Vref on tube booster (pedal i designed) is ~3.5v instead of 4.5v

[antonis]

I presume the only person not puzzled in this thread is the OP..

[FSFX]

I presume the only person not puzzled in this thread is the OP..

Certainly has been dragging on a bit.

[duck_arse]

Argghhh...
I see the correct relay contact arrangement. Contact "A" of both poles is the bypass position & contact "C" for active. Maybe my eyes are seeing it wrong?

Yes, Q1e has Vr-Vbe and the relay switches between that and 0v. C2 will pop.
C50's new position at Q1e makes me happy so long as the 100k R50 remains.
Perhaps R20 should be duplicated in the bypass output for perfection?

the relay connections, to my eye, right up close, squinting - were always correct, via those tiny tiny markings - but - they was/is drawn wrong for sense, so all bets are off.

[anotherjim]

^I'd be guilty of that too then. I often mirror the "Y" of changeover contacts to suit drawing convenience. I didn't know a consistent view was a legal requirement. To me, so long as the closed contact shown is the same end for all switch poles and the path follows through correctly, I'm not worried. I have seen some drawn with a normally closed that has to route through to a normally open, which is impossible, but I don't see it here.   
Of course, ignorance of the law is no defence, Your Honour.

[ElectricDruid]

^I'd be guilty of that too then.

Yeah, me too. As long as all the switches are shown in the same state, I don't mind too much which way around they are. Of course, "more logical" is better, but sometimes keeping the switches the same way around can make a right tangle out of the schematic, and it's easier to see it with one flipped.

[snow123]

also - snow's relay contacts are drawn non-sensical. like mr black does.

how so?

Precisely so..

how is it "non-sensical" though?

add a second pole. the now two commons are attached to a something that moves them to make/break contact, but both commons throw at the same time, and in the same direction, as they are on the same handle, actuator, armature, lever, toggle, whatever. so for a double pole switch drawn in circuit, both throws must be drawn in the same sense, that is in the snow123 drawing EITHER both up normally closed, or both down normally closed. one up and one down cannot make mechanical sense, so it doesn't make circuit drawing sense either.

there are ways around this, for the real schematic hardnuts. you can connect the two remote poles with a Z-shape dotted line, to indicate one up and one down, but the line can make an otherwise tidy diagram a mess. in mr black's case, he just says look away if you know this stuff, cause then he can put any old rubbish as fakt. or straight jive. someone new to the sport may well translate the electrical drawn wrong to the mechanical wired wrong, and wonder why their just completed pedal then doesn't work.

further to switch drawing etiquette, if you have multiple poles in a switch, identify them as such. include SW1A, SW1B, SW1C etc, at the very least. draw the switch right and convolute the wirings if you have to, but draw the switch right to start with.

so how would i apply this stuff to my schematic?

[snow123]

Argghhh...
I see the correct relay contact arrangement. Contact "A" of both poles is the bypass position & contact "C" for active. Maybe my eyes are seeing it wrong?

Yes, Q1e has Vr-Vbe and the relay switches between that and 0v. C2 will pop.
C50's new position at Q1e makes me happy so long as the 100k R50 remains.
Perhaps R20 should be duplicated in the bypass output for perfection?

the relay connections, to my eye, right up close, squinting - were always correct, via those tiny tiny markings - but - they was/is drawn wrong for sense, so all bets are off.

so the relay connections will work, but are not technically optimal? just making sure im understanding everything correctly.

[ElectricDruid]

so the relay connections will work, but are not technically optimal? just making sure im understanding everything correctly.

No, the relay connections are fine. The query is only about how you've *drawn* it.

Some people argue that for multi-pole switches or relays, all the poles should be drawn "the same way up" to make it clear and logical. In your schematic, you've got one relay pole looking like it's switched "down" and the other looking like it's switched "up". In reality, they're both switched the same, A to B. I've done schematics like this too because it saves having wires crossing and makes the schematic cleaner. Probably that's not as important as making the switching clear, but crossed wires tweaks my OCD whereas flipped switch sections don't seem to!


'

[bartimaeus]

Argghhh...
I see the correct relay contact arrangement. Contact "A" of both poles is the bypass position & contact "C" for active. Maybe my eyes are seeing it wrong?

Yes, Q1e has Vr-Vbe and the relay switches between that and 0v. C2 will pop.
C50's new position at Q1e makes me happy so long as the 100k R50 remains.
Perhaps R20 should be duplicated in the bypass output for perfection?

the relay connections, to my eye, right up close, squinting - were always correct, via those tiny tiny markings - but - they was/is drawn wrong for sense, so all bets are off.

so the relay connections will work, but are not technically optimal? just making sure im understanding everything correctly.

your connections are good. they are just drawn in a way that is confusing to some people, because they face opposite directions. but when zoomed in, the letters for each pin are correct, and at the end of that day that is all that matters. some people just don't like it because it can be confusing when the letters for the pins are so small (and similar to what mr black does).

[snow123]

so the relay connections will work, but are not technically optimal? just making sure im understanding everything correctly.

No, the relay connections are fine. The query is only about how you've *drawn* it.

Some people argue that for multi-pole switches or relays, all the poles should be drawn "the same way up" to make it clear and logical. In your schematic, you've got one relay pole looking like it's switched "down" and the other looking like it's switched "up". In reality, they're both switched the same, A to B. I've done schematics like this too because it saves having wires crossing and makes the schematic cleaner. Probably that's not as important as making the switching clear, but crossed wires tweaks my OCD whereas flipped switch sections don't seem to!


'

ooooh, ok.

[snow123]

so all i need to do, is move C50 to be directly connected to Q1s emitter? and then i should be fine?

[antonis]

so all i need to do, is move C50 to be directly connected to Q1s emitter? and then i should be fine?

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