ok 2 beers later, major break through. First up, looking at the Bill of Materials on the GGG site, that list included what parts goes to where on the circuit board. It's basically the instructions sheet, labeled as a parts list.  Second using a Surefire flashlight against a white background allowed me to see the color bands from the parts list. So I just Posted on GGG's facebook page about C15, and all surface is completed ready to connect the jacks, tomorrow.  :D


EBK

Re: DNR Ross Compression kit, "Gaining" electrical knowledge
« Reply #6 on: May 01, 2017, 12:15:51 AM »
Ok 2 beers later, major break through.
This is why there is always beer at my workbench too.  :icon_wink:
Quote
Second using a Surefire flashlight against a white background allowed me to see the color bands from the parts list.
In grad school, I taught a sophomore level circuits lab where one of the initial lab assignments involved reading those color bands.  I personally always wrote the colors down for my students on the scrap of paper that had the generic "Resistor #1", partly so they could do a sanity check to see if they read it right because the test was really about using the code rather than seeing tiny colors.  I had one chroma deficient (the old, less respectful term was "color blind") student thank me for doing that.  It was also pointed out to me that one of the other teaching assistants happened to write the numerical values in Arabic on the same scraps of paper, perhaps thinking it was somehow a secret code.  The students in my lab who could read Arabic were clearly amused by this.  This is sort of a really long and extremely indirect way of saying it is ok to use a multimeter to double check if you have the correct resistor. 
  • SUPPORTER
"There is a pestilence upon this land. Nothing is sacred. Even those who arrange and design shrubberies are under considerable economic stress in this period in history." --Roger the Shrubber

Cozybuilder

Re: DNR Ross Compression kit, "Gaining" electrical knowledge
« Reply #7 on: May 01, 2017, 05:27:40 AM »
This page should help for reading the resistor values:



Edit: I see you found it already. Maybe I'll have that beer now!
« Last Edit: May 01, 2017, 05:29:20 AM by Cozybuilder »
Some people drink from the fountain of knowledge, others just gargle.

duck_arse

Re: DNR Ross Compression kit, "Gaining" electrical knowledge
« Reply #8 on: May 01, 2017, 11:47:46 AM »
buy a multimeter, doesn't have to be expensive, but it will save you a world of pain. and you will need it when we ask you "what's the voltage at pin 5?" to help w/ yr resistors, line them all up the same direction, so the tolerance band (brown on those 1%-ers) is on the right, then all the colour/number bands are on the left. extra points awarded for neatness, ocd counts!

and if that is a spare 47nF cap, it can be the start of your NEXT build.

now, where's my beer?
".... just enough bling hardware to complement the quiet textured slip-proof pants ...." - customer appraisal of last pedal build.

EBK

Re: DNR Ross Compression kit, "Gaining" electrical knowledge
« Reply #9 on: May 01, 2017, 11:57:16 AM »
now, where's my beer?
I'd send you one, but it would definitely be skunked by the time it arrived.  By the way, in the US, there was an ad campaign for Foster's with the slogan, "Foster's. Australian for beer."  Please tell me you actually have better stuff to drink down under.  :icon_razz:
  • SUPPORTER
"There is a pestilence upon this land. Nothing is sacred. Even those who arrange and design shrubberies are under considerable economic stress in this period in history." --Roger the Shrubber

duck_arse

Re: DNR Ross Compression kit, "Gaining" electrical knowledge
« Reply #10 on: May 01, 2017, 12:02:14 PM »
Foster's, it's not the beer we drink round here. (and neither is that beer.) coopers, green, probably. [/off_topic]
[on_topic] ballast point.
".... just enough bling hardware to complement the quiet textured slip-proof pants ...." - customer appraisal of last pedal build.

