Author Topic: My DS-1 Mods ... with sound clip.  (Read 85541 times)

Melanhead

Re: My DS-1 Mods ... with sound clip.
« Reply #40 on: February 14, 2006, 07:14:13 AM »
Good stuff, gulliver.

I started the mods to mine tonight.  For C3, I used the silver mica 0.068uf that was from another location since I didn't have any metal film.  Mine are a mix of Keeley's and Melanhead's.

C1, C10, C11 ----- .047uf
C2, C8, C14 ------ 1uf
C3 ----------------- .068uF
C5, C12, C13 ----- .1uf
C9 ----------------- .47uf
D4, D5 ------------ Red 3mm LED

So far so good.  It sounds 100 times better than stock.  Major improvement.

I don't have any 2.4k or 20k metal film resistors for R13 or R39 respectively.  Is it ok to use "close enough" values here that are carbon film?   I have 2.2k or 2.7k, 22k or 18k.  I do have 4.7k in carbon film for R16 and will use that.  Just want to be sure about R13 and R39.  My hunch is telling me, "sure, why not" but I always appreciate other's opinions.

Cool! ... R13 effects the amount of distortion, lower the value to get more, so it's not crucial to the tone of the mod ... R39 is in the signal path but using 1 carbon film shouldn't add noise much to the noise level, if at all ;) ... The close values will be fine.

Melanhead

Re: My DS-1 Mods ... with sound clip.
« Reply #41 on: February 14, 2006, 07:18:58 AM »
Here's my recent mod with www.mouser.com part numbers. When ordering from Mouser on-line, put the board placement letter/number in the information box for each part. When you get the parts, each bag will have the number on it and it makes it really easy to swap parts with the correlating number on the board. Also, thanks to all in this forum for your help!!!


DS-1 Mod with stock red 3mm Diffused LED status indicator kept as stock:

 [mouser.com part #]

C1 - 0.1 UFMetal Film [5989-250V.1-F]
C2 - 1 UF Metal Film [5989-250V1.0-F]
C5 - 0.1 UF Metal Film [5989-250V.1-F]
C8 - 1 UF Metal Film [5989-250V1.0-F]
C9 - 1 UF Metal Film [5989-250V1.0-F]
C11 - 0.033 UF Metal Film [5989-250V.033-F]
C12 - 0.1 UF Metal Film [5989-250V.1-F]
C14 - 1 UF Metal Film [5989-250V1.0-F]
D5 - Any 3mm LED will light up when playing
(put in 7/64 hole in front of unit for light show)
R14 - 1.5K, 1% Metal Film [271-1.5K-RC]
R39 - 20K, 1% Metal Film [271-20K-RC]

High gain mod:
D4 - Add any 3mm LED in series with stock diode
*wire in switch for on-the-fly changing
*LED will also light when playing

Overdrive/Treble Booster mod (not popular):
D5 Remove diode, open connection (I think opening D4 does the same thing)
*use switch for on-the-fly changing
*LED(s) will not light up

*On a new LED the "longer" pin is positive, shorter pin negative.
*On a diode, the striped end is negative.

another cool one! ... there's lots you can do with this pedal ;)  ... The only weird thing is the "Overdrive/Treble Booster mod" by removing D5 you're only clipping half the signal and this must get pretty mushy and non-musical. I've done this by mistake a few time and recognize the sound ... it ain't pretty  :icon_mrgreen:

vanhansen

Re: My DS-1 Mods ... with sound clip.
« Reply #42 on: February 14, 2006, 10:36:55 AM »
Thanks, guys.  Now that I know what R13 does, I may play with that value some.  It'll be a few days at least before I finish.  I might try a 1N4001 in series with one of the clipping LED's but I'll wait until after changing the resistors.  The dual red LED's make the thing crunch really nice. 
Erik

