silicon fuzz face vero check!..

[deadastronaut]

I have made a few FF vero layouts and a tag layout...You can find them in my gallery
http://www.aronnelson.com/gallery/main.php/v/Renegadrian/?g2_page=11

thanks adriano...i am in the process of  teaching myself how to read schematics then convert it to a vero etc..

i thought i would try my own design rather than replicate what has already been done before...brave but

i fancied putting in a bit more thought than the painting by numbers approach..this obviously hasnt paid off..lol..

but hey i'm learning in the process..thnaks man..i'll probably end up doinfg one of yours anyway...thanks again..

btw which one of yours is the most hi gain sustainy..but tip negative vero you have there?..

[deadastronaut]

 I can't tell which is a collector/E or base there.
 But still I don't see two matching voltages anywhere [Q1 C and Q2 B should be connected, Q1 I don't see any that can be a grounded emitter either [0.0v].
 Designating C/B/Emitter makes it possible to read the voltage notes, but the above notes probably work from what I could glean from the numbers anyway.

cheers pete...i'll read them again and post the c b e 's......

[Renegadrian]

I have made a few FF vero layouts and a tag layout...You can find them in my gallery
http://www.aronnelson.com/gallery/main.php/v/Renegadrian/?g2_page=11

thanks adriano...i am in the process of  teaching myself how to read schematics then convert it to a vero etc..

i thought i would try my own design rather than replicate what has already been done before...brave but

i fancied putting in a bit more thought than the painting by numbers approach..this obviously hasnt paid off..lol..

but hey i'm learning in the process..thnaks man..i'll probably end up doinfg one of yours anyway...thanks again..

btw which one of yours is the most hi gain sustainy..but tip negative vero you have there?..

Rob, yeah keep doing your layout, I enjoy a lot doing it, more relaxing than online sudoku...I try to make the layouts as small as I can, and now trying to incorporate millenium 2. I used another layout for the FF, but the 7 holes wide was created just because I had a 7 holes leftover vero board lying around and I said "A FF must fit in this board!!!" so I went...
Keep on pratcicing with layouts, you can be the next torchy!!! (his vero vault is very good...)

[Derringer]

go over the board with a magnifying glass

check all of your trace cuts, make sure they're cut all they way, cut them all a little bit deeper if you can. I use a rotary tool with a spike-y grinding bit on these

clean up any suspicious looking solder joints

[petemoore]

  Lookin' ata buncha schemata: an indespensible exposure for circuit-learners.
  Repeating configurations soon become apparent, like...all the gain stages that have emitter 'close' to ground, collector toward PS, how source = emitter isn't exactly true but still they both tend to end up very near' ground.
 Not just that but there's bunches of components and some do this and that...kind of like reading music, until you play them a bit, the reads don't relate to tones and not much beyond the title and how many notes per measure from info-sheet gets soaked up.
 Learning to read a schematic gets deeper with data sheets right there, GEO or Elliot Sound [or other online resource] also on the screen at the time.
  Understanding the difference between AC and DC.
  What jobs caps do when high or low frequency AC's are applied..this bit is reversey, how can same cap can make HP or LP filter.
  How DC is wrestled out of 60cycle AC.
  Itallicized because caps do many different things, the above AC conversion to DC being a multi-faceted study all in itself, as are the other things caps/diodes etc. may be pressed into service to do.
  How DC is used for high current AC amplifier so you can motorize/control air pressure waves [requires transducer] and hear mixed frequencies of source input'd.
 To read a schematic beyond node-counts/polarity requires other papers be involved, having both the diagram and descriptions of anything on the diagram handy as sheets on a screen or on papers may increase the depth-prehension of any schematic.
  The large lions share of electronic circuits have stuff in common with common electronic circuits.
   

[deadastronaut]

go over the board with a magnifying glass

check all of your trace cuts, make sure they're cut all they way, cut them all a little bit deeper if you can. I use a rotary tool with a spike-y grinding bit on these

clean up any suspicious looking solder joints

yep am doing that right now.....cheers man...and it was all going so well too....lol...


@adriano...what is the best gainy vero of yours?...

[Renegadrian]

@adriano...what is the best gainy vero of yours?...

well, they all sound the same, as they have the same BoM...The way the components are layed is the only difference...
PS I found a good sound with bcxxx, 547b sound good, also 237 and 337 I recycled from an old board...
237 can give a good gain but not so "noisy" as 108...

