T-shirt transfer and PCB's

[AL]

Sorry for the redundant question but I haven't been able to get the search function to work for me in a while.

So, I've been "trying" to make some PCB's with just the laser printer/paper method and it's OK. It works but not great. It's leaving some broken traces and excess copper that I've needed to scrape off. I would like things to be much neater.

What kind of transfer paper is everyone using? Small Bear is on vacation for a week or two so PNP Blue is out for now. I have an Office Max/Office Depot/Target/Wal-Mart near. I was wondering the type of t-shirt transfer that was being used.  

Thanks

AL

[Bob N]

I'm actually using Epson's All-Purpose Glossy Paper Item # S041654 that I picked up at OfficeMax for like ~$7.00 for 20 sheets. It actually works very well for doing circuit boards. Just allow the board to dry well after quenching and removing the paper and any white spots will have to be removed with a toothbrush or a wet finger rubbing on it with the fleshy part (I suggest the latter as I've had the traces scratch off before).

[AL]

BobN - Thank you for the information.

AL

[Bob N]

Just an extra piece of info... I use a sheet of regular paper over the cicuit board and Epson paper when Ironing. It's not a coated back but I like to take the extra precaution with the iron, plus it helps me see the ironing process a bit better. The regular paper turns darker where the traces are when it's ironed properly....

[Pushtone]

Something that helped me get un-broken traces was to get as much toner on the page as posible. When using the photocopier at work I increase the "darker" control and this seems to put more toner on.

Beware, there is a downside... I found that the extra toner can "bleed" during the heating. Sort of how a Sharpie marker bleeds when used on paper. The traces and pads will get fatter because the toner bleeds, or runs, or expands.

This wasn't a problem with many layout like the BSIAB, Scambler, OS-1 becaues there's lots of room between traces. The Small Clone chorus has much tighter traces and I ended up doing that one several times because the toner bleed caused some pads (that are close together) to short.

PS: you are cleaning the crap out of the copper clad as per Tonepad instructions...right? It's got to be shiny and pay extra attention to the edges.

Seen this? http://tonepad.com/photoessay.asp?photoEssayID=10&sequenceNo=1
Just replace the words PNP Blue with Glossy Photo Paper and it all applies.

[corbs]

will any glossy paper will do?

i was going to do some pcb's but was put off the price of press 'n peel

[Hal]

the t-shirt transfer is for the box, not the board :-D.
I've only used PnP...that stuff is kinad tricky.  When it works, its great, but its hard to get the right time/temp.

IMO, the price isn't _that_ high, considering you ususally get like 4-5 boards per sheet (or more).  And I'm pretty cheap with guitar effect stuff :-D.

[Bob N]

I chose this one because it doesn't have a coated back which melts when heat is applied and sticks to the iron. Just about any paper can be made to work, but the glossy works absolutely the best because it separates the toner from the paper nicely. Just make sure whatever paper you use doesn't have a coated back.

[mojotron]

I have tried all kinds of paper, IMO once you get PNP Blue and use it as per directions - you will never want to use anything else. Read my posts on how I got nearly perfect transfers with PNP (from around Jan/Feb) - that method works really well for me - using PNP or Staple's Picture Paper. I think the key is to use 220 wet/dry sandpaper - sanding about 20 seconds from the 8 different directions, then washing the board with pure acetone 3-5 times... Then, as long as I iron enough, it's not a matter of broken traces - but if too long the little holes in the pads start to fill in - but that is the only issue I have left once I preped the board this way.

If you order PNP Blue from http://www.techniks.com/retail.htm it's cheap and much faster than SmallBear most of the time.

[robotboy]

Not trying to hijack, but what drill do you guys use to make the holes in the PCB? A dremel tool? What bit size is the best?

[Brian Marshall]

i use presensitized boards from circuit specialists.

[Bob N]

Hmmm.... Not sure how I double posted... but I did inadvertantly...

[mojotron]

Not trying to hijack, but what drill do you guys use to make the holes in the PCB? A dremel tool? What bit size is the best?

Not that I build a steady stream of boards, but I get a 20 pack of PNP and a couple of 12 packs of #60 bits from http://www.techniks.com/retail.htm and I estimate that I'm set for building about 125 -175 boards. I use a dremel tool with the dremel drill press (about $150 together) - this drilling setup works so well that although it's a pain to drill boards - my 16 year old son can drill out boards with ease.

[markr04]

Not trying to hijack, but what drill do you guys use to make the holes in the PCB? A dremel tool? What bit size is the best?

I tried a hand drill without success. I now use a Dremel with the equivalent of a 1/32" bit. The bits I could find were marked as .036" or so, which is close enough to 1/32". I tape the board to a phone book I use just for this and drill the holes.

[Bob N]

I actually use a cordless hand drill with halfway decent success, though I use a very slow speed to keep the bit from wandering. I have every intention to pick up the dremel drill press kit though... have 3 dremels already, but never got around to the drill press kit....

[AL]

Wow, that's a lot of info. It's very much appreciated. Thanks to everyone for responding.  

For drilling I've been using a dremel. I purchased a dremel chuck and a dremel drill bit set - I've been using the smallest bit that came with the set. Sorry I'm not sure the size.

AL

[nelson]

I use a cordless drill full size not a dremel, with a 1mm diameter drill bit. I use PnP blue, best way I have found, I tried drawing boards with sharpie with no success. I use ferric chloride etchant, dont get it on clothes/carpet/anything else. I use a just under boiling water bath and float a tupperware tub of ferric chloride in it till it heats up then pop my board(s) in and it takes about 5 mins, I get perfect results this way, no need to scratch copper off, no half eaten traces. I think the secret to etching is making it go as fast as possible, so the etchant doesnt have the chance to eat the edges of your traces. I occasionally have to touch up the PNP with blac permanent marker because I either havent cleaned the board well enough or havent spent long enough ironing it at the right temp.