Melanhead

Re: My DS-1 Mods ... with sound clip.
« Reply #43 on: February 14, 2006, 10:38:37 AM »
cool! ... tweak away! ... use your ears and have fun ... there's no real right or wrong  :icon_wink:

vanhansen

Re: My DS-1 Mods ... with sound clip.
« Reply #44 on: February 14, 2006, 10:56:06 AM »
Yeppers.  :D  That's what I did last night and how I came to have a combo of yours and Keeley's mods in it.  Once I have it all done I'll probably make a page for it on my site, and give credit where credit is due of course.  ;)
Erik

Melanhead

Re: My DS-1 Mods ... with sound clip.
« Reply #45 on: February 14, 2006, 10:58:34 AM »
cool man! ... thanks  :icon_mrgreen:

gulliver

Re: My DS-1 Mods ... with sound clip.
« Reply #46 on: February 14, 2006, 11:39:29 AM »
Here's my recent mod with www.mouser.com part numbers. When ordering from Mouser on-line, put the board placement letter/number in the information box for each part. When you get the parts, each bag will have the number on it and it makes it really easy to swap parts with the correlating number on the board. Also, thanks to all in this forum for your help!!!


DS-1 Mod with stock red 3mm Diffused LED status indicator kept as stock:

 [mouser.com part #]

C1 - 0.1 UFMetal Film [5989-250V.1-F]
C2 - 1 UF Metal Film [5989-250V1.0-F]
C5 - 0.1 UF Metal Film [5989-250V.1-F]
C8 - 1 UF Metal Film [5989-250V1.0-F]
C9 - 1 UF Metal Film [5989-250V1.0-F]
C11 - 0.033 UF Metal Film [5989-250V.033-F]
C12 - 0.1 UF Metal Film [5989-250V.1-F]
C14 - 1 UF Metal Film [5989-250V1.0-F]
D5 - Any 3mm LED will light up when playing
(put in 7/64 hole in front of unit for light show)
R14 - 1.5K, 1% Metal Film [271-1.5K-RC]
R39 - 20K, 1% Metal Film [271-20K-RC]

High gain mod:
D4 - Add any 3mm LED in series with stock diode
*wire in switch for on-the-fly changing
*LED will also light when playing

Overdrive/Treble Booster mod (not popular):
D5 Remove diode, open connection (I think opening D4 does the same thing)
*use switch for on-the-fly changing
*LED(s) will not light up

*On a new LED the "longer" pin is positive, shorter pin negative.
*On a diode, the striped end is negative.

another cool one! ... there's lots you can do with this pedal ;)  ... The only weird thing is the "Overdrive/Treble Booster mod" by removing D5 you're only clipping half the signal and this must get pretty mushy and non-musical. I've done this by mistake a few time and recognize the sound ... it ain't pretty  :icon_mrgreen:

Actually, this mod along with the high gain option is just a version of an extremely popular mod which will go nameless. Some one on this board was nice enough to give me the values.

As far as the overdrive/treble boost mod, this is something I came up with by accident, but think it's been mentioned before. I was under the impression that removing D5 also removes D4, but don't know. I believe I tried it both ways and it sounded the same, so I just removed the one that was easiest. Note, I don't use the high gain mod mentioned, but have a switch to go between the other two. I love the tone of the overdrive/treble booster mod, very transparent with a thin grit that ads a little something to a slightly overdriven clean channel. Also, It does increase the output of the pedal quite a bit when switched in (or out, I should say), so I have to turn down the level when I flick the switch.





Melanhead

Re: My DS-1 Mods ... with sound clip.
« Reply #47 on: February 14, 2006, 12:12:50 PM »
nope ... removing D5 leaves D4 in circuit ... they're in parallel ... taking them both out would give you a big volume boost as you describe as there would be no diode clipping just opamp gain/clip ...

I know who  "nameless" is  :icon_mrgreen:

« Last Edit: February 14, 2006, 12:33:43 PM by Melanhead »

gulliver

Re: My DS-1 Mods ... with sound clip.
« Reply #48 on: February 14, 2006, 08:34:48 PM »
nope ... removing D5 leaves D4 in circuit ... they're in parallel ... taking them both out would give you a big volume boost as you describe as there would be no diode clipping just opamp gain/clip ...

