lets take an idea here.  we all build pedals. right.? if not all at least some.

we all like this or we woudlnt' be here.  but lets face it some of us are better than others at different things.

some of us are good at designing.
some of us are good at pcb's drawing and physically making them
some of us are good at wiring.
some of us are good at drilling.
some of us are good at painting and labeling.

now obvious this could go on and on and on . but heres my point.  
i can solder a pcb in no time flat i can design all sorts of crazy wacked out stuf..  ask anyone here who knows me.  and i can use a drill press.

ask me to paint and i will run screaming.   not that i can't do it  i just don't excel in all the prep work.

some of us can etch a pcb in a heartbeat.  not me. i have only had one turn out decent.  

so heres the deal.  lets start a diy sharecropping.

for instance.  lets put up a poll on what to make.  for instance lets say i want an obsidian.   <duh we all saw that. coming>  
i buy all the parts and i email say..  Derek. and send him the stuff for a board. he makes a board and sends it back i can now wire up my pedal.  

now i need it painted.  lets say i call upon   ERiK mILLer.  and he paints this for me.

now in the meantime.  derek calls me and says hey i want an effect that will do this this and this. with this type of switch.   so i go and hit the drawing board and make up something and email it to him.  
so now he does a layout and a board for himself.  

meanwhile erik finishes my pedal graphics. and ships it to me along with a note that says he needs 5 or more boards wired up pronto for his pedal that he is selling.  
so i get in there and wire up his boards for him and get them in the mail.
now derek needs a snazzy paint job. so he calls up erik.  to which eric replys i need some more pcb's?


Now the people i just pulled randomly out of the air. mainly cause after seeing eriks silk screen rig and the quality work there i think he is good at this.  there maybe more but i am just throwing out hypothesis.  

and derek, well what can i say he is the man..  can do a layout like no ones buisiness and fit things on the back of a quarter that just aint natural.  

what i need to know from the rest of the diy forum is this.. do you think we should do this???    and if so what are each of yous attributes.

the way i see it is this.  we could actually sell alot of stuff on the web plus we all get quality pedals that make any stock unit look dull and useless.

we would all be equal in this.  hey if you make pcb's you are as equal as the guy doing demo clips for products we are selling.  and just as equal as the person soldering or painting.   and since we all pay for our own parts individually we dont' have to worry about splitting anything up.

what do ya think..  and sorry for the long post.

DAMN!  If only I had any viable skills!  I can draw, but as far as getting that on the pedal... Im screwed.

not nesecary..  everyone can do something.   can you play.  you could do soundclips ..  do you have access to a website. you could host pics and clips.  do you have an ebay account you could sell for us.  do you have spare time to keep trakc of all this.  see there is plenty for al to go around

This sounds kinda complicated, but I am into the idea of one-on-one service bartering/selling.

Anyone who likes my screening rig, well, I can make as many of them as I want on the table saw. You make your own screen(s) or have them made, and I can build the thing with the hinges that it clamps to. All I need to have are the outside dimensions of your screen frame and the exact height of the boxes you want to screen with it.

The things I can do here are drilling, painting, and screening boxes, designing, etching, and drilling PCB's, and the final mechanical and electronic assembly of the pedal.

At present, my designs are close derivations or homages. If I want to do something really original, I either need to learn more or enlist someone else's help.

see that is what i am driving at..  everyone should still look into doing it themselves but also remmber the food chain.. i guess you could say of diy

I'd love to be part of some colaboraion as a designer, both pdf's as the way the pedals look (be sure to check out my Highway 89 when it is finished !)

But Ansil, you are 'almost' talking about the co-op. How would you feel about that?

That's exactly the philosophy of my web http://www.pisotones.com

Rubén does the box machining, drilling and painting
Miguel does all the PCB work
I do the electronics and assembly

We all do the web and share costs... resulting in three samples of each project  :wink:

Sometimes Miguel and I interchange roles but none of us can do the beautiful cases that only Ruben can do.

Manolo-That's really cool.

I think the main problem would be sending them out.  Commonsound is SORTA like this, right?

I suppose it would work well if one person make the boxes, drilled holes and paintjob and all... then sent maybe 20 of them to another guy, who put 20 PC boards, who sends it to another person, who puts the electronics on, who sends it back to the box person, who assembles it.... then we sell them.

