DIY disaster : No sound

[thermionix]

I got a set of stainless steel "dental probe" type things years ago.  Stanley from WalMart, rubber handles.  The two curvy ones aren't of much use.  I broke the right-angle one (stupidly) prying something with it.  The straight one is one of my most essential electronics tools.  Solder doesn't stick to stainless, so that's necessary, don't get the carbon steel ones.

[Yata]

I got a set of stainless steel "dental probe" type things years ago.  Stanley from WalMart, rubber handles.  The two curvy ones aren't of much use.  I broke the right-angle one (stupidly) prying something with it.  The straight one is one of my most essential electronics tools.  Solder doesn't stick to stainless, so that's necessary, don't get the carbon steel ones.

I actually have some dental tools lying about somewhere including my main one I use for dabbing. I take it I'm just trying to heat the solder and use the tool to scrape the area between the lug and the contact ring and then the solder on the lug side should attack to the hot lug instead of my cold tool (in theory)
I didn't have time to work on it today, was too tired after work but tommoro evening I'm going to jump headfirst into it and try and get this mofo off. I have two spare 3PDT's ready from amazon I had shipped next day assuming that I've damaged the first one.

[Kipper4]

Probably a good idea to order the switches.
Use the tool to try to separate the lugs from the daughter board holes scrape some more away, without damaging the board.
The thing with those switches is that the lugs are held in place with epoxy. Which doesn't always fair well with a lot of heat when it comes to holding the lugs in place.
The mechanical connections in the switch must rely on the positioning of the lugs.

If you can save the daughter board it might save you some trouble. Failing that ring the guys who sold you the kit and ask him to provide you with another daughter.

Then you can test/debug the main effect pcb.
This would have been a good idea in hindsight.
Rock it before you box it.

[PRR]

> It was PPR's idea. and I'm sticking to my story.....

Uh, no.

What I've suggested is, when you have a lead OUT of the hole, but still stray solder in the hole, which refuses to come out, melt it and then run a steel needle through the hole.

Hot solder may cling to PCB but won't stick to cold steel.

While I have probably picked at scraps with a sharp object, there's usually a better way.

[Kipper4]

Just kidding Paul.

[Yata]

Is it possible to disassemble the switch and remove it so I'm just left with the lugs?  They  would be a damn sight easier to remove than just the full switch

[Kipper4]

Failing that ring the guys who sold you the kit and ask him to provide you with another daughter.

Smile, be cheeky ask for a discount since you bought it from him in the first place.
Snip the ribbon off. Start again with the debug from the pcb first, then you know it works before doing the switching and debugging the switching.

[GGBB]

Is it possible to disassemble the switch and remove it so I'm just left with the lugs?  They  would be a damn sight easier to remove than just the full switch

Why not. Can you pry the metal parts off? You could even just cut it open with a rotary tool cutter or hacksaw.

[Yata]

OK new update, managed to free the switch this morning but with a bit of damage to the pcb. It appears a few of hte solder pads have come loose or half of it has came loose/broken off on one sided. I've flowed some solder into those joints and despite the messy pictures (after I cleaned it with iso -_-) nothing appears to be shorting. Input and ground are now showing no continuity finally. I should be good to solder a new switch now right (assuming Ive not damaged the joints beyond repair)
Photos before and after I put extra solder on the pads.

[GGBB]

Before soldering in the new switch, make sure that you haven't removed the plating on the inside of the holes - which is what connects the pads on either side of the hole. If the plating is removed, the pad you solder the switch to might not be connected to anything if the trace is on the switch side of the PCB. Plus, it's really the plating that's making most of the contact with the switch terminal. Trying to flow solder to the other side through the hole basically produces a big solder bridge which might show connectivity but is not reliable in the long run especially since you will be stepping on it. It could easily crack. If the plating is gone, bridge the holes with a piece of component lead or two, and make sure it has good contact with the trace connected pad.

EDIT: Keep in mind that it's possible there are traces connected to both pads/sides.

[Yata]

Im finally giving up on this project
It has just cost me too much time and money at a time when I'm skint, far more than if I had just bought a pedal someone else made. I desoldered everything, tested for continuinty and didn't have a single problem, new switch is fine as well. soldering everything in the daughterboard up and hey presto, my input is bloody grounded again. I really don't think there is anything I can do at this point. This makes literally zero sense to my and I can't see how this thing is getting grounded unless the daughterboard is just faulty.... but the daughterboard wasnt showing grounding untill I soldered everything up. But again, there is literally only 4 wires to the jacks I have soldered and I can see right now there aint any shorts, there is ACRES of space between them, also no solder between any of the lug joints.

I just hope anyone else thinking about purchasing one of these fuzz dog kits with a daughterboard thinks twice. I wish they just offered this kit with wired footswitches.

Thanks for all the help guys.

[EBK]

You can give up, but please don't throw it out.  Revisit it after a month or so, or after building a few more pedals.  You never know when a "eureka!" moment may strike. 

[Yata]

The only way I can possibly see myself having any luck is if fuzzdogs send me another daughterboard but I aint holding out hope. I refuse to give them any more money as I can't possible see what user error I could have made here. We are talking a tiny daughterboard with a small number of components and everything is just going to ground.

[bluebunny]

I just hope anyone else thinking about purchasing one of these fuzz dog kits with a daughterboard thinks twice. I wish they just offered this kit with wired footswitches.