I know who  "nameless" is  :icon_mrgreen:

I popped the hood and double checked, yes, I'm just disconnecting D5 and leaving D4 stock. I thought I was removing both from the signal path for the booster mod I've read about, but I'll take your word for it that I'm not. But, yes, there is still a volume jump.

Anyway, I strongly recommend trying this mod. Again, you only need to remove D5 and set D4 as stock (assuming many have an added LED in series with the stock D4 diode, which may sound good as well). With a high distortion setting, this mod gives you a similar fast attack, compression and treble grind as when using an LED in D5 and stock D4, but the bouncy note bloom and heavy distortion are fairly removed. The remaining tone kind of reminds me of the MI Audio Tube Zone I recently had, but I think it's even better in that it's more radical in terms of coloration ... it's pretty thin with an almost synthetic type grind, what I consider "boutique" sounding. Awesome with my Strat through My JCM800 clean channel. Give it a go.

One question regarding the other "popular" options. Am I missing out not having the high-gain mod with added LED in series with stock D4 (when D5 is with the LED)? I tried this and didn't like it because it was too muddy, but now I'm wondering if this can do more in lower distortion settings, adding tones that cannot be had with D4 as stock. In other words, if it's only adding gain at the top of the dial, I'm fine without it.

Thanks.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2006, 08:37:41 PM by gulliver »

b_rogers

Re: My DS-1 Mods ... with sound clip.
« Reply #49 on: February 14, 2006, 09:11:14 PM »
are there any mods to address the terrible tone control? i have done the led mods and it sounds better but the tone control is either mud, or hollow or icepick...
homegrown, family raised couch potatoes. temperament unsurpassed.
http://electricladystaffs.com/

Kondor

Re: My DS-1 Mods ... with sound clip.
« Reply #50 on: February 15, 2006, 02:50:28 AM »
The book they are referring to is titled, "How To Modify Guitar Pedals" by Brian Wampler.  You can go to indyguitarist.com and order it.  It will save you a lot of headaches and lots of time.  For the DS-1 modification, Brian has listed 5 different mods for this pedal alone.  It is well worth the price $49 and then some!  I used it to modify a Boss GE-7 Equalizer and it sounds great!   

Melanhead

Re: My DS-1 Mods ... with sound clip.
« Reply #51 on: February 15, 2006, 06:47:38 AM »
nope ... removing D5 leaves D4 in circuit ... they're in parallel ... taking them both out would give you a big volume boost as you describe as there would be no diode clipping just opamp gain/clip ...

I know who  "nameless" is  :icon_mrgreen:

I popped the hood and double checked, yes, I'm just disconnecting D5 and leaving D4 stock. I thought I was removing both from the signal path for the booster mod I've read about, but I'll take your word for it that I'm not. But, yes, there is still a volume jump.

Anyway, I strongly recommend trying this mod. Again, you only need to remove D5 and set D4 as stock (assuming many have an added LED in series with the stock D4 diode, which may sound good as well). With a high distortion setting, this mod gives you a similar fast attack, compression and treble grind as when using an LED in D5 and stock D4, but the bouncy note bloom and heavy distortion are fairly removed. The remaining tone kind of reminds me of the MI Audio Tube Zone I recently had, but I think it's even better in that it's more radical in terms of coloration ... it's pretty thin with an almost synthetic type grind, what I consider "boutique" sounding. Awesome with my Strat through My JCM800 clean channel. Give it a go.

One question regarding the other "popular" options. Am I missing out not having the high-gain mod with added LED in series with stock D4 (when D5 is with the LED)? I tried this and didn't like it because it was too muddy, but now I'm wondering if this can do more in lower distortion settings, adding tones that cannot be had with D4 as stock. In other words, if it's only adding gain at the top of the dial, I'm fine without it.

Thanks.