Timanator

Re: DNR Ross Compression kit, "Gaining" electrical knowledge
« Reply #11 on: May 01, 2017, 02:38:28 PM »
Yo duck_arse

I tried to use my meters on it for resistance, guess just got frustrated with sorting through so many of them. Tonight it's the dials, jacks and buttons. BTW yall's beer selection needs some education.  :icon_eek:


Timanator

Re: DNR Ross Compression kit, "Gaining" electrical knowledge
« Reply #12 on: May 01, 2017, 02:41:37 PM »
In grad school, I taught a sophomore level circuits lab where one of the initial lab assignments involved reading those color bands.  I personally always wrote the colors down for my students on the scrap of paper that had the generic "Resistor #1", partly so they could do a sanity check to see if they read it right because the test was really about using the code rather than seeing tiny colors.  I had one chroma deficient (the old, less respectful term was "color blind") student thank me for doing that.  It was also pointed out to me that one of the other teaching assistants happened to write the numerical values in Arabic on the same scraps of paper, perhaps thinking it was somehow a secret code.  The students in my lab who could read Arabic were clearly amused by this.  This is sort of a really long and extremely indirect way of saying it is ok to use a multimeter to double check if you have the correct resistor.

I have no clue what the method this is, do you know of a video that explain this method?

Thanks.

EBK

Re: DNR Ross Compression kit, "Gaining" electrical knowledge
« Reply #13 on: May 01, 2017, 03:28:27 PM »
On your yellow fluke meter, turn the dial to just to the right of 12 o'clock to the Greek letter Omega, which kind of looks like a horseshoe.  That's the resistance setting.  Touch one probe (red or black, doesn't matter) to one lead of a resistor, and touch the other lead to the remaining lead of the resistor.  Try not to also touch the metal parts with your fingers at the same time or it will probably throw your measurements off.  Try measuring one resistor this way and report back.  (I hope I am understanding your question...)
  • SUPPORTER
"There is a pestilence upon this land. Nothing is sacred. Even those who arrange and design shrubberies are under considerable economic stress in this period in history." --Roger the Shrubber

Timanator

Re: DNR Ross Compression kit, "Gaining" electrical knowledge
« Reply #14 on: May 01, 2017, 03:44:54 PM »
On your yellow fluke meter, turn the dial to just to the right of 12 o'clock to the Greek letter Omega, which kind of looks like a horseshoe.  That's the resistance setting.  Touch one probe (red or black, doesn't matter) to one lead of a resistor, and touch the other lead to the remaining lead of the resistor.  Try not to also touch the metal parts with your fingers at the same time or it will probably throw your measurements off.  Try measuring one resistor this way and report back.  (I hope I am understanding your question...)

Thanks EBK! Thats what I did, ohms for resistance, but i just got frustrated at cant tell the colors. The white background method was alot easier.

:)


EBK

Re: DNR Ross Compression kit, "Gaining" electrical knowledge
« Reply #15 on: May 01, 2017, 04:16:41 PM »
On your yellow fluke meter, turn the dial to just to the right of 12 o'clock to the Greek letter Omega, which kind of looks like a horseshoe.  That's the resistance setting.  Touch one probe (red or black, doesn't matter) to one lead of a resistor, and touch the other lead to the remaining lead of the resistor.  Try not to also touch the metal parts with your fingers at the same time or it will probably throw your measurements off.  Try measuring one resistor this way and report back.  (I hope I am understanding your question...)

Thanks EBK! Thats what I did, ohms for resistance, but i just got frustrated at cant tell the colors. The white background method was alot easier.

:)
The 1% tolerance resistors are definitely harder to read because of their blueish background color, and it is not always easy to tell which end is band #1.  The 5% tolerance ones are beige in  color, and have a distinctive final gold-colored band (For better noise performance, however, you'll want to stick to 1% metal film resistors, which are what came with your kit).  In time, you'll probably become able to recognize the first two bands on sight, especially brown-black (10), yellow-violet (47), red-red (22), and orange-orange (33).  There are some values you will see very often and more easily recognize later (1k, 10k, and 100k, for instance).  I occasionally have trouble determining whether a band is red or orange, and I've had decades worth of experience looking at them.