Whatever the merits of a footswitch daughterboard, don't give up.  The daughterboard isn't mandatory: you can just wire up the footswitch directly.

[Yata]

I decided to try and come back to this after leaving the soldering iron for over a week. I built an audio probe but I am not sure how to use it to find out what is wrong. Most of the circuit that I'#ve probed including the tone and sustain pots are giving me the sound of my guitar including the clipping diodes. The volume pot and output have no sound at all and Q4 is the last transistor I have sound from. Everything past Q4 I've attatched my findings for:
Q4   1 no sound
   2 sound
   3 no sound

C12   + sound
   - sound

C13   + no sound
   - no sound

R21  one side sound

R24  no sound

R22  sound on one side   

R23 no sound

Is there any other components near the output that I could test? I'm not sure what to make of these findings as I don't really know how to read every part of a schematic like this. I've attactched the pictures from the instructions of the schematic and PCB

[Hatredman]

I decided to try and come back to this after leaving the soldering iron for over a week. I built an audio probe but I am not sure how to use it to find out what is wrong. Most of the circuit that I'#ve probed including the tone and sustain pots are giving me the sound of my guitar including the clipping diodes. The volume pot and output have no sound at all and Q4 is the last transistor I have sound from. Everything past Q4 I've attatched my findings for:
Q41 no sound
2 sound
3 no sound

C12+ sound
- sound

C13+ no sound
- no sound

R21  one side sound

R24  no sound

R22  sound on one side

R23 no sound

Is there any other components near the output that I could test? I'm not sure what to make of these findings as I don't really know how to read every part of a schematic like this. I've attactched the pictures from the instructions of the schematic and PCB

Where are 1, 2 and 3 in Q4? The schem doesn't show these numbers, neither the board.

Wherever they are, there is something wrong around Q4. Maybe it's damaged (conducting forever), maybe someting wrong with the resistors. Are you testing them With the daughter board connected?


--
Scarlett Johansson uses a Burst Box with her Telecaster.

[Yata]

I decided to try and come back to this after leaving the soldering iron for over a week. I built an audio probe but I am not sure how to use it to find out what is wrong. Most of the circuit that I'#ve probed including the tone and sustain pots are giving me the sound of my guitar including the clipping diodes. The volume pot and output have no sound at all and Q4 is the last transistor I have sound from. Everything past Q4 I've attatched my findings for:
Q41 no sound
2 sound
3 no sound

C12+ sound
- sound

C13+ no sound
- no sound

R21  one side sound

R24  no sound

R22  sound on one side

R23 no sound

Is there any other components near the output that I could test? I'm not sure what to make of these findings as I don't really know how to read every part of a schematic like this. I've attactched the pictures from the instructions of the schematic and PCB

Where are 1, 2 and 3 in Q4? The schem doesn't show these numbers, neither the board.

Wherever they are, there is something wrong around Q4. Maybe it's damaged (conducting forever), maybe someting wrong with the resistors. Are you testing them With the daughter board connected?


--
Scarlett Johansson uses a Burst Box with her Telecaster.

No I've rewired the entire project through one 3PDT footswitch and chucked the daughterboard entirelty. I am getting sound with true bypass just nothing through the circuit.
The 1-2-3 that I put are literally the 1st and 2nd and 3rd pin of the transistor/socket. 1st being the topmost pin when its alligned in the socket (the pcb has the shape of the tranny so you cant orientate it wrong).
I''ve tried switching it with the other trannies in my build which are all identical and they all perform the same. Middle pin has sound (connected to R22 top side) and none of the others have sound.

[GGBB]

This is good progress! As suggested already, something is wrong around or with Q4. You've already tried other transistors, now make sure they have the right pinout and aren't inverted. Also check continuity between ground and Vin and Q4 collector and emitter (pins 1 and 3 probably). Also measure the DC voltages at all 3 Q4 pins.

[Yata]

This is good progress! As suggested already, something is wrong around or with Q4. You've already tried other transistors, now make sure they have the right pinout and aren't inverted. Also check continuity between ground and Vin and Q4 collector and emitter (pins 1 and 3 probably). Also measure the DC voltages at all 3 Q4 pins.

I've measured what I can here:

Vin and ground are showing NO continuity

pins 1 and 2 on Q4 are showing continuity with ground

Q4 1  0.00 (connects to r23 in the schematic so pin 3 in the schematic)
     2  0.08
     3  9.18 (this connects to R24 in the schematic so I think its the top pin in the schematic)

R22 and R23 are showing ground continuity as well

R21 and R 24 are not showing any continuity with ground

C12 is show continuity and C 13 showing on one side (negative)

The input to the board isn't grounded but the output from the board is, so it must be happening near the end of the circuit. For the octabve switch there is a break in the circuit labled 1/2 on the board. 1 Isn't grounded but 2 is. I've triple checked the board and I cant see ANY contacts touching. I really have no idea how this is grounding.

[GGBB]

It is never something obviously visible, otherwise we'd fix it right away. If you can post large clear sharp pictures of the solder side of the board we might be able to spot something. Also make sure those exposed components leads aren't touching something they shouldn't. But the measurements don't lie - pins 1 and 2 as you call them - emitter and base - are shorted to ground - thus the lack of signal beyond C12. I would carefully remove R22 and R23 and see if they are still shorted, and check that those resistors are okay.

Also - the negative side of C13 should not connect to ground - so something around the volume pot is wrong. This may be shorting the output to ground as well.