Okay, I'm still trying to figure this out ... How are you removing the diode ? Do you have a switch connected to both sides of the diode or do you have one side of the switch connected to the hole the diode was in and the other connected to tthe de-soldered end of the diode... The reason I'm asking is that what you're describing would more than likely happen if you connected both ends of the diode to a switch to bypass it ... Doing it this way would bypass the other diode and most, if not all of the tone control as well, giving you a volume boost, less distortion and more treble  as the tone control can no longer function... Just curious ... Just removing the diode doesn't seem to make sense according to the schematic as you'd only clip one side of the signal and it would probably sound like a bad fuzz ;)

You're not missing out adding that extra LED ... I had it on mine as well and removed it .... a bit too mushy.

Hope I'm not being too anal, just trying to understand what you've done  :icon_mrgreen:

Melanhead

Re: My DS-1 Mods ... with sound clip.
« Reply #52 on: February 15, 2006, 06:56:53 AM »
are there any mods to address the terrible tone control? i have done the led mods and it sounds better but the tone control is either mud, or hollow or icepick...

Sorry, but I don't know enough about how it works to help out ... But changing R16 to a lower value (  I used 4.7K ) will give you more mids and make it less hollow sounding overall.

vanhansen

Re: My DS-1 Mods ... with sound clip.
« Reply #53 on: February 15, 2006, 10:02:49 AM »
are there any mods to address the terrible tone control? i have done the led mods and it sounds better but the tone control is either mud, or hollow or icepick...

Sorry, but I don't know enough about how it works to help out ... But changing R16 to a lower value (  I used 4.7K ) will give you more mids and make it less hollow sounding overall.

I found this in an older post.  The question was by KORGULL and phillip provided the answer.  This should help you out.

Quote
KORGULL:
According to the schematic I have on file, C10 is .01 micro-farad and C12 is .1 micro-farad.

phillip:
Yes, if you have a newer version of the DS-1, with either the BA728N chip or the M5223AL chip, C10 is 0.01uF and C12 is 0.1uF as Korgull said.  They're also those values in the older version that had the TA7316 (as in the link posted above) . 

Both of those capacitors are in the tone control section, so replacing them with smaller values will alter how the tone control responds.  It should work correctly once again if you replace the two 470pF with the original values.  You can also try sockets for the tone control capacitors to see if you can alter the "feel" of the tone control more to your liking.

Phillip

I noticed a big difference by changing C10 to 0.047uf and C12 to 0.1uf metal film.
« Last Edit: February 15, 2006, 10:05:19 AM by vanhansen »
Erik

gulliver

Re: My DS-1 Mods ... with sound clip.
« Reply #54 on: February 15, 2006, 11:17:53 AM »
nope ... removing D5 leaves D4 in circuit ... they're in parallel ... taking them both out would give you a big volume boost as you describe as there would be no diode clipping just opamp gain/clip ...

I know who  "nameless" is  :icon_mrgreen:

I popped the hood and double checked, yes, I'm just disconnecting D5 and leaving D4 stock. I thought I was removing both from the signal path for the booster mod I've read about, but I'll take your word for it that I'm not. But, yes, there is still a volume jump.

Anyway, I strongly recommend trying this mod. Again, you only need to remove D5 and set D4 as stock (assuming many have an added LED in series with the stock D4 diode, which may sound good as well). With a high distortion setting, this mod gives you a similar fast attack, compression and treble grind as when using an LED in D5 and stock D4, but the bouncy note bloom and heavy distortion are fairly removed. The remaining tone kind of reminds me of the MI Audio Tube Zone I recently had, but I think it's even better in that it's more radical in terms of coloration ... it's pretty thin with an almost synthetic type grind, what I consider "boutique" sounding. Awesome with my Strat through My JCM800 clean channel. Give it a go.

One question regarding the other "popular" options. Am I missing out not having the high-gain mod with added LED in series with stock D4 (when D5 is with the LED)? I tried this and didn't like it because it was too muddy, but now I'm wondering if this can do more in lower distortion settings, adding tones that cannot be had with D4 as stock. In other words, if it's only adding gain at the top of the dial, I'm fine without it.