-Colin

Yes, but we do not sell them... it's just for fun.

I have to admit that this method is a bit slow. Miguel and Ruben live a few squares from each other... but about 2500Km  :shock: from me  :roll:

maybe we should set a fake "money" system where i might pay someone $2 to make a pcb and $5 to paint my box, but they would be more like iou's...  if i get both done and i owe $7 to the group... i sell stuff on ebay and do something else then i'm even... just recycle stuff.... i don't know that idea might suck.... :roll:

i love the collaborative idea. i just wish i had more to offer.

i can drill and spray boxes, that's about it.

Sounds like a good incentive, but maybe somewhat hard to realize... I think that if you're living maybe 2 or three states from each other it wouldn't be a problem. I live in holland and if I was the best solder person around and Ansil asked me to solder 20 PCB's, it'd take a week for the boards to arrive, then say a weekend to populate & solder the boards, then another week to get back to Ansil. That's 3 weeks to solder up a few PCBs!

It all depends where you are I guess...

But I like the idea  :twisted:

i think if we really get our heads together we can get it done.   also it doesn't have to be for profit either. i like the idea of just doing it for diy reasons.. how about we put a poll up on say 10 pedals.  and the winner of the poll  ie what ever pedal it maybe we will all throw in and make some.

That idea would work. On the thought of the large group co-op you would have to set up a chain and keep it going in some type of organization. #1 each one would have to be a little patient with the next guy in line #2 every one would have to mutualy agree that his work or anyone else is not less or more than the next guy, saying that, everyone has an equal share no matter what they do.#3 if you can agree on that then the finish products would have to be set in someones possesion[for e-bay] , personal marketing in there city etc. whereever the merchandise would move. #4 I had an after thought on the equal share part the possible exception would be to set an perc. hike [pre-set by the group and agreed upon by the group  for original circuits ideas only unless they relinguished control on behalf of the greater part of the group upon which case it would return to equal partnership. If you can agree on that you can even break the big group down into sub. groups which might simply the matter even more. .......One more question ,once the money has been made who is going to be trustworthy enough to handle it [ or maybe upon every one consent there could be one hell of a large order placed to smallbear for parts to simply supply the parts to support our diy addiction. Ey it could happen.

Posted: Sat Dec 13, 2003 3:42 am    Post subject: co-ops

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That idea would work. On the thought of the large group co-op you would have to set up a chain and keep it going in some type of organization. #1 each one would have to be a little patient with the next guy in line #2 every one would have to mutualy agree that his work or anyone else is not less or more than the next guy, saying that, everyone has an equal share no matter what they do.#3 if you can agree on that then the finish products would have to be set in someones possesion[for e-bay] , personal marketing in there city etc. whereever the merchandise would move. #4 I had an after thought on the equal share part the possible exception would be to set an perc. hike [pre-set by the group and agreed upon by the group for original circuits ideas only unless they relinguished control on behalf of the greater part of the group upon which case it would return to equal partnership. If you can agree on that you can even break the big group down into sub. groups which might simply the matter even more. .......One more question ,once the money has been made who is going to be trustworthy enough to handle it [ or maybe upon every one consent there could be one hell of a large order placed to smallbear for parts to simply supply the parts to support our diy addiction. Ey it could happen.  


Ansil Posted: Sat Dec 13, 2003 12:54 am    Post subject:  

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Sorry i am new here but ...............what do you think about giving the money to aron or at least give him a % for all his efforts on this diy board..   what about a poll to see who holds the money. ??

should be easy e'nough to write a simple web application to set up some type of 'barter dollars' banking system...

every registered user has an 'account'.. they get 'barter dollars' for doing work, and spend them to have work done..  
think of it in terms of Paypal..   as an example..

Ansil wants a custom-made diamond-plate enclosure like the one I made..  so I make him one..  it costs me 20 bucks in time & materials.. so I put in that I did 20 'barter dollars' of work for Ansil..  he accepts this 'payment' and now I have 20 imaginary dollars in my account...  which I can then use to 'pay' for a nice wiring job, or PCB, etc...

Initially - it will be a little wierd, but barter systems always are... once they get moving, they work well.
"-)

i like that idea.