[deadastronaut]

cheers man....i'll check em out..thanks again....


my layout is ok isnt it?..

[deadastronaut]

@adriano...what is the best gainy vero of yours?...

well, they all sound the same, as they have the same BoM...The way the components are layed is the only difference...
PS I found a good sound with bcxxx, 547b sound good, also 237 and 337 I recycled from an old board...
237 can give a good gain but not so "noisy" as 108...

adriano..is my layout ok do you think?...thanks man.

[Renegadrian]

adriano..is my layout ok do you think?...thanks man.

You mean the one with the bias pot!? Yeah it should work (I'd wire the other pin of the pot too, so two and one)
1k for that resistor!? Maybe that could bring volume down too much?! Usually you see a 330-470 ohm there...
It seems correct anyway  

[deadastronaut]

adriano..is my layout ok do you think?...thanks man.

You mean the one with the bias pot!? Yeah it should work (I'd wire the other pin of the pot too, so two and one)
1k for that resistor!? Maybe that could bring volume down too much?! Usually you see a 330-470 ohm there...
It seems correct anyway  

yeah that one...cheers....so the bias pot pins 1 and 2 together?..maybe..

on my schematic it says 8.2k going to  q2..just replaced with the pot.....( google images ..npn silicon fuzz face.) thats the one.

[Renegadrian]

on my schematic it says 8.2k going to  q2..just replaced with the pot.....( google images ..npn silicon fuzz face.) thats the one.

I once built one with a 10k trimmer instead of that res. - it helps sometimes

[deadastronaut]

on my schematic it says 8.2k going to  q2..just replaced with the pot.....( google images ..npn silicon fuzz face.) thats the one.

I once built one with a 10k trimmer instead of that res. - it helps sometimes

hi adriano..yeah thats why i wanted the bias pot...instead of the 8.2k...messed around with it on my bread board
and it worked fine...got some mad sounds with the bias offset......
had a look in ya gallery..some cool projects in there..so you mostly use vero then?..

oh and i love the valve pedals too....ever kicked a valve off though?...looks like you have to be a bit careful....

rob.

[Renegadrian]

Yes Rob, I definitely am a VERO boy...As for the tube standing out of the pedal, yeah some extra attention but no valve has been kicked...

[deadastronaut]

.

[Renegadrian]

I used that layout once, it is verified and working. Measure the hFE and also check the pots values...That's what comes in mind at first. desolder the two wires from the pot and wire a flying 8.k res and see/hear what happens...

[deadastronaut]

cheers adriano...i should've used yours i think..

but hey, at least i know this is verified...yep i'll check the q's....

ive got the pots on clip leads just in case of problems...

i cant believe this little circuit is being such a pain...

ive built boogies/chorus/echo's and various distortions...all without problems...

but this little bugger is another story........

cheers man....

[deadastronaut]

heres my q's voltages......

bc108's

q1..

c 1.27
b 0.59
e -0.00

q2

c 2.02
b1.27
e 0.66
..........................


2n3904's
q1

c 1.45
b 0.57
e -0.00

q2

c 0.86
b 1.45
e 0.81
.....................................

bc109'

q1

c 1.18
b 0.56
e -0.00

q2

c 2.65
b 1.19
0.61

...........................

what is the ideal hfe for the npn ff ?....

[Renegadrian]

Well, FF is a pedal on its own...I believe that there a great article on it on Geofex?! Anyway, lots of people claim to know where the mojo lies, while basically you can have a great pedal with different non mojo parts.
Si FF spotted BC108. I used some in the ones I built, but the more FF I build the more I flavour different trannies, last ones are bc 237, they are great in it!!! So there is no rule of thumb, but guess and try (with some luck too)

Regarding the ideal hFE, I believe 108s have too much gain, and "squeal" at max gain (at least some I had did). I measured my bc237, they're about half the hFE  value of a typical 108, and sound better.

[deadastronaut]

hi yeah ive read the geofex stuff..informative thanks rg..

i laid out all my transistors about 30...and read them all put em in matching pairs etc...

lowest being 112 and highest 221...can hear the difference in clean and gritty with lower and higher ones....will persevere with it....


cheers rob.