Thanks.

Okay, I'm still trying to figure this out ... How are you removing the diode ? Do you have a switch connected to both sides of the diode or do you have one side of the switch connected to the hole the diode was in and the other connected to tthe de-soldered end of the diode... The reason I'm asking is that what you're describing would more than likely happen if you connected both ends of the diode to a switch to bypass it ... Doing it this way would bypass the other diode and most, if not all of the tone control as well, giving you a volume boost, less distortion and more treble  as the tone control can no longer function... Just curious ... Just removing the diode doesn't seem to make sense according to the schematic as you'd only clip one side of the signal and it would probably sound like a bad fuzz ;)

You're not missing out adding that extra LED ... I had it on mine as well and removed it .... a bit too mushy.

Hope I'm not being too anal, just trying to understand what you've done  :icon_mrgreen:

Here is the exact connection:

One hole in the empty D5>3mm LED>side pin of switch>center pin of switch>other hole in D5. The remaining side pin on the switch is open, which opens D5 when selected, giving the effect in question. D4 is stock.

Please keep in mind that Im new to modding and dont know flux.  :icon_eek:

Melanhead

Re: My DS-1 Mods ... with sound clip.
« Reply #55 on: February 15, 2006, 11:43:41 AM »
sounds like you've got it wired like you said, to get rid of D5 ... hmmm, anyways ... enough of that.  :icon_mrgreen:

                                           

b_rogers

Re: My DS-1 Mods ... with sound clip.
« Reply #56 on: February 15, 2006, 08:18:10 PM »
ok.. i just tried the mods to r16, c10 and c12..thanks for the input guys. i like the r16 mod but the c10,c12 one didnt really sound right with my setup. its a little closer to "good" now and a  lot better than stock. i havent changed all the caps in the indy/keeley mods so maybe i will do those and see if it helps some more. r16 is a improvement though. thanks guys
homegrown, family raised couch potatoes. temperament unsurpassed.
http://electricladystaffs.com/

gulliver

Re: My DS-1 Mods ... with sound clip.
« Reply #57 on: February 15, 2006, 09:19:22 PM »
For what it's worth, I think the tone control works great with the mod I recently did.

I received my Boss BD-2 today. I think it sounds a lot like my modded DS-1, although less compressed. I'm sure it will sound a lot different once I'm done with it, whatever it is I decide to do.

I have this, another DS-1, and a TS-5 coming, if anyone has suggestions for mods feel free to e-mail me. Of course, the DS-1 advice can remain in this thread as it's appropriate.
« Last Edit: February 15, 2006, 09:41:41 PM by gulliver »

vanhansen

Re: My DS-1 Mods ... with sound clip.
« Reply #58 on: February 15, 2006, 11:50:05 PM »
Finished the mods tonight.  R13 is 2.2k instead of 2.4k, R16 is 4.7k and R39 is 22k instead of 20k.

Now, aside from R13 controlling the amount of distortion, C10 and C12 affecting the tone control, what did all the other changes affect?

BTW, the pedal sounds great now.  Even with a SD-1 pushing it a little extra it's INSANE!!!  I love the sound of the clipping LED's.

Thanks, Bob.  ;) :icon_biggrin:
Erik

b_rogers

Re: My DS-1 Mods ... with sound clip.
« Reply #59 on: February 16, 2006, 12:18:20 AM »
ok i tried a 3.3k in the r16 and and i think it really helped the tone control. it seemed to extend the sweet spot out quite a bit where as before it only sounded really good in one spot (11oclock) now its about 11oclock to about 2oclock. way less hollow sounding. i also socketed the cap across the leds and tried about 10 values 10pf up to 1uf with no sound difference that i could hea FWIW.
homegrown, family raised couch potatoes. temperament unsurpassed.
http://electricladystaffs.com/