Graphic Assistance for Gallery?

[markm]

Hi guys,
Was wondering if any of you fellas that are a bit more savvy than I with say PhotoShop could give me some pointers on how to size everything up to make my layouts look like this so that the transfer would print to the actual size?




I'm thinking this way someone could download the entire build layout PLUS have the transfer at the correct size.
Any help is appreciated.
    Thanks!

[ambulancevoice]

do you do the actual transfer images in 300dpi?

[MikeH]

When I use DIY layout, I select "render Pnp" and resize it to 36%.  If you're in photoshop or illustrator, you could then paste in a gif of the layout into the safe file (at the original size) and save it as a pdf.

[markm]

do you do the actual transfer images in 300dpi?

The image is saved into DIY Creator at 72dpi and the transfer is the same as well.

When I use DIY layout, I select "render Pnp" and resize it to 36%.  If you're in photoshop or illustrator, you could then paste in a gif of the layout into the safe file (at the original size) and save it as a pdf.

Problem is, the Gallery here will not accept PDFs. 
I'm just trying to make this a bit easier for both myself and others, that's all.
Besides, it would look cool that way to huh! 

[ambulancevoice]

do it like this
create a new file
type in the size of the actual pcb transfer (do it in mm or cm, not pixels)
go down to "resolution" and type 300 instead of 72
and try that

[markm]

Okeee-Dokeee.
I'll give that a whirl and see.
Many thanks!

[ambulancevoice]

no prob!

[ulysses]

i can tell you how i do it

you need to create a new image in photoshop - in the new image presets you will find the set sizes for A4, Letter and other sizes - I use A4 as thats the default paper size in Aus.

in the photoshop preferences set your rulers to mm.

then turn on rulers so you can get a rough idea of many mm your image is.

then select the move control from the tool bar (to move layers around) and select "show transform controls" from the above menu.

then you need to use the (now showing) transform controls to resize your image untill it is exactly how large you want it.

you will need to print it off and do a comparison to real life

i find a good way to do it the comparison is to use a standard opamp dip-8 - if all 8 legs line up on the printed page then you are in business.

if you have any more questions or require a further tutiorial i may be able to do one when i get a bit more time.

cheers
ulysses

[markm]

I'm not sure if you guys know what I'm trying to do here......
I'd like to put the transfer image actual size right onto the same page as the PCB layout sheet and have it print actual size when downloaded from the gallery......perhaps it isn't possible to do without losing detail of the PCB transfer.....

[RLBJR65]

I'm interested too!
It's funny I can do it and make them print out perfectly for me however if someone else tries they never come out right !?!
So far I've just done stuff with MS Paint easy to use but not so good at resizing.

I've been playing around with GIMP http://www.gimp.org/  It's gonna take me awhile to figure it out. My 16 year old could probably teach me, if I could get her off the internet and phone long enough lol.

[Pushtone]

You could do what JD does over at GGG and use GIF images with a conversion step expected of the end user.
The major advantage is file size can be extremely small.


Get a 300 dpi layout going in PS with the correct scale.
This IMAGES SIZE dialogue box from PS shows us the image is exactly one inch by one inch and at 300 dpi (dots per inch)




When your ready to export do a SAVE AS and choose gif file type.
GIFs can only be 72dpi. After converting to gif your image will print huge
as the same number of pixels are still there but now they are spread out.
Here is the IMAGE SIZE dialog box again. See, the image is now 4 inches by 4 inches when converted to 72dpi.




It's now up to the end user to convert it from 72dpi to 300dpi by reversing the conversion.
They simply need to replace 72dpi with 300, click OK and the image will be exactly 1x1 again.
Nothing changed, nothing lost. The pixels are just pack closer together.




Its like an encode/decode system.

Note that this only works when the "RE-SAMPLE IMAGE" checkbox is NOT CHECKED (deactivate).

Your other choices would be to post 300dpi images in jpeg or tiff formats. OR even BMP,
Problem is file sizes can grow fast as layout get big.
You could use 150dpi instead of 300 to lower the file sizes of JPEG and still get OK print quality. Good enough for basic layouts.
300dpi is excellent print quality.



Here is a 1 inch x 1 inch mock up layout in gif format. Its 4k in file size




Here is the same layout saves as a 300dpi JPEG. Its almost 30k.
Even when saves at the most amount of compression which has the side effect of bluring the edges of the traces.




They look the same on your screen because your computer monitor can display a max of 72 dpi.
But if you where to save these and print them out the gif would print at 4"x4" and the JPEG would print exactly at 1"x1".