The good news is that with 1% tolerance resistors, your multimeter reading should be very close to the nominal value of the resistor and allow you to identify it.  (Are you getting a number on the screen when you try this?  Just want to make sure your meter is working.)

For now, I hope you are able to, after some effort, identify your resistors, whether by sight or by instrument.  If you run into difficulty, post a picture of a bunch of resistors laid out in a row, and we will help you identify them.
« Last Edit: May 01, 2017, 04:46:25 PM by EBK »
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"There is a pestilence upon this land. Nothing is sacred. Even those who arrange and design shrubberies are under considerable economic stress in this period in history." --Roger the Shrubber

Timanator

Re: DNR Ross Compression kit, "Gaining" electrical knowledge
« Reply #16 on: May 04, 2017, 08:52:48 AM »
Thanks EBK for all the well thought out suggestions. I will definitely keep those in mind as i go through this project.

Thunder and lightening in Texas tonight, so no soldering, just laying the parts out for assembly. The tabs for the volume pots are removed, and everything is fitted in to the chassis, I see 2 possible issues.

1. The left pot is touching the chassis, I might relieve the phenolic spacers with a dremel.
2. the led is too close to the board, I might raise the board from the floor a bit and also run all the wires underneath that to give a cleaner look.

Here is  the areas of concern, and i guess I need to think about paint for the case.


EBK

Re: DNR Ross Compression kit, "Gaining" electrical knowledge
« Reply #17 on: May 04, 2017, 09:24:32 AM »
Regarding your first concern, you need to consider the possibility of that jack rotating later during use. Will any part of the tip or ring contacts touch the chassis if that happens?  If you need to, you can Dremel out part of that corner of the enclosure (leaving the top of screw post intact so the screw still has some threads to hold onto.  I've had to do that once before.  If I can remember which pedal it was, I can take a picture later.
Found it.  Ironically, it's my compressor pedal.  I had to carve out space for both jacks it seems.  You can also see a place where I had to carve out part of a board to fit a capacitor below it. 


Regarding that second issue, raising the board is a good solution.  You have tons of room. 
« Last Edit: May 04, 2017, 10:17:53 AM by EBK »
  • SUPPORTER
"There is a pestilence upon this land. Nothing is sacred. Even those who arrange and design shrubberies are under considerable economic stress in this period in history." --Roger the Shrubber

EBK

Re: DNR Ross Compression kit, "Gaining" electrical knowledge
« Reply #18 on: May 04, 2017, 09:32:33 AM »
I'm quite concerned with some of the parts on your board.  It looks like your kit came with 0-ohm links (those beige things with the single black line) instead of diodes.  That will definitely be a problem (if you power up that circuit with those 0-ohm links, one will short your power supply to ground -- not good).  I'm quite surprised by this, actually.  I've purchased a few kits from GGG without problems.

« Last Edit: May 04, 2017, 11:15:15 AM by EBK »
  • SUPPORTER
"There is a pestilence upon this land. Nothing is sacred. Even those who arrange and design shrubberies are under considerable economic stress in this period in history." --Roger the Shrubber

Timanator

Re: DNR Ross Compression kit, "Gaining" electrical knowledge
« Reply #19 on: May 04, 2017, 08:20:15 PM »
I'm quite concerned with some of the parts on your board.  It looks like your kit came with 0-ohm links (those beige things with the single black line) instead of diodes.  That will definitely be a problem (if you power up that circuit with those 0-ohm links, one will short your power supply to ground -- not good).  I'm quite surprised by this, actually.  I've purchased a few kits from GGG without problems.

Good eye EBK, thanks for the double check. I have contacted GGG on their facebook page. looks like the "diodes" they sent me are .25w resistors.

http://www.newark.com/multicomp/mcf-0-25w-0r/carbon-resistor-jumper-zero-ohm/dp/38K0323