I'm bothered by the naming of the Phase 45,90

Started by ulysses, December 12, 2018, 07:47:10 AM

Previous topic - Next topic

ulysses

if the number of degrees a signal is shifted is variable on the frequency of that signal, then for the Phase 45 or 90 to actually shift a signal a measurable 45 or 90 degrees, a fixed sine wave frequency must be used.

now, guitar pedal phasers are not intended to run sine waves at fixed frequencies through them. they are supposed to run psychedelic rock through them. so this makes no sense!

and it certainly doesn't shift a guitar signal 45 or 90 degrees -- it shifts it all over the place depending on the notes played.

so why call it the Phase 45 and 90? Why not "4 stage phaser" or "space rocker"

why use inaccurate technical jargon terminology? the same reason they sold my mom a car with a "VTEC Engine"??

hopefully there's a good technical reason why ;) who knows?

GibsonGM

Just taking a stab in the dark here, but...could they have named them due to some 'ideal' condition where at "x frequency the phase shift of a pure sine wave is 45 degrees" and so on?  Just based on the basic electronic principle... 

I mean, you gotta name the pedal SOMETHING  :)
  • SUPPORTER
MXR Dist +, TS9/808, Easyvibe, Big Muff Pi, Blues Breaker, Guv'nor.  MOSFace, MOS Boost,  BJT boosts - LPB-2, buffers, Phuncgnosis, FF, Orange Sunshine & others, Bazz Fuss, Tonemender, Little Gem, Orange Squeezer, Ruby Tuby, filters, octaves, trems...

mth5044

I would bank on most guitarists not understanding phase shifting at all, let alone what the degrees mean. My name means "gift of God", but am I really?  :icon_lol:

Mark Hammer

Each stage shifts the phase of the signal 90 degrees, above some minima, depending on the momentary resistance to ground formed by drain-source path of the 2N5952 and the 22k (or 24k in some issues) parallel resistance.

Just why the good folk of Rochester at MXR decided to call it the "Phase 90", and not 360 or something else, is beyond me.  But, given that the Phase 90 has 4 stages, and the subsequently-issued pedal had only 2, it makes perfect sense to me that the latter would be called the Phase 45.  After all, isn't 45 half of 90?  Perhaps more mystifying is why the Phase 100 is called the Phase 100.  With ten phase-shift stages (6 swept and 4 fixed), shouldn't the number in the name be different?  But then, "Phase 225" doesn't really sound all that appealing.

vigilante397

I'm going to be honest, I never even thought about it as a reference to number of degrees phased, I always just assumed they thought it was a cool name. Hell, I think it's a pretty cool name. 8)
  • SUPPORTER
"Some people love music the way other people love chocolate. Some of us love music the way other people love oxygen."

www.sushiboxfx.com

DougH

Phase 90 is an arbitrary names. Phase 45 has half as much phase as a Phase 90.
"I can explain it to you, but I can't understand it for you."

Paul Marossy

I get the point, but before the days of DIY I don't think anyone gave a sh*t about the name.  :icon_lol:
What they cared about is the sound.

Josh?

Now I might just have to build one and call it a phase 37, just to annoy people.

Prehistoricman

Invent a Phase -90 such that the pedal outputs a signal before you play anything! Break the Matrix...

Mark Hammer

I have a 6-stage unit on the bench with selectable envelope control of rate or feedback.  It's orange.  Since MXR came out with their Phase 95 unit, I figured I'd make it 1 better, so the name proudly declares, in big letters, "PHASE 96".

Josh?

Quote from: Prehistoricman on December 12, 2018, 03:31:25 PM
Invent a Phase -90 such that the pedal outputs a signal before you play anything! Break the Matrix...

Most of the pedals I've built so far do that already, but they're not good sounds. :P

GibsonGM

  • SUPPORTER
MXR Dist +, TS9/808, Easyvibe, Big Muff Pi, Blues Breaker, Guv'nor.  MOSFace, MOS Boost,  BJT boosts - LPB-2, buffers, Phuncgnosis, FF, Orange Sunshine & others, Bazz Fuss, Tonemender, Little Gem, Orange Squeezer, Ruby Tuby, filters, octaves, trems...

ulysses



bluebunny

Quote from: Mark Hammer on December 12, 2018, 03:40:31 PM
I have a 6-stage unit on the bench with selectable envelope control of rate or feedback.  It's orange.  Since MXR came out with their Phase 95 unit, I figured I'd make it 1 better, so the name proudly declares, in big letters, "PHASE 96".

Way to go, Mark!   ;D
  • SUPPORTER
Ohm's Law - much like Coles Law, but with less cabbage...

duck_arse

Quote from: Mark Hammer on December 12, 2018, 10:02:02 AM
Just why the good folk of Rochester at MXR decided to call it the "Phase 90", and not 360 or something else, is beyond me.

just maaaaaayyybeeeee ...... they were going through a phase .......
don't make me draw another line.

bluebunny

Quote from: duck_arse on December 13, 2018, 07:53:36 AM
just maaaaaayyybeeeee ...... they were going through a phase .......

I'm torn between "LOL" and "ow, that hurt".
  • SUPPORTER
Ohm's Law - much like Coles Law, but with less cabbage...

Ben N

Quote from: mth5044 on December 12, 2018, 09:54:30 AM
I would bank on most guitarists not understanding phase shifting at all, let alone what the degrees mean. My name means "gift of God", but am I really?  :icon_lol:
Don't sell yourself short!
  • SUPPORTER

iainpunk

friendly reminder: all holes are positive and have negative weight, despite not being there.

cheers