PCB and 'resist ink pen' induced nausea

[Somicide]

I found this pcb kit at Radioshack, and having 15 extra dollars i bought it (its hard to come by supplies here, for the board anyway).  I did manage to hide some transistors in the box (I felt they owed me for charging that much for some etchant, copper, and a sharpie), so my pedal is well on its way, buy maaan, is it ever difficult to transfer by hand; I think I'll get some carbon paper or do a photo paper transfer with turpentine, but yeah, any one else have sharpie to copper type troubles or am i the odd one out?

[Ge_Whiz]

No; god is punishing you for your misdeeds. Go back to the shop, apologise and pay for the transistors, and it will all work perfectly. No, really.  :lol:

[Marek]

Not that I want to be an accomplice in a theft or something...  :-)

Here is how the "marker-2-copper"  (this would be a nice marketing slogan, wouldn't it :-)  technique can be used:

http://wind.prohosting.com/tpabap/od1.html

But, I mean, ... to steal transistors from a shop??? Are you also into stealing chewing gums? I mean, it pays just as well as stealing transistors.   :roll:

OTOH, 15 $ for such a set... Why did you buy a set, when you can buy all those things separately, in quantities you really need? Nevermind. Good luck with your new project, but remember:  
"Oteto - prokleto!"  ( grabbed - damned ) :-)

Regards,
Marek

[Maneco]

Hi,
1-do a laser print of the layout
2-tape it to the clean board (clean,clean,clean)
3-with a piece of cotton soaked in thinner,rub the back of the paper with the laser print.
4-after some time,the toner will stick to the copper
5-peel the paper
6-you'll have to do maaaaaany corrections with your sharpie
7-etch

or

http://www.pablin.com.ar/electron/trucos/placaci/index.htm

good luck

Maneco

[Ansil]

I found this pcb kit at Radioshack, and having 15 extra dollars i bought it (its hard to come by supplies here, for the board anyway).  I did manage to hide some transistors in the box (I felt they owed me for charging that much for some etchant, copper, and a sharpie), so my pedal is well on its way, buy maaan, is it ever difficult to transfer by hand; I think I'll get some carbon paper or do a photo paper transfer with turpentine, but yeah, any one else have sharpie to copper type troubles or am i the odd one out?

not to judge but if you get labled a thief now it will follow you. like a pack of ravaging hell beasts.  just thought i would drop that in there cause i know what it is like to be innocent and accused

[Paul Perry (Frostwave)]

thanks for that photo essay link, Maneco!
It's the first time anyone has suggested that actually roughening the board will help the toner to stick. Plus, I thin that using paper (instead of plastic, like PnP) will stop the toner smudging around.
The mystery PCB? I don't know, but that odd 'loop' might be part of a near-field RF leakage detector for microwaves!!

[bobbletrox]

why not just use pre-sensitized PCBs and transparencies?

[Boofhead]

The mystery PCB? I don't know, but that odd 'loop' might be part of a near-field RF leakage detector for microwaves!!

Looks like a car alarm remote.

[Somicide]

Ge Whiz - No offense, but I don't exactly believe in this 'God,' and don't appreciate being preached at; i get forced to church enough.

Maneco - Thanks, the instructions in the kit are a bit akward, and no other place has put them in simple terms.

[ExpAnonColin]

Hi,
1-do a laser print of the layout
2-tape it to the clean board (clean,clean,clean)
3-with a piece of cotton soaked in thinner,rub the back of the paper with the laser print.
4-after some time,the toner will stick to the copper
5-peel the paper
6-you'll have to do maaaaaany corrections with your sharpie
7-etch

or

http://www.pablin.com.ar/electron/trucos/placaci/index.htm

good luck

Maneco

:shock:  :shock:  :shock:

That's awesome!  I had no idea I could do that!  I'm SO making my own PCBs now!  THANK YOU!

-Colin

[bobbletrox]

Ge Whiz - No offense, but I don't exactly believe in this 'God,' and don't appreciate being preached at; i get forced to church enough.

It's just bad karma!

[downweverything]

now consider me totally boring and archaic but i just take the layout print it on paper, scotch tape it to the copperside.  drill the holes where they go, take the paper off and connect the dots with the sharpie.  drop in etchant.  seems to take about the same time and trouble to me.  and for most stompbox stuff its fine.  of course doing this with super large layouts is a pain, but makes one offs easy with no special parts, bulbs, paper, or a laser printer.  and it gives a unique and artistic result.  i used to photo etch and press and peel all the time, now im back to this.  weird how things go full circle.  i even just did my acoustic 360 like this and thats a decent sized board.

[bobbletrox]

Hey...that's not a bad idea!  I might give that a go next time.

[Somicide]

hell, I'm on the karma payment plan, hah.

[smallbearelec]

The worst thing about that RS PCB kit (beyond the poor quality of the board material they provide) is that they give you a 1/16" drill bit--way too big! I will have several more sizes of "wire number" drill bits in the Tool Crib when I re-open on 1/12. Beyond that, I will give time this year to putting together the "correct" PCB-making kit that I have long promised.

It really is happening...just takes a while.

Regards
Steve D

[Paul Marossy]

I have used about four of those RS PCB kits. I always roughen up the boards to get them clean and to provide a good surface for my "iron-on transfer", which is just a piece of paper that has the PCB layout printed on it. I iron it on using a fair amount of pressure. My only objective is to get the layout on the copper to go over with the pen. Before the pen, it's not good enough to etch at this point. Now I go over that with the "etch resist pen" (Sharpie fine point marker), which really controls how it will etch. The trick is getting enough of the marker on the copper so that the etchant doesn't get through it. That means really plastering it on there. If you can see any hint of the copper below, it's probably not heavy enough. The other trick is to heat the etchant and agitate it a little bit so that it etches quickly. The longer it sits in there, the more chance it has to etch places you don't want it to.

I have used this method for dozens of PCBs and never have had one turn out bad. These kits can be used effectively if you use a little care.

The one negative thing about the RS kits is that the new ones seem to use a different type of PCB, which doesn't seem to etch as well as the older types they used to put in the kits. Well, they are kinda expensive, too. And, uh, the huge drill bit...

[Somicide]

Yeah, that huge drill bit is a pain, thank goodness i have huuuge leads on my components, and no ics to worry about.  I supersized those babies.

[troubledtom]

hey Somicide,
    it's not cool to steal, and friends on the forum are a trusting sort . that's why they share their ideas . most of the friends i have met thru the forum i'd let stay at my place or visit . it just makes your friends nervous when they KNOW YOU STEAL.
     i HATE THE RAT SHACK, but that's as far as it goes. you can flame me if you want. but it's not the cool or smart thing to do.
          i wish you all the best................  you can call me an asshole but you'll never have any luck calling me a thief and/or a liar.
          peace to ALL the pedalpals,
                       - tom

[javacody]

I agree with Tom. I don't consider it preaching either. I consider it friendly advice. You weren't even stealing to give to the poor. You were stealing for your own benefit. Stealing is wrong in just about every culture/religion on this planet.

In a free economy, a business offers you goods or services at a price. You can do three things:

1. walk away
2. pay
3. barter

STEALING IS WRONG. How can you argue with that?

[Brian Marshall]

yeah,  i was dumb enough to use that 1/16th drill bit.  I ended up using about half a ton of solder on the last board i made to get things to stick.  

Hopefully my order gets here soon from you steve.