Convert the GIF to 300dpi and then print and you have your layout scaled properly and with nice sharp traces (no compression effect).


Its not ideal, that why JD is moving to PDFs.

[markm]

Pushtone,
Thank you for that wealth of info!
This could be very helpful as well and I'll see if I can do something with it.
Thanks again, Much appreciated! 

[toneman]

How about puting registration marks on the drawing???

Like 2 marks that show, say 2inches full scale for width,
and 2 other marks that show, say 1.5inches full scale for height.

This way, anyone can adjust their printer printing, and dpi, and pixels...whatever,
to achieve the desired size on the PNP or photopaper or whatever.
If the layout has IC's, center-2-center on the pins is .1inch  (that's point one, or one tenth of an inch)

OR,   use a vector program like Acrobat Pro or Visio or CorelDraw.

afn
T

[markm]

How about puting registration marks on the drawing???

Like 2 marks that show, say 2inches full scale for width,
and 2 other marks that show, say 1.5inches full scale for height.

This way, anyone can adjust their printer printing, and dpi, and pixels...whatever,
to achieve the desired size on the PNP or photopaper or whatever.
If the layout has IC's, center-2-center on the pins is .1inch  (that's point one, or one tenth of an inch)

afn
T

Well, I have been putting the dimensions on the PCB transfers for a while now, just thought that if the physical layout itself and the PCB transfer could be printed out on the same page would be cool.....not to mention easier!

[Pushtone]

OR,   use a vector program like Acrobat Pro or Visio or CorelDraw.
afn
T

Yes, your right, vector is best and the most universal file format for that is PDF.
All those apps, Acrobat Pro or Visio or CorelDraw, can open and edit PDFs.
Anyone can display and print PDFs. It's the best way to go.

Maybe try and get it as an up-loadable format. Whats the deal?



Alternatively,
There's nothing stoping you from posting a 8.5" x 11", 200dpi JPEG except the file size.

I just whipped up a mockup and it looks like the file size would be around 200 - 300k for a black and white 8x11 page printout with medium file compression.
Big but not enormous file size. Limited to one page print out.

A scale in the image, like on a map, would confirm the printout is to scale. MM and inches please.


1. PDF is wysiwyg.
2. GIF is a exact conversion.
3. 8x11, greyscale, 200dpi JPEG is your last resort. It will print to scale and be a one page project with diagrams. Text will look just OK, readable.

[stm]

Please notice the layout itself as shown is wrong.  The input and output are hard wired (except for the input and outpu caps).  As I understand it, the output should be taken from the central pin of the JFET (SOURCE) instead of the bottom pin (GATE).

My contribution here is to use PNG file format.  It is *extremely compact*, loseless (as oppossed to JPEG), and allows proper specification of the DPI to achieve proper size when printing.  Much better than GIF and BMP!

[choklitlove]

My contribution here is to use PNG file format.  It is *extremely compact*, loseless (as oppossed to JPEG), and allows proper specification of the DPI to achieve proper size when printing.  Much better than GIF and BMP!

i've been using nothing but PNGs lately.  i haven't found one bad thing about them yet.

[markm]

Thanks stm for both tidbits of info.....
I don't think I could use png here for the gallery though, I don't think it will accept that format.

[mydementia]

You know, most folks who use PNP Blue will have to convert a conglomorate image to the PCB 'only' when they are putting their sheet together ($2 a sheet is too much for making one at a time...especially when you make your PNP Blue 'copies' at work and are afraid of the trimmed film getting stuck... what, just me?  ).  When I make a layout using DIYLC (we really need to standardize that acronym) I export the layout file as the .gif and take the PCB into MSPaint for 'buildup'.  Then I save the MSPaint file as a .bmp file for future use.  When I use the PNP, I stick it in my cheap Costco photoshop-esque program full size, then verify the hole-to-hole distance is 0.1" using a 0.1" x 0.1" box.  99% of the time, it comes in perfectly (the off 1% happens when I screw something up in MSPaint!).  I think most people's problems with printing PNP layouts is that they don't uncheck 'scale to fit' in their printer preferences. 

Here's an example in the gallery of one of my layout/pnp's - http://aronnelson.com/gallery/BassBoy-59

Much of the time, I'll make myself a project file that includes the schematic, layout, and PCB reference for build notes and completeness - since I don't 'own' any of the schematics and would never post them with my layouts (unless the designer approves) I don't share those... just a link to the original schematic (which I think is highly lacking in the layout gallery).  As nice as it is to be able to 'paint by numbers' we builders need to be able to troubleshoot our own builds...  the only way we'll learn! 

Hope this helps